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No... Fanatic-Templar Send a noteboard - 08/04/2012 07:12:22 AM
Mixing with the rest of the world too long.


... I said that by being mostly composed of people who were not bloodline Aiel, they were not Aiel genetically.
I also said that by abandoning their charge, they were not Aiel philosophically.
I said that in those two specific areas, the Tuatha'an could not be considered Aiel. I did not assert that either one of these were what defined an Aiel, nor even that both together were. They were simply the two possibilities that seemed most probable for asserting that the Tuatha'an might count as Aiel for the purpose of the prophecy.

2. I think it is an unclear matter on the true nature of the Aiel. Those who live in the Waste and call themselves Aiel would never have been accepted by their ancestors as they do not follow the Way. Thus the people who wrote the Prophesy could have been speaking of the ideological sense of Aiel rather than some racial sense of the Aiel. Personally I am beginning to believe the Aiel will need to embrace the Way once again to save their remnant of a remnant.


Here's the issue.

First of all, following the Way of the Leaf is not the extent of the ideological definition of the Aiel. Their ideology is one of not only pacifism, but also of servitude, something the Tuatha'an do not follow. The Aiel were servants to the Aes Sedai, servants to the Servants of All. Also, if we look at Rand's visions, it seems that being an Aiel is something hereditary, unless it just happened those ancestors were simply following in the family business. Though that would seem unlikely, as surely some of the Clan Chiefs' or Wise Ones' ancestors did not choose to be Aiel? Or maybe that's where the memories stop, at the first non-Aiel ancestor. Anyway, the Tuatha'an abandoned their duties, that's why I said they were not philosophically Aiel.

But let us go by your definition and replace "the Aiel" by "those who follow the Way of the Leaf" in the prophecy you agreed was correct.

Do you then believe that He Who Comes With The Dawn will destroy "those who follow the Way of the Leaf" except for a remnant of a remnant whom he shall save?
The first rule of being a ninja is "do no harm". Unless you intend to do harm, then do lots of harm.
~Master Splinter

Victorious in Bergioyn's legendary 'Reverse Mafia'. *MySmiley*
This message last edited by Fanatic-Templar on 08/04/2012 at 07:13:31 AM
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Aviendha, the columns, and the Seanchan - 03/04/2012 04:29:31 PM 1951 Views
As far as I understand it, that future is impossible anyway. - 03/04/2012 07:30:52 PM 969 Views
Depends on how one defines Aiel - 04/04/2012 04:11:11 AM 926 Views
There are more than there were before. - 04/04/2012 07:03:27 AM 936 Views
But when the prophesy was made there many followers - 04/04/2012 10:10:54 AM 855 Views
The Tuatha'an are not Aiel. - 04/04/2012 06:28:47 PM 935 Views
Re: The Tuatha'an are not Aiel. - 05/04/2012 01:41:23 AM 1084 Views
Well that more than covers it *NM* - 05/04/2012 04:43:53 AM 451 Views
Re: The Tuatha'an are not Aiel. - 05/04/2012 07:39:04 AM 982 Views
Re: The Tuatha'an are not Aiel. - 05/04/2012 02:14:37 PM 1180 Views
For the record I agree that the visions are not true either - 05/04/2012 02:25:47 PM 922 Views
Re: For the record I agree that the visions are not true either - 05/04/2012 11:36:53 PM 900 Views
Yes, I was thinking of the Aiel's suicidal traditions as well. - 05/04/2012 06:24:56 PM 843 Views
Re: The Tuatha'an are not Aiel. - 06/04/2012 10:51:00 PM 886 Views
Re: The Tuatha'an are not Aiel. - 06/04/2012 10:38:24 PM 1124 Views
Re: The Tuatha'an are not Aiel. - 07/04/2012 06:27:27 AM 836 Views
Re: The Tuatha'an are not Aiel. - 07/04/2012 07:23:03 PM 801 Views
So what you're saying... - 07/04/2012 10:07:59 PM 746 Views
What I am saying is that it's not a "pure bloodline" that makes one an Aiel - 08/04/2012 12:16:10 AM 840 Views
I never said it was. - 08/04/2012 12:43:26 AM 915 Views
Actually you did In your above post you speak of the Tinkers as not Aiel because they have been - 08/04/2012 06:09:01 AM 851 Views
No... - 08/04/2012 07:12:22 AM 956 Views
You have no evidence that the Tuath'an are mostly comprised of runaways etc - 08/04/2012 05:16:54 PM 929 Views
Re: You have no evidence that the Tuath'an are mostly comprised of runaways etc - 08/04/2012 06:43:27 PM 952 Views
Re: You have no evidence that the Tuath'an are mostly comprised of runaways etc - 08/04/2012 07:52:10 PM 743 Views
Thanks for that. - 09/04/2012 02:38:25 AM 671 Views
Red hair is double recessive ... Doesn't take much to eliminate it from the gene pool. There could - 08/04/2012 11:22:36 PM 885 Views
You are consistently making the same mistake. - 09/04/2012 02:45:46 AM 735 Views
They are the same thing. The remnant of a remnant are Aiel - 10/04/2012 05:04:55 AM 884 Views
No. They are not. - 10/04/2012 05:42:29 AM 776 Views
Never said the remnant of the remnant was the whole of the Aiel - 10/04/2012 05:45:47 PM 794 Views
You said that redefining the Aiel would allow Aviendha's vision to be possible. - 10/04/2012 06:53:51 PM 965 Views
No , I said there were many ways to interpret the statement based on how one defines Aiel - 10/04/2012 07:36:11 PM 744 Views
All of which is entirely irrelevant. - 10/04/2012 07:38:29 PM 765 Views
Actually it states he will save a remnant of a remnant - 10/04/2012 07:47:04 PM 830 Views
Re: Actually it states he will save a remnant of a remnant - 11/04/2012 01:40:36 AM 810 Views
That is what I just said - 14/04/2012 01:41:56 AM 778 Views
What is important about that? - 14/04/2012 04:35:55 AM 751 Views
The importance is that the prophesy says that Rand - 14/04/2012 06:06:31 PM 924 Views
So what you're saying is... - 14/04/2012 09:45:36 PM 802 Views
That's exactly it - 14/04/2012 11:21:25 PM 870 Views
Good. - 15/04/2012 02:01:14 AM 894 Views
He sets it in motion, thus his actions lead to it - 15/04/2012 02:55:13 PM 759 Views
Yes, but in that case, he is responsible for everything, ever. - 15/04/2012 05:29:31 PM 862 Views
We are interpreting Prophesy here ... Direct v. Indirect actions are what we are discussing - 15/04/2012 07:21:29 PM 754 Views
Re: We are interpreting Prophesy here ... Direct v. Indirect actions are what we are discussing - 17/04/2012 04:18:32 AM 951 Views
Depends on how you look at the Prophesy - 18/04/2012 01:45:23 PM 708 Views
Of course, but the point of my example was... - 17/04/2012 06:08:09 PM 744 Views
Where are you getting this happens over thousands of years? - 18/04/2012 01:47:42 PM 747 Views
Because that was the important part of that post. - 18/04/2012 05:28:10 PM 873 Views
Don't know when this became about winning - 19/04/2012 02:08:16 AM 661 Views
Re: I never said it was. - 18/04/2012 12:37:23 AM 926 Views
Re: As far as I understand it, that future is impossible anyway. - 04/04/2012 07:16:13 AM 975 Views
Re: As far as I understand it, that future is impossible anyway. - 06/04/2012 10:33:00 PM 859 Views
Thank you for that analysis. *NM* - 17/04/2012 12:36:08 AM 430 Views

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