Maybe the idea of a bunch of Aes Sedai walking in skirts right into the midst of a battle in order to provoke their enemies to attack them and therefore skirt one of the three oaths may not be unrealistic -- that point is debatable -- but it's highly cinematic, and I think it's a perfect illustration of my question.
If anything, I'd probably have to disagree about RJ not showing the chaos and horror of the battlefield all that well. We see a fair share of tragedy, but I agree that he does glorify the idea of combat almost to the point of stupidity, so what we get are these peculiar juxtapositions, such as the one RugyPlayingAshaman posited.
Certainly I believe Robert Jordan's depictions of battle pale before those of, say, George R. R. Martin, but it's clear that he doesn't shy away from the horror and tragedy entirely. It's hard for me to recall every detail, and I have to thank everyone for helping to refresh my memory, but Dumai's Wells was not the only scene in which terrible atrocities occurred.
The recent raid on the White Tower is another perfect example -- Egwene blasted to'Raken who were carrying the Tower's children (among others) away as prisoners. Sure, she determined that it was "more merciful," but I'm inclined to disagree entirely with her assumption. They would have been cared for, and they could have potentially been rescued.
But here we have this perfect example of tragedy, and instead all of our focus is shifted to how much ass Egwene kicked. We never see the bodies of the children, twisted and broken on the ground, or hear about how some of those who were killed were characters that we were attached to. No, it was all about what a huge victory it was.
I agree that none of the battles ever really gave you the flying organs and human meat grinder element that was injected into the story when we saw what offensive channeling could do for the first time. And, to be fair, I can't precisely recall when and where the Aes Sedai entered into the melee with nothing but skirts, but I distinctly recall them going into the warzone because they needed to have their life threatened to use the power.
Personally, I think there should have been casualties among the Aes Sedai that went charging into the melee wearing only their dresses and skirts. Women are typically weak with fire and air, and if they had to put their lives in danger to fight, that means they couldn't use shields of air to protect them. Sure, there may be weaves that prevent bloodstains, but without showing them emerge bloodied and bruised, we're seeing a perfect example of glorious battle instead of terrible, tragic war. We didn't get that.
I don't know. It strikes me as highly cinematic in some situations, and then in others we see elements that are just unbelievably grim. Dumai's Wells is a perfect example -- the first Asha'man through the gate takes a spear to the gut and falls over dead, illustrating that even the strongest channelers can die like any other man (but the Aes Sedai all make it out unscathed?) Another solid example of this is when Aviendha and Mat are killed instantly by one of Rhavin's ward -- and then we see a castle fall on Mat's head!
So, given the information, would we call it highly cinematic, or just a little cinematic?
P.S. I'd have to read over the wound that Gawyn took from the Undying, but I greatly appreciate that example.
If anything, I'd probably have to disagree about RJ not showing the chaos and horror of the battlefield all that well. We see a fair share of tragedy, but I agree that he does glorify the idea of combat almost to the point of stupidity, so what we get are these peculiar juxtapositions, such as the one RugyPlayingAshaman posited.
Certainly I believe Robert Jordan's depictions of battle pale before those of, say, George R. R. Martin, but it's clear that he doesn't shy away from the horror and tragedy entirely. It's hard for me to recall every detail, and I have to thank everyone for helping to refresh my memory, but Dumai's Wells was not the only scene in which terrible atrocities occurred.
The recent raid on the White Tower is another perfect example -- Egwene blasted to'Raken who were carrying the Tower's children (among others) away as prisoners. Sure, she determined that it was "more merciful," but I'm inclined to disagree entirely with her assumption. They would have been cared for, and they could have potentially been rescued.
But here we have this perfect example of tragedy, and instead all of our focus is shifted to how much ass Egwene kicked. We never see the bodies of the children, twisted and broken on the ground, or hear about how some of those who were killed were characters that we were attached to. No, it was all about what a huge victory it was.
I agree that none of the battles ever really gave you the flying organs and human meat grinder element that was injected into the story when we saw what offensive channeling could do for the first time. And, to be fair, I can't precisely recall when and where the Aes Sedai entered into the melee with nothing but skirts, but I distinctly recall them going into the warzone because they needed to have their life threatened to use the power.
Personally, I think there should have been casualties among the Aes Sedai that went charging into the melee wearing only their dresses and skirts. Women are typically weak with fire and air, and if they had to put their lives in danger to fight, that means they couldn't use shields of air to protect them. Sure, there may be weaves that prevent bloodstains, but without showing them emerge bloodied and bruised, we're seeing a perfect example of glorious battle instead of terrible, tragic war. We didn't get that.
I don't know. It strikes me as highly cinematic in some situations, and then in others we see elements that are just unbelievably grim. Dumai's Wells is a perfect example -- the first Asha'man through the gate takes a spear to the gut and falls over dead, illustrating that even the strongest channelers can die like any other man (but the Aes Sedai all make it out unscathed?) Another solid example of this is when Aviendha and Mat are killed instantly by one of Rhavin's ward -- and then we see a castle fall on Mat's head!
So, given the information, would we call it highly cinematic, or just a little cinematic?
P.S. I'd have to read over the wound that Gawyn took from the Undying, but I greatly appreciate that example.
This message last edited by Theon_Mavidante on 04/06/2011 at 05:29:20 AM
Combat in the World of the Wheel
03/06/2011 04:34:02 AM
- 1589 Views
Well, Healing screws things up a bit. But Rand at the end of tGH comes to mind
03/06/2011 05:20:57 AM
- 977 Views
You mean tGH *NM*
03/06/2011 11:13:04 AM
- 519 Views
Of course I did! And that's what I typed
05/06/2011 09:12:45 AM
- 759 Views
I find all of the non-channeling related combat implausible and over-dramatic
03/06/2011 03:51:35 PM
- 1090 Views
Gotta diagree
03/06/2011 06:22:52 PM
- 833 Views
The aftermath - but I don't think he really showed the chaos on a battlefield that well
03/06/2011 07:19:20 PM
- 734 Views
That doesn't make them unrealistic...
03/06/2011 08:30:05 PM
- 735 Views
I think it does make them unrealistic. Stylistic choices determine how these scenes are conveyed.
03/06/2011 09:24:21 PM
- 937 Views
Ummm...
03/06/2011 09:55:46 PM
- 782 Views
Come to think of it...
04/06/2011 05:16:55 AM
- 951 Views
WoT combat scenes are highly overrated. The non-OP fight scenes aresn't even scenes at all
11/06/2011 12:59:50 AM
- 731 Views