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Re: Forsaken Chapter AgentOrange Send a noteboard - 19/09/2009 09:53:31 AM
I found the Forsaken chapter somewhat disappointing. It was clearly the work of someone who had all the superficial information about each Forsaken, but was trying to summarize their personalities all over again as if presenting it for the first time.


It's strange that you figured this out, yet attribute some of Brandon's 'shortcomings' to the character itself.



What is clear to me now is that the female Forsaken are even more gender-biased than the males when it comes to assessing the strengths of fellow Chosen. Everyone was criticising Rahvin for underestimating Lanfear in FoH, but Graendal seems to naturally consider the female Semirhage to be a foe as dangerous as Demandred. This despite her acknowledging that Demandred might have been the Dragon HIMSELF had he stayed with the Light!


you should reread that. She doesn't think he might have been the Dragon himself. She says that HE thinks he might have been. It's also implied she thinks he's deluding himself.

That simply does not make sense. It is clear that Demandred is the leader of the trio. And it is also clear that Graendal is not half as cunning and intelligent as everyone has been making out up to now.


I don't agree with either statement. There's isn't really a leader to the trio and there's nothing clear about it.

For one, it has NEVER before been suggested that Demandred sought to keep his alliance with Mesaana and Semirhage secret from the other Forsaken. For pete's sake, they've openly huddled together AT FORSAKEN MEETINGS in previous books. Arangar knew about their alliance in Book 11, yet she did not consider it to be any kind of achievement to have this insight. It is open knowledge. Yet Graendal thinks herself smart for "cracking that secret." I mean, come on.


This is Brandon's mistake. Quite obviously.

What has come across yet again, however, is just how dangerous Demandred is. In EVERY appearance thus far, throughout the series, he has only been regarded with respect or awe by other Forsaken. We have had references to his ability and menace from almost all the Forsaken by now.


I'm not sure I agree. One interesting part was when Demandred goes into a "Only I get to kill Lews Therin" fit, and Moridin kind of shrugs him off as a useful hound. "Yeah sure sure whatever. You'll do it". Later when Moridin is left with Graendal he remarks thar Al'Thor musn't be hurt till he faces Morirind on the last day. Clearly he isn't taking Demandred too seriously. I wonder if it might turn out to Rand's advantage at that final moment.

More revealing than Graendal's opionion, however, was Arangar's comparative view of Graendal and Demandred. The common thread between Arangar and Graendal's views was their high estimates for Demandred's ability. The difference, is that Arangar considered Graendal a far less dangerous adversary to try and manipulate. If I recall, her words were something to the effect that Demandred was far too dangerous to play her games with.


Yes, but that's because he might try to kill you. Graendal would rather entangle you in her plots. And she has more sense of humor to flirting/ploting.

This message last edited by AgentOrange on 19/09/2009 at 09:54:05 AM
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TGS Prologue - your thoughts (part 2) *spoilers* Sidious - 16/09/2009 04:55:21 AM 3263 Views
Where can i find it at? Can someone give me a link? *NM* Blaine - 18/09/2009 02:21:10 AM 214 Views
mobipocket.com NaClH2O - 18/09/2009 02:53:13 AM 662 Views
Thanks, It was interesting especially the last part of the prologue *NM* Blaine - 20/09/2009 02:42:28 AM 265 Views
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Re: A pointless survey - take your guess at who wrote what of the Prologue Seriana Sedai - 18/09/2009 07:08:43 PM 437 Views
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nope and now I hate you *NM* NaClH2O - 18/09/2009 04:59:48 PM 305 Views
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The prologue gives us strong evidence that Graendal is weaker than Demi or Semi Lanfear - 18/09/2009 03:55:58 PM 642 Views
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simple answer:scouts redhand - 19/09/2009 04:47:04 AM 525 Views
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My favorite quote: "Who will win? The child or the fool?" - Graendal BlackAdder - 18/09/2009 09:48:55 PM 651 Views
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but she didn't say 'the fool or the fool' Sidious - 19/09/2009 02:07:20 PM 555 Views
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Lol *NM* Sidious - 20/09/2009 08:26:53 AM 485 Views
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I agree that Graendal will die in this book.... her and A'rangar *NM* Matrimony Cauthon - 19/09/2009 08:14:07 AM 259 Views
Re: Forsaken Chapter AgentOrange - 19/09/2009 09:53:31 AM 643 Views
Wrong... Shannow - 19/09/2009 01:41:25 PM 671 Views
I think we'll have to agree to disagree. BlackAdder - 19/09/2009 09:22:38 PM 690 Views
Huh Sidious - 19/09/2009 01:46:21 PM 750 Views
Re: Huh Shannow - 19/09/2009 02:21:43 PM 654 Views
Re: Huh Sidious - 19/09/2009 04:32:50 PM 672 Views
Fair enough... Shannow - 19/09/2009 05:08:33 PM 595 Views
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No, see my response to Agent Orange above. *NM* Shannow - 19/09/2009 06:07:14 PM 230 Views
Remove your blinders man... fionwe1987 - 19/09/2009 07:16:03 PM 663 Views
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Symbolism Rurouni_Kenshin - 20/09/2009 04:10:53 PM 461 Views
After a reread I think I know who sent the Trollocs Matrimony Cauthon - 19/09/2009 08:28:08 PM 542 Views
That is a really stupid idea Guava - 20/09/2009 01:20:09 AM 506 Views
Yeah Sidious - 20/09/2009 08:24:18 AM 502 Views
Another reason why Moridin is not Taim Matrimony Cauthon - 19/09/2009 08:41:03 PM 525 Views
This isn't evidence. Yvves - 19/09/2009 08:51:54 PM 638 Views
It isn't evidence, but it is another perspective to add to the table Matrimony Cauthon - 19/09/2009 09:11:15 PM 435 Views
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I couldn't have summarized it better myself... Shannow - 20/09/2009 05:25:56 PM 495 Views
But... fionwe1987 - 20/09/2009 06:01:33 PM 594 Views
Possible... Shannow - 20/09/2009 06:08:21 PM 508 Views
So that's your argument now? fionwe1987 - 20/09/2009 07:35:52 PM 426 Views
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Its simply, really. Heiko - 20/09/2009 09:05:42 PM 524 Views
Hmmm... fionwe1987 - 20/09/2009 11:10:04 PM 553 Views
Fair enough... Shannow - 20/09/2009 11:12:53 PM 424 Views
Sure. *NM* fionwe1987 - 20/09/2009 11:25:50 PM 254 Views
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Well Heiko - 20/09/2009 08:56:43 PM 566 Views
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Re: Wow, then I think you're in for a surprise Rurouni_Kenshin - 20/09/2009 09:07:48 PM 480 Views
Just a general comment... Shannow - 20/09/2009 09:13:51 PM 644 Views
Re: Just a general comment... Sidious - 20/09/2009 09:59:51 PM 1455 Views
Re: Just a general comment... Shannow - 20/09/2009 10:19:14 PM 456 Views
Re: Just a general comment... Sidious - 21/09/2009 04:58:38 AM 412 Views
I reject the cult of the "cool" villain. fionwe1987 - 20/09/2009 11:24:40 PM 530 Views
I don't really agree Sidious - 21/09/2009 05:02:10 AM 480 Views
But these aren't criminals... fionwe1987 - 21/09/2009 05:47:40 AM 411 Views
No, just the most heinous criminals imaginable Sidious - 21/09/2009 12:43:19 PM 619 Views
Re: No, just the most heinous criminals imaginable fionwe1987 - 22/09/2009 10:49:58 PM 541 Views
Doubt it... Etzel - 20/09/2009 02:10:37 PM 592 Views
I tend to agree with you, this time. AgentOrange - 20/09/2009 05:05:35 PM 481 Views
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