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Re: No way they could pull off what you are talking about with current tech HyogaRott Send a noteboard - 16/02/2012 03:23:34 PM
They would have to make the iron paper thin in order to make the armor even wearable.

This is actually rather easy, the hard part is thining iron while retaining its strength, but because it is going to be transformed to C, the tensile strength of the base material is not relevant. If you have 2 AS helping, it gets even easier; One floats a 40lb ingot on a bed of air, something virtually every AS can do in tehir sleep, the other uses fire to melt it. The liquid metal spreads and then is cooled. The whole process would take minutes.

Even without using the power, it is not difficult, just takes a bit longer. If you have a blast forge, you can liquify the metal and then pour it to a form, this is called casting, and has been done throughout history, how do you think those goblets were made? Without a hot enough forge, you heat the metal and then roll it between 2 stone cylinders. The only time it is tough is when you are trying to shape it without losing temper, which does not matter with C. The process is not new, only the scale would slow initial startup of production.

Go re-read the section where they are making cuendillar. There are a handful of women that had even the tiniest ability at this and other than bode Leane and Egwene they all struggled to make even small objects. Sure these three could make a bunch of cuendillar armor, but you are over simplifying the process.

Simplifying somewhat, but not as much as you think. The camp AS had 4 women (one was murdered) who could be said were very good at C conversion, but they were only part of the tower (could be wrong but I always thought the rebels were about 25% to 30% of the sisters)this wuold statistically place the total number of sisters who could do the harbor chain transformation at around 20. They are the tip of the bell curve, not the only ones who are capable. 1 harbor chain would equal enough C armor for hundreds, if not thousands (you only need ~30 pounds of iron for C plate armor) of warriors harbor chains are HUGE.

In the AoL they had forgotten war, and then rediscovered it in Spades, by the end of the war they had recreated every aspect and raised it to an art form. I'm certain the concept of cuendillar armor would have occurred to them went hey were creating thing like shock lances and flying machines, yet the soldiers we see in the time clearly did not wear cuendillar.

I could be wrong, but i believe they had shock lances before the war began. I know they had flying vehicles before then, these are not examples of their progress in war. Judging by the Forsaken, the best of the best, they were not all that great as military thinkers. I agreee that they SHOULD be, but we must accept what the books portray them as, and Sun Tzu they are not. Just because they (or the author) did not think of it, does not mean it is not practical.

Funny that you bring up the problems with cuendillar in weaponry having to do with the lack of flexibility ... Armor with flexibility (I.e. Kevlar) would be far more valuable than walking about in something totally inflexible.

Have you ever worn medieval style armor or modern kevlar? Flexibility is NOT something you actually want in armor plate. It something engineered into the material because the designer must have it, to keep the material from breaking. The flexibility actually reduces the pure stopping power of the armor. Non-fantasy materials must have it though, hard=brittle and armor that shatters when stressed past a certain point is a "bad thing". C does not have a "breaking point". It is, by definition, inherantly unbreakable therfore the perfect armor material.

As described by the author, a sheet of C 1 nanometer thick could stop a 30 quatrillion ton projectile moving at relatavistic speeds and be unharmed. If that is not armor, then I do not know what is.

For storytelling purposes, RJ had to limit the use of C in the AoL, otherwise the archeology of the society would still exist. Put yourself into the shoes of a channeler in the AoL. Wouldn't you (over a span of time) convert virtually everything into C in your house so that nothing breaks? All your plates, all you flatware, all the structural elements of your house, Wouldn't you convert the body of your car so that it doesn't get messed up? I would, especially once my daughter started driving...

We have to seperate the storytelling elements from our theoretical extrapolation on the author's framework. I have already stated that I do not actually want C armor introduced into the story in any large way and there had best be a good reason for it to be introduced in even a minor one i.e. Egwene converts Gawyn's shield with a "I should have thought of this before" and he later uses that shield to stop a stream of balefire aimed at her while she is linked to Rand allowing him to seal the bore.
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Functional Cuendillar Armor: Possible or impossible? - 10/02/2012 04:45:34 PM 1401 Views
You posted this exact same question one year ago, with a lot of discussion - 10/02/2012 06:29:28 PM 851 Views
You busted him! I wonder why he would post it again... *NM* - 10/02/2012 07:25:47 PM 453 Views
I suppose I am on a... - 10/02/2012 11:00:47 PM 755 Views
No, you go back and re-read what everyone said. - 11/02/2012 11:02:47 PM 853 Views
We're actually losing them by the troves. My apologies. *NM* - 12/02/2012 02:52:01 AM 415 Views
I rest my case. - 10/05/2012 04:34:02 PM 749 Views
Re: You posted this exact same question one year ago, with a lot of discussion - 11/02/2012 01:37:27 PM 947 Views
Agreed. - 11/02/2012 06:24:36 PM 740 Views
why not some plate armor. duh. *NM* - 12/02/2012 09:54:43 PM 454 Views
See? - 10/05/2012 04:35:25 PM 725 Views
Possible, but hard. - 11/02/2012 01:56:03 AM 848 Views
scale or plate armor would be quite easy *NM* - 11/02/2012 01:38:47 PM 385 Views
My thought was always about weapons. - 11/02/2012 06:31:45 AM 918 Views
Re: My thought was always about weapons. - 12/02/2012 10:51:43 AM 791 Views
Re: My thought was always about weapons. - 14/02/2012 01:53:59 PM 756 Views
Should be perfectly feasible - 11/02/2012 12:28:47 PM 754 Views
Exactly - 11/02/2012 01:53:24 PM 798 Views
Certainly possible, but given the effort most women have to put toward changing even a small item - 12/02/2012 05:10:35 AM 838 Views
Ummm, Warders... - 14/02/2012 01:39:23 PM 683 Views
How would Cuendillar armour help against channelers? - 14/02/2012 07:58:58 PM 751 Views
It can not be directly effected by the OP - 14/02/2012 09:08:57 PM 653 Views
some simple ideas for defeating warders armoured such. - 14/02/2012 09:52:41 PM 791 Views
Re: some simple ideas for defeating warders armoured such. - 14/02/2012 10:54:26 PM 638 Views
which way is it? - 15/02/2012 04:14:41 AM 650 Views
Actually I'd call the Seanchan tactically inferior to the White Tower in using the power - 15/02/2012 01:48:55 PM 766 Views
That's really not my point. - 15/02/2012 03:21:15 PM 642 Views
My point is - 15/02/2012 03:52:43 PM 636 Views
Agree on all points *NM* - 15/02/2012 07:06:09 PM 531 Views
I never said that they could not be stopped - 15/02/2012 01:58:41 PM 744 Views
I really think you're over-estimating how difficult it would be. - 15/02/2012 03:22:44 PM 678 Views
Not nesecarrily - 15/02/2012 04:01:45 PM 692 Views
You just said that most of their tactics are indirect. - 15/02/2012 05:44:22 PM 796 Views
..and you are creating new tactics - 15/02/2012 06:32:02 PM 637 Views
*shrug* I don't see it as some world-shaking action - 15/02/2012 08:47:40 PM 655 Views
Not accurate - 15/02/2012 03:54:00 PM 749 Views
You are thinking too far inside the box - 15/02/2012 04:23:28 PM 732 Views
I disagree - 15/02/2012 04:43:33 PM 696 Views
If armor is of no benefit... - 15/02/2012 06:19:30 PM 600 Views
Missing my point ... Cuendillar armor is impractical not useless - 15/02/2012 07:00:48 PM 733 Views
nope - 15/02/2012 07:21:03 PM 621 Views
*Shrug* - 15/02/2012 08:28:48 PM 747 Views
Re: *Shrug* - 15/02/2012 09:07:24 PM 913 Views
No way they could pull off what you are talking about with current tech - 16/02/2012 01:55:19 AM 694 Views
Re: No way they could pull off what you are talking about with current tech - 16/02/2012 03:23:34 PM 633 Views
Re: It can not be directly effected by the OP - 15/02/2012 02:37:40 AM 641 Views
Maybe, maybe not - 15/02/2012 02:12:59 PM 614 Views
Re: Maybe, maybe not - 15/02/2012 06:11:42 PM 756 Views
I'll happily amend my initial statement to "maybe even challeling ones" - 15/02/2012 07:03:48 PM 652 Views
Fair enough. - 16/02/2012 02:08:19 AM 648 Views
what a lot of people are forgetting with their suggestions of plate armor... - 13/02/2012 02:36:50 PM 814 Views
Your understanding of how plate armor functions is in error - 14/02/2012 01:45:37 PM 641 Views
I believe AND I was hoping you would go into the physics of it :p - 14/02/2012 11:01:18 PM 626 Views
here ya go, I still skipped almost all of the math though. - 15/02/2012 03:00:09 PM 690 Views
Two things: *NM* - 16/02/2012 04:03:52 PM 421 Views

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