Based on Demandred's reaction to one comment from Moridin, Graendal suddenly changes her opinion regarding which of Demandred or Semirhage is the more dangerous to her? What the hell? It's not like she hasn't observed their respective tactics, attitudes and attributes over the course of a WORLD WAR that lasted for 10 years!
This is completely plausible. Demandred only joined the Shadow during the War of Power half way in. Secondly, there were many Chosen during the War. It's quite likely that Graendal never had contact with many of them for the duration of the conflict. Even now, Graendal rarely sees her peers. Now that there are only eight Forsaken left, she has to seriously evaluate each one of them so that she can kill them.
I would think that she would have made up her mind about their comparative strengths by now.
Nope, she has better things to do.
What is clear to me now is that the female Forsaken are even more gender-biased than the males when it comes to assessing the strengths of fellow Chosen. Everyone was criticising Rahvin for underestimating Lanfear in FoH, but Graendal seems to naturally consider the female Semirhage to be a foe as dangerous as Demandred. This despite her acknowledging that Demandred might have been the Dragon HIMSELF had he stayed with the Light!
That is a ridiculous statement to make. According to you, the only way that Semirhage could ever be as dangerous as Demandred would be if Graendal was biased towards women. How about the most logical argument that she considers either of them to be equally dangerous. I recall Asmodean soiling himself thinking about Semirhage, and not Demandred... is he is a sexist too?
That simply does not make sense. It is clear that Demandred is the leader of the trio. And it is also clear that Graendal is not half as cunning and intelligent as everyone has been making out up to now.
It's so clear that Graendal, one of the greatest minds of the AOL couldn't figure out if Semirhage or Demandred led the trio.
For one, it has NEVER before been suggested that Demandred sought to keep his alliance with Mesaana and Semirhage secret from the other Forsaken. For pete's sake, they've openly huddled together AT FORSAKEN MEETINGS in previous books. Arangar knew about their alliance in Book 11, yet she did not consider it to be any kind of achievement to have this insight. It is open knowledge. Yet Graendal thinks herself smart for "cracking that secret." I mean, come on.
It may well be a secret which has been poorly kept. It's possible that Graendal has asked Mesaana or Semirhage about it and they deny it, making it the worst kept secret in the Shadow.
And the way Graendal thinks about Moridin - making him her pet etc. She clearly has immense delusions of grandeur.
She's one of the greatest Forsaken who fought in the War of Power, according to the author himself. She's thought about enslaving Rand too, and even Sammael held saidin when he was around her. You underestimate her, I'm afraid.
My estimation of Graendal has dropped SIGNIFICANTLY after reading this chapter.
You've never really disguised your contempt for the female Forsaken, so I find this difficult to believe.
What has come across yet again, however, is just how dangerous Demandred is. In EVERY appearance thus far, throughout the series, he has only been regarded with respect or awe by other Forsaken. We have had references to his ability and menace from almost all the Forsaken by now.
Like when Graendal calls him a fool three times, or when Lanfear mocks him about him thinking he's the Great Lord's heir, or when Sammael says that if he doesn't stop meddling in his affairs he'll pay.
Graendal refers to the immense danger he presents, and then her female bias seems to elevate Semirhage to a position equal to that of a potential Dragon. Only for an instant, though, until Sanderson seems to bring reality home to us, however dubious the suggestion that Graendal had not yet analysed the comparative strengths of these two Forsaken a few thousand years ago already.
It's funny how Lews Therin himself, the greatest of all channelers, thinks that Semirhage's reputation as a torturer looms so greatly above her head that it's easy to forget how dangerous she is as a channeler. Despite separate reviews of Semirhage's lethal nature by Lews Therin, Asmodean, Mesaana and now Graendal, it seems that 'female bias' really can settle this.
It's also amazing that Moridin is furious that Semirhage would try to kill Rand. Why would he care if she's so far below a 'Dragon' and unable to do so? Clearly Semirhage is up to the task of destroying even Rand in a duel, and Moridin says she'll pay for it. I particularly enjoyed the casual way Demandred stated that he would have tracked Semirhage down and claimed her life in retribution had she killed Rand. None of the other Forsaken reacted with ridicule at his statement. Certainly Mesaana did not, and she knows Semirhage's strength - having compared it to her own before.
Even Demandred agrees that Semirhage could kill Rand. So Semirhage could kill Rand, but would be easy meat for Demandred? I think not.
And despite Demandred's arrogance, he has never made idle boasts before. If anything, the contrary has been true. He has refrained from making any kind of threats the less controlled Sammael was prone to make.
He claimed in WH that Lews Therin wasn't nearly as intelligent as he was. An idle boast if ever there was one.
Graendal is dumber than we thought up to now.
No
Graendal is going to die in this book.
Probably.
Demandred's stature was enhanced yet again. He has consistently been built up as a Forsaken of note, and will no doubt make a dramatic entry towards the very end of the series, playing a key role in the final outcome.
He's the huge surprise that just never arrives.
Moridin is starting to put personal issues above the goals of the Dark One. Or rather, his insanity is making him even more stupid than before. The idea of sacrificing an asset of Semirhage's ability just because she hurt his phantom hand a little is petty and short sighted in the extreme.
Probably because if Rand dies, he does too. The Forsaken are obsessed with survival, it makes sense.
Wheel of Time board admin
Fan of Lanfear
Fan of Lanfear
TGS Prologue - your thoughts (part 2) *spoilers*
- 16/09/2009 04:55:21 AM
3264 Views
Where can i find it at? Can someone give me a link? *NM*
- 18/09/2009 02:21:10 AM
214 Views
mobipocket.com
- 18/09/2009 02:53:13 AM
663 Views
Thanks, It was interesting especially the last part of the prologue *NM*
- 20/09/2009 02:42:28 AM
265 Views
A pointless survey - take your guess at who wrote what of the Prologue
- 18/09/2009 01:30:24 PM
564 Views
Re: A pointless survey - take your guess at who wrote what of the Prologue
- 18/09/2009 07:08:43 PM
438 Views
*NM*
The prologue gives us strong evidence that Graendal is weaker than Demi or Semi
- 18/09/2009 03:55:58 PM
642 Views
I'm a little surprised nobody is discussing this. I thought this would get more attention. *NM*
- 20/09/2009 09:17:57 PM
318 Views
Is it me or do the Forsaken seem more viscious?
- 18/09/2009 04:17:22 PM
631 Views
yep, leaner and meaner...except for mesaana-she's still twitchy after shadar haran *NM*
- 18/09/2009 05:09:29 PM
316 Views
Trollocs!
- 18/09/2009 05:35:12 PM
636 Views
Why not a gray man then?
- 18/09/2009 07:52:55 PM
650 Views
Because they wanted to destroy as much of the force as possible
- 19/09/2009 12:07:57 AM
522 Views
But there's no plausible deniability
- 19/09/2009 12:50:42 AM
567 Views
But even several grey men or slayer aren't going to get the deed done
- 19/09/2009 02:28:36 AM
591 Views
Who is Graendal going to wack?
- 18/09/2009 06:00:12 PM
597 Views
I think it could be Tam. *NM*
- 18/09/2009 06:05:12 PM
282 Views
Great idea.
- 18/09/2009 07:12:40 PM
555 Views
Its about time for Perrin to reunite with Rand he's got Faile back
- 18/09/2009 08:15:47 PM
534 Views
Re: Its about time for Perrin to reunite with Rand he's got Faile back
- 18/09/2009 10:41:12 PM
547 Views
Mesaana's statement gives us a big clue about Demandred's and Moridin's whereabouts
- 18/09/2009 09:11:49 PM
691 Views
My favorite quote: "Who will win? The child or the fool?" - Graendal
- 18/09/2009 09:48:55 PM
651 Views
*NM*
but she didn't say 'the fool or the fool' 
- 19/09/2009 02:07:20 PM
555 Views
- 19/09/2009 02:07:20 PM
555 Views
Yes, because Cannoli has long valued the opinions of the Forsaken...
- 20/09/2009 06:10:58 AM
615 Views
- 20/09/2009 06:10:58 AM
615 Views
Forsaken Chapter
- 18/09/2009 10:30:10 PM
615 Views
I agree that Graendal will die in this book.... her and A'rangar *NM*
- 19/09/2009 08:14:07 AM
259 Views
Various comments
- 19/09/2009 05:38:21 PM
636 Views
The Dying Man
- 19/09/2009 06:48:09 PM
577 Views
After a reread I think I know who sent the Trollocs
- 19/09/2009 08:28:08 PM
543 Views
Another reason why Moridin is not Taim
- 19/09/2009 08:41:03 PM
525 Views
This isn't evidence.
- 19/09/2009 08:51:54 PM
638 Views
It isn't evidence, but it is another perspective to add to the table
- 19/09/2009 09:11:15 PM
435 Views
Why is Moridin and not Demandred marshalling the Dark Forces in the Blight?
- 19/09/2009 10:35:06 PM
523 Views
I think there are many issues here
- 19/09/2009 10:51:13 PM
631 Views
The Malign Influence of the Forsaken
- 19/09/2009 11:08:00 PM
543 Views
I have doubts about that degree of conversion
- 19/09/2009 11:17:44 PM
480 Views
Re: Why is Moridin and not Demandred marshalling the Dark Forces in the Blight?
- 20/09/2009 09:44:06 AM
616 Views
Did Demandred make the connection between Moridin's phantom hand-pain and Semirhage's firebolt?
- 20/09/2009 12:11:32 PM
629 Views
I don't think that Demandred will be a key player at the end with Rand
- 20/09/2009 01:00:58 PM
586 Views
Some sweeping statements there...
- 20/09/2009 01:21:46 PM
577 Views
Not at all
- 20/09/2009 03:34:59 PM
600 Views
A lot of twisting my words there, and direct contradictions of your own points...
- 20/09/2009 04:19:57 PM
604 Views
Not really
- 20/09/2009 05:12:42 PM
671 Views
I couldn't have summarized it better myself...
- 20/09/2009 05:25:56 PM
495 Views
But...
- 20/09/2009 06:01:33 PM
595 Views
Possible...
- 20/09/2009 06:08:21 PM
508 Views
So that's your argument now? 
- 20/09/2009 07:35:52 PM
427 Views
- 20/09/2009 07:35:52 PM
427 Views
I think you took that the wrong way...
- 20/09/2009 08:53:28 PM
514 Views
Wow, then I think you're in for a surprise
- 20/09/2009 08:38:37 PM
490 Views
Just a general comment...
- 20/09/2009 09:13:51 PM
644 Views
Re: Just a general comment...
- 20/09/2009 09:59:51 PM
1455 Views
I reject the cult of the "cool" villain.
- 20/09/2009 11:24:40 PM
531 Views
I don't really agree
- 21/09/2009 05:02:10 AM
480 Views
But these aren't criminals...
- 21/09/2009 05:47:40 AM
411 Views