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Re: You do realize she drew her own (false but firm) conclusions based on a dearth of data. Again. fionwe1987 Send a noteboard - 14/05/2012 04:08:11 AM
You do realize that if Gawyn had done as Egwene asked and not interfered right from the beginning, the first Bloodknife would have been caught in Egwene's warding, and she would have known Seanchan soldiers were still in the Tower, right? Instead, she got a garbled story about an assassin clothed in shadow...

So it is Gawyns fault she jumped to a false conclusion?

Definitely. She had no way of assuming the existence of ter'angreal wielding kamikaze Seanchan before the point when Gawyn interrupted one. When did do so, all he could provide was a description that matched exactly how Mesaana was seen disguised in TAR, and pointed most obviously to a channeler.
Is anything ever Egwenes fault?

Lots of things are. For example, letting her pique with Siuan preventing her from fully debriefing Siuan on what happened when they came into the WT to rescue her. While Siuan herself should definitely have mentioned the Bloodknife, I hold Egwene equally responsible for not asking for all the facts.

It is also Egwene's fault that she ever let Gawyn hang around and distracted her from her task. The moment she saw that he was not ready to accept her as things stood, she should have asked him to take time off in Andor to consider things. By dithering and letting her feelings come in the way, she lost a precious opportunity to identify threats to her and other AS.

I could go on. Egwene is far from perfect.

Say we go with your premise: Her warding captures the first Bloodknife, his colleagues do not stick a knife in him on the spot to keep him silent

What colleagues? There was only one Bloodknife that first time, and Egwene was nearby to apprehend him as soon as her wards went off.

(as (probably) Sheriam did with the Gray Man in the Tower during Egwenes first residence) and the Tower takes him prisoner. Assuming he does not have and use a suicide pill,

This is supposed to be a magical, mind controlled pill that will enter his system even though he's bound hand and foot and hanging from the air, right? Okay...
are you asking me to believe she could and would break sufficiently break him with interrogation to reveal there were still others lose in the Tower? Or is it more likely that his capture would simply convince her he was a lone wolf, a straggler from the previous raid who did not make it out when the others fled?

Of course she could have broken him. Remember the Chair of Remorse? And Egwene actually is a master of TAR, so she would have been able to use it even better, playing up the Bloodknife's own fears.

Also, the capture of this guy would definitely have made Siuan speak up. If there can be two...

After all, Egwene still thinks that raid was a fullscale assault (which is why the ACTUAL assault will almost certainly catch her completely by surprise and unprepared.)

And here again we have your total disregard of the facts at hand. For a guy excoriating a character for supposed biases and lack of logic, you show an astounding lack of care with your own statements...

Egwene faintly heard screaming as the to'raken swept past. Terrified screaming. It wasn't a full-scale attack—it was a raid! A raid to capture marath'damane!

She hesitated. Chances were good that the Seanchan had Traveling now. Nobody was safe from them, no matter how far or close they might be.


You clearly skip over parts where Egwene shows that she is capable, logical, and insightful. Without the context of these moments, you then construct a picture of the character that suits your biases, and stick to it, ignoring all evidence that exists in the very books to the contrary. Its ironic how the very flaws your wrongly accuse Egwene of possessing are so blatantly evident in your own thought process.
The problem with expecting her to react rationally and logically if Gawyn did not interfere is that its belied by her habit of reacting irrationally and illogically on that and so many other occasions. She KNOWS she screwed up with Gawyn, both in behaving in a way that drove him away and in forbidding him (essentially) to save her life, errors so grave they almost killed BOTH of them. Do not hold your breath expecting her to admit either to him though; she has the benefit of "Amyrlin Infallibility." Or maybe just "Egwene Infallibility;" previous Amyrlins have repeatedly and indisputably erred, but THEY were not Egwene. :P

Substitute your name with Egwene's here and you'd have hit the mark quite closely.
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The cover for A Memory of Light is revealed. - 03/05/2012 03:52:14 PM 5021 Views
It's pretty damn cool. - 03/05/2012 03:59:36 PM 2670 Views
Re: The cover for A Memory of Light is revealed. - 03/05/2012 04:08:09 PM 2797 Views
Re: The cover for A Memory of Light is revealed. - 03/05/2012 04:17:19 PM 2774 Views
the pit of doom is hot - 12/06/2012 01:57:18 AM 2269 Views
I think I like Callandor from TDR better.. - 03/05/2012 04:26:42 PM 2823 Views
yes. I sincerely doubt she has that kind of competency - 03/05/2012 05:52:22 PM 2684 Views
Re: I think I like Callandor from TDR better.. - 04/05/2012 11:10:49 AM 2536 Views
Heh - Cannoli-baiting *NM* - 04/05/2012 04:46:51 PM 1988 Views
*NM* - 05/05/2012 09:04:15 PM 1908 Views
Re: The cover for A Memory of Light is revealed. - 03/05/2012 05:06:19 PM 2436 Views
I really like it - 03/05/2012 05:54:51 PM 2720 Views
The sword grip is not akward or wrong - 03/05/2012 06:20:54 PM 2451 Views
something like this? - 03/05/2012 06:46:59 PM 3037 Views
Its the sword thats not a sword (its a night light!) - 04/05/2012 04:47:27 PM 2452 Views
oh no fair enough! like i said, I just think it looks a little awkward. - 04/05/2012 10:04:21 PM 2411 Views
Me, too! - 12/05/2012 01:18:06 AM 2517 Views
Well... - 03/05/2012 06:09:51 PM 2817 Views
I think it is EG and Nyn - 03/05/2012 06:24:13 PM 2512 Views
Pretty sure it's Mo and Nyn - 03/05/2012 06:40:49 PM 2550 Views
Yeah... - 03/05/2012 07:55:32 PM 2465 Views
when did Nynaeve cut her hair? - 08/05/2012 07:33:04 PM 4054 Views
It was burned off during her testing for the shawl. - 12/06/2012 02:53:43 AM 3210 Views
Egwene is a distinct possibility... - 03/05/2012 11:37:48 PM 2599 Views
She is - 04/05/2012 12:15:21 AM 2704 Views
I don't know... - 04/05/2012 12:25:53 AM 2421 Views
Re: I don't know... - 04/05/2012 02:47:02 AM 2614 Views
I'm not disagreeing with most of that... - 08/05/2012 02:58:53 AM 2309 Views
"You expect me to wise up?" "No, Egwene, I expect you to DIE!" - 11/05/2012 01:36:09 AM 2530 Views
What books have you been reading? - 11/05/2012 01:57:31 AM 2560 Views
I agree - 11/05/2012 02:51:38 PM 2666 Views
The other quotes you requested, as promised. - 13/05/2012 03:29:41 AM 2621 Views
You misinterpreting quotes is hardly worth requoting... - 13/05/2012 11:36:21 AM 2320 Views
Agreed - 13/05/2012 03:39:12 PM 2427 Views
Exactly... - 13/05/2012 05:53:17 PM 2385 Views
Never said she was evil, just wrong. Horribly and tragically wrong. - 14/05/2012 02:34:27 AM 2418 Views
- 14/05/2012 04:23:21 AM 2348 Views
Re- - 21/05/2012 02:43:49 AM 2823 Views
Principle protagonists can still experience epic falls. - 14/05/2012 02:21:42 AM 2426 Views
Then she wouldn't be a "protagonist" - 14/05/2012 04:38:34 AM 2367 Views
Again, I never said she is or will become evil. - 21/05/2012 03:03:32 AM 2532 Views
Re: Principle protagonists can still experience epic falls. - 14/05/2012 08:32:50 AM 2479 Views
Re: Principle protagonists can still experience epic falls. - 21/05/2012 03:28:48 AM 2313 Views
For the most part, very little interpretation was required. - 14/05/2012 01:58:26 AM 2506 Views
Re: For the most part, very little interpretation was required. - 14/05/2012 03:51:31 AM 2724 Views
Re: For the most part, very little interpretation was required. - 14/05/2012 06:41:32 AM 2494 Views
Yeah... - 14/05/2012 07:47:16 AM 2507 Views
Re: Yeah... - 14/05/2012 04:40:49 PM 2542 Views
Re: For the most part, very little interpretation was required. - 21/05/2012 06:21:48 AM 2458 Views
Look at their foreheads - 16/05/2012 08:38:51 AM 2556 Views
Re: I think it is EG and Nyn - 03/05/2012 07:38:36 PM 2508 Views
I vote for Nynaeve and Moiraine too - 03/05/2012 09:05:58 PM 2341 Views
Re: I vote for Nynaeve and Moiraine too - 03/05/2012 11:28:42 PM 2494 Views
Idea - 04/05/2012 10:11:05 AM 2486 Views
Re: Idea - 04/05/2012 12:09:17 PM 2471 Views
Or.... - 04/05/2012 12:19:16 PM 2361 Views
This would explain the hidden hand - 04/05/2012 08:54:00 PM 2502 Views
That's a good point. - 04/05/2012 08:59:41 PM 2633 Views
Nah... - 07/05/2012 01:56:13 PM 2554 Views
Can you draw a blade - 08/05/2012 06:00:28 AM 2482 Views
It depens on the construction of the scabbard - 10/05/2012 01:36:30 PM 2399 Views
Re: I vote for Nynaeve and Moiraine too - 04/05/2012 02:49:51 PM 1562 Views
Re: I vote for Nynaeve and Moiraine too - 04/05/2012 07:42:12 PM 2598 Views
Re: I vote for Nynaeve and Moiraine too - 07/05/2012 08:02:26 PM 2380 Views
Re: I vote for Nynaeve and Moiraine too - 07/05/2012 09:32:45 PM 2620 Views
Thanks! *NM* - 13/05/2012 10:56:06 AM 2351 Views
I actually found the champion/politician split between parallels very convincing. - 11/05/2012 01:35:34 PM 2499 Views
Re: I actually found the champion/politician split between parallels very convincing. - 11/05/2012 04:06:50 PM 2286 Views
Egwene-Mat... - 11/05/2012 09:05:07 PM 2393 Views
Re: Egwene-Mat... - 12/05/2012 05:31:29 AM 2718 Views
Egwenes problem is her knack for seeing the error of her ways without ever LEARNING it. - 13/05/2012 04:57:27 AM 2675 Views
The Seanchan assassin... - 13/05/2012 11:47:53 AM 2315 Views
You do realize she drew her own (false but firm) conclusions based on a dearth of data. Again. - 14/05/2012 02:08:26 AM 2359 Views
Re: You do realize she drew her own (false but firm) conclusions based on a dearth of data. Again. - 14/05/2012 04:08:11 AM 2399 Views
Re: The cover for A Memory of Light is revealed. - 03/05/2012 07:25:37 PM 2357 Views
Re: The cover for A Memory of Light is revealed. - 03/05/2012 07:36:09 PM 2486 Views
It's his left hand Rand lost *NM* - 03/05/2012 08:00:01 PM 1930 Views
Thanks for the imput! *NM* - 03/05/2012 08:24:59 PM 2302 Views
I does not look like Nynaeve and Moiraine - 03/05/2012 11:39:01 PM 2429 Views
Nynaeve has cut her braid and has her hair shoulder length in TOM.... - 03/05/2012 11:44:50 PM 2581 Views
Re: Nynaeve has cut her braid and has her hair shoulder length in TOM.... - 03/05/2012 11:51:02 PM 3412 Views
Am I the only one who sees the red dot in her forehead? *NM* - 09/05/2012 08:36:53 PM 1962 Views
looks *$%$%*@ great *NM* - 04/05/2012 02:47:00 AM 2040 Views
i quite like it! as far as the women go... - 04/05/2012 06:38:10 PM 2568 Views
No Maidens of the Spear - 05/05/2012 05:09:27 PM 2552 Views
Re: No Maidens of the Spear - 07/05/2012 02:02:36 PM 2663 Views
nynaeve with no braid?.... are we sure its not egwene? or did no one tell him the hairstyles? *NM* - 08/05/2012 06:48:49 PM 1843 Views
Nyn cut her braid off. *NM* - 08/05/2012 06:55:02 PM 2089 Views
I thought it was burned off during her test for Aes Sedaihood. *NM* - 08/05/2012 07:25:51 PM 951 Views
I don't remember this at all *NM* - 08/05/2012 07:51:04 PM 2079 Views
Regarding the identities of the women on the back: - 09/05/2012 08:52:47 PM 2684 Views
What the hell is on the ground close to the bottom edge of the picture? *NM* - 10/05/2012 05:55:07 AM 2016 Views
A misplaced logo? *NM* - 10/05/2012 08:24:52 AM 1953 Views
Possibly one of the Seals? - 11/05/2012 01:42:13 AM 2465 Views
agreed - 10/05/2012 07:16:39 AM 2544 Views
Partially concur - 10/05/2012 01:17:31 PM 2324 Views
She's in the Pit of F*ing Doom. Ben Stein would be excited *NM* - 12/05/2012 04:22:44 AM 904 Views
i agree with the big about how Moiraine should be depicted - 12/05/2012 11:04:53 PM 1398 Views
you can see a second weapon in Rand's belt too - 13/05/2012 08:51:34 PM 1356 Views
That looks pretty cool, better than most of the other WoT covers - 26/06/2012 07:37:29 AM 1178 Views

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