Re: I suspect Cadsuane will die before that happens - Edit 1
Before modification by DomA at 30/04/2012 08:44:41 PM
Cadsuane will die before showing up at Rand's side at the Merrilor meeting? The odds are agains that, I would say.
I don't agree that symbolism would work. It has played out and much more meaningful when Egwene pushed Siuan aside, and when she truly took control of the reunited Hall.
Cadsuane as I see her is hardly representative of the "old style" Aes Sedai. She is unique and as atypical as it gets. Romanda, Lelaine, Siuan Sanche are some of the sisters far more representative of the "old style AS". Cadsuane is an older Moiraine or Nynaeve, very excentric and "problematic" to WT standards. She is more experienced than Moiraine and even more Nynaeve, but her thinking isn't more old-fashioned than theirs. She was absolutely right not to treat Nynaeve as a full sister. By forcing Nynaeve to take the test, Egwene proved Cadsuane right. Nynaeve's OP training was lacking in all areas but healing, and she just didn't have the self-control expected of an Aes Sedai. Now she has it - she's grown massively since she's met Cadsuane (I'm not implying she owes it to Cadsuane, but it's been a long time since Nynaeve had a genuine role model to rebel against rather than play the Wisdom)
Though she does have her blind spots for sure, she's doesn't have and old person's attitude or conservatism. She's still razor sharp and isn't afraid of change, and her strength of will is as strong as ever. On a lot of points, the only thing holding her back from going on with her life (eg: taking a new warder and so on) is her own belief that she's very near the end of her life. But that just isn't true. She's but middle-aged if she renounces the Binding.
I'm not saying Cadsuane won't die, but I think the foreshadowing can equally be interpreted in conflicting ways. Mentions of her death have come so often it could be foreshadowing that soon there will be a time when it's no longer just someone thinking she's dead. But in a way, that's weak. Don't forget, barely any(if any) mention of Cadsuane's death are about her dying a hero's death. Nearly all of them are rather forming a "running gag" about the fact she must have died of old age by now. Rand already told her she's not as old as she thinks she is, which came as a shock. It's perfectly possible the "running gag" foreshadows that Cadsuane won't die, that she will have to adjust to the fact she's got half of her life in front of her. What "kills" Cadsuane is to have been in retirement growing flowers. That's not living, to her standards - she can't bear being useless and irrelevant. She looked for any excuse to get back in the action and remain purposeful. I hardly imagine she'll seek to go out in a blaze of glory. She's just not the type, she no doubt had tons of opportunities to play the daredevil and go out as a hero. She's a survivor who calculates the risks she takes and get out of battles alive.
Cadsuane has seen more action and danger than most or all Green sister alive. And yet, she's survived all of that. She is clearly not a daredevil. Heroic yes, but not reckless. She's not Elayne or Alanna. If any Green have good odds of being clear-headed and experienced enough to survive TG if she has no bad luck or circumstances where self-sacrifice would be extremely meaningful, I'd place my bet on Cadsuane.
There's even the distinct possibility that now her role with Rand is done and most of the aftermath of her humbling mistake is dealt with and all, Cadsuane will at last occupy her rightful place, which would be as one of the top field generals of the Green Ajah, not as a foot soldier on the frontline. And we know she's good - she improvised Rand's defense and managed to hold all day against the Forsaken. Her weaves are outclassed, but Cadsuane absorb new knowledged thrown at her without blinking (as I said, she's not a conservative old woman, she adapts to changes really well). There isn't much about Egwene's leadership that Cadsuane wouldn't approve of; what Egwene did to the AS in TGS Cadsuane has wished she could have done to Elaida and the Rebels alike before...
Mat could even well be stuck with Cadsuane in his état-major soon. That would be hilarious and that would be the kind of irony Jordan liked so much, to get Mat stuck with the single most overbearing and strict Aes Sedai of them all, while if Cadsuane thought Rand ill-mannered and uncivil she's really up for a surprise if she ever meets or has to work with Mat...
It's been mentioned enough times that I would be surprised if she survives. In a very real way she represents the Aes Sedai of old ... Seems symbolic to me that she will pass the torch to the new Aes Sedai
I don't agree that symbolism would work. It has played out and much more meaningful when Egwene pushed Siuan aside, and when she truly took control of the reunited Hall.
Cadsuane as I see her is hardly representative of the "old style" Aes Sedai. She is unique and as atypical as it gets. Romanda, Lelaine, Siuan Sanche are some of the sisters far more representative of the "old style AS". Cadsuane is an older Moiraine or Nynaeve, very excentric and "problematic" to WT standards. She is more experienced than Moiraine and even more Nynaeve, but her thinking isn't more old-fashioned than theirs. She was absolutely right not to treat Nynaeve as a full sister. By forcing Nynaeve to take the test, Egwene proved Cadsuane right. Nynaeve's OP training was lacking in all areas but healing, and she just didn't have the self-control expected of an Aes Sedai. Now she has it - she's grown massively since she's met Cadsuane (I'm not implying she owes it to Cadsuane, but it's been a long time since Nynaeve had a genuine role model to rebel against rather than play the Wisdom)
Though she does have her blind spots for sure, she's doesn't have and old person's attitude or conservatism. She's still razor sharp and isn't afraid of change, and her strength of will is as strong as ever. On a lot of points, the only thing holding her back from going on with her life (eg: taking a new warder and so on) is her own belief that she's very near the end of her life. But that just isn't true. She's but middle-aged if she renounces the Binding.
I'm not saying Cadsuane won't die, but I think the foreshadowing can equally be interpreted in conflicting ways. Mentions of her death have come so often it could be foreshadowing that soon there will be a time when it's no longer just someone thinking she's dead. But in a way, that's weak. Don't forget, barely any(if any) mention of Cadsuane's death are about her dying a hero's death. Nearly all of them are rather forming a "running gag" about the fact she must have died of old age by now. Rand already told her she's not as old as she thinks she is, which came as a shock. It's perfectly possible the "running gag" foreshadows that Cadsuane won't die, that she will have to adjust to the fact she's got half of her life in front of her. What "kills" Cadsuane is to have been in retirement growing flowers. That's not living, to her standards - she can't bear being useless and irrelevant. She looked for any excuse to get back in the action and remain purposeful. I hardly imagine she'll seek to go out in a blaze of glory. She's just not the type, she no doubt had tons of opportunities to play the daredevil and go out as a hero. She's a survivor who calculates the risks she takes and get out of battles alive.
Cadsuane has seen more action and danger than most or all Green sister alive. And yet, she's survived all of that. She is clearly not a daredevil. Heroic yes, but not reckless. She's not Elayne or Alanna. If any Green have good odds of being clear-headed and experienced enough to survive TG if she has no bad luck or circumstances where self-sacrifice would be extremely meaningful, I'd place my bet on Cadsuane.
There's even the distinct possibility that now her role with Rand is done and most of the aftermath of her humbling mistake is dealt with and all, Cadsuane will at last occupy her rightful place, which would be as one of the top field generals of the Green Ajah, not as a foot soldier on the frontline. And we know she's good - she improvised Rand's defense and managed to hold all day against the Forsaken. Her weaves are outclassed, but Cadsuane absorb new knowledged thrown at her without blinking (as I said, she's not a conservative old woman, she adapts to changes really well). There isn't much about Egwene's leadership that Cadsuane wouldn't approve of; what Egwene did to the AS in TGS Cadsuane has wished she could have done to Elaida and the Rebels alike before...
Mat could even well be stuck with Cadsuane in his état-major soon. That would be hilarious and that would be the kind of irony Jordan liked so much, to get Mat stuck with the single most overbearing and strict Aes Sedai of them all, while if Cadsuane thought Rand ill-mannered and uncivil she's really up for a surprise if she ever meets or has to work with Mat...