Re: I think she did an admirable job protecting Andor in very challenging circumstances. - Edit 2
Before modification by DomA at 11/05/2012 02:24:31 AM
but the only alternative not even more compromised is Ellorien, who supports Elayne as firmly as she opposed all suggestions she take the throne herself.
Ellorien is the High Seat now sitting on her butt in her lands sulking because House Trakand has managed to keep the throne.
it seemed that Elayne’s first real violation was one of those things that cannot be helped – she used her authority as an Aes Sedai to give permission for the combined armies of the Borderlands to pass through Andor, despite it being made explicitly clear that she had no authority to do so deriving from any Andoran law or practice.
Nor did she have any authority to do this as Aes Sedai. It's got strictly nothing to do with that.
She presented herself as Aes Sedai merely to drive the point to the rulers they were not having nor ever had (as in "this is our secret"
a conversation with the High Seat of House Trakand to make a deal to pass through Andor peacefully while she would use their presence to rally the Houses behind her then convince them to let the Bordermen pass unhindered (as they puzzled out immediately was her motive for making this deal). It was political suicide for Elayne, if the other Houses ever found proof of what she did. She didn't commit treason, she just hatched a plot to manipulate her rivals into making her Queen using foreign armies the other Houses would never have forgiven her. On the day she took the throne, she simply said in her opinion the Bordermen were simply passing through and that was it. Lord Pelivar suspected what she did, but at that point he saw it as evidence she could rule Andor. Presenting herself as AS, letting the rulers know she couldn't possibly be talking to them as High Seat, was simply Elayne's garantee to them that she would hold her part of the deal, because if she failed to keep the Andorans under control, or if she betrayed them, they simply had to send an envoy to any army coming at them to reveal this and destroy her House.
The only other reason she presented herself as Aes Sedai, and spoke as unambiguously as circumstances allowed, was because they would believe she spoke under the first Oath.
Practically and technically, Elayne could not prevent an invasion (and thus, technically, act of war,) that had already occurred long before anyone in Caemlyn knew of it: Her task was to prevent an OCCUPATION and de facto war, then hasten a withdrawal.
This is a complete misreading of what happened. The Borderlanders had stopped about fifty miles north of any territory claimed by Andor and stayed there long enough to suggest right away to Elayne their intentions were either not hostile or not hostile to Andor itself.
When they started their expedition, they believe Rand to be ruling in Caemlyn. They came with such an army which they passed through unclaimed territory in case they had no choice as he failed to meet the requirement of the Foretelling and they had to go to war against him to neutralize and kill him. They found out (through scouts, no doubt) Rand had left, and they set up camp well away from the Andoran border while they figured out what to do since the situation had evolved in ways totally unexpected originally, and the power vaccuum in Andor because of the Succession left them with no option to negotiate passage with any authority. So they waited, despite the winter finally coming.
Their presence was spotted and reported in Caemlyn, and Elayne decided she would meet them, half to figure out what they could possibly be doing there as that they could mean to invade Andor was inconceivable to her (though that they might mean to deal with the BT/Taim crossed her mind), and in part because she saw a possible opportunity to exploit there to win the throne. The possibility they might be a threat was in her mind, but went not much further than her knowledge of the culture and history of Andor that made her fear in the current absence of any Queen how Andoran lords might choose to react to their presence - starting a war, but this only concretized when she learned they were looking for Rand and might fight in Andor if free passage was denied, which in the civil war situation was indeed potentially explosive.
Your rather ironic error here is in treating the spiritual city-state of Tar Valon as a "foreign power" rather than what it actually is: Along with the Whitecloaks, the closest thing Randland has to a church, which only INCIDENTALLY acquired temporal power to serve its spiritual and socio-political ends.
You're completely wrong about this. The WT is is not comparable to "a church", even though some of its organs or traditions were derived in part, among many other things like the Venetian oligarchy, from temporal aspects of the medieval Catholic Church, the inner workings of abbeys like Cluny - but totally stripped of their spiritual aspects.
WOT on the Light side has no revealed religion, and no organized church nor temples, no spiritual power except for those who (to an extent) falsely claim one like the WC (or Masema), and falsely assign one to the WT as a bunch of organized heretics they claim use a Power the Creator never meant to be touched. They have no divine revelation on which to base such claims, however - their faith is based on the writings of a philosopher-soldier they later elevated to something akin to a prophet. The closest WOT has to a church was the Dome of Truth in Amador, the closest to a spiritual organization is the WC, but they are fairly far from an organized religion, in the strict sense.
The only group really claiming spiritual power in the series is the Shadow. The Light (aside again from fanatics like the WC) claims none, because they believe the Creator made the Wheel to weave the pattern and removed himself from the fate of Creation. By those beliefs, there can't be any spiritual power.
TV hasn't nor claims to have any kind of spiritual power of any kind. They oppose the Shadow, like all the nations and groups claim to do, but they never preach the light or grant themselves any spiritual insight from wielding the force they believe runs the universe, nor do they even claim to oppose the Shadow in the Creator's name or following his will. The Aes Sedai's claims to power are based on FORCE and pragmatism. They are the only force that can stand against the Dark One, because they wield the One Power, therefore the world should follow their lead. They are the only FORCE that can deal with male channelers who could destroy the world, therefore they must be allowed to act freely and unhindered anywhere in the world. They are the only ones who managed to remain a stable bullwark on the continent since the Breaking, have assembled the greatest depository of knowledge, have the best scholars, therefore the nations should listen to their political wisdom. They believe in promoting and preserving unity against the Light, claim political neutrality, thus pragmatically push rulers to listen to their advisors, and never hesitate to meddle in situations that they believe threaten stability.
They make no spiritual claim whatsoever, beside allegiance to the Light and vows to fight the Shadow at the LB, which can be said of any other nation. They claim political neutrality, which nobody really believes.
They are not a real supranational entity, because many nations deny them that status. Tar Valon is a city-state - the remnant of a much larger territory, ruled by an oligarchy with at its head a woman who has all the powers and trappings of a monarch.
Their power and influence were once much greater, because the nations in part feared them more (that they were a toothless wolf had not yet been proven), and in part because the dangers of the Shadow and male channelers were less diffused the closer to the Breaking/WOS you go, or later the Trolloc Wars. Their power has declined since the fall of the Second Covenant, until it went through a sharp decline after Artur Hawkwing simply rounded them all up in Tar Valon and assieged the city for twenty years - they've never really recuperated from that blow. After that the nations of the South were more or less openly anti-AS and more and more immune to their political bullying, an military group of fanatics answering to no one but themselves prospered unhindered. Andor made an alliance with TV for its own motive, Mayene remained close to TV as a counterweight against Tear and its culture of fearing channelers, while the Borderlands remained supportive of TV because the perception of the threat of the Shadow and the need for the AS's power when it comes is far sharper and immediate in the north.
an international organization with members at senior levels of every government except Amadicia.
They are not an "international organization", they're an oligarchy with members from all the nations they push to abandon all allegiance to the land of their birth.
No Aes Sedai is at "senior level" in any government except in Andor before Elaida was recalled. The AS elsewhere are essentially diplomats whose only allegiance is to Tar Valon, meddling in the internal affairs of the nations they are assigned to. The rulers tolerate them, for the most part, except in the South. Tarabon, Amadicia, Altara, Illian, Tear and Far Madding didn't even have an Aes Sedai "advisor".
Meanwhile, this is not a case of Elayne abandoning Andor to run .
since the White Tower is not competing with Andor for political, military and economic supremacy (i.e. not a "foreign power."
They are a foreign power, just an allied one with professed goals different from the other nations or city-states.
Economically, Tar Valon is no different from the other nations.