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Re: thanks for the quote ... truly appreciate it DomA Send a noteboard - 08/03/2011 08:59:18 PM

Yet we've seen no anomalies amongst the WF, where are the women with Strength in Earth or Fire (we've seen them amongst the AS)?.


Yes, if rarely - Egwene being the only AS truly exceptionally skilled in Earth (this was noted by the Seanchan as being rare and valued among damane as well). To get enough candidates for her cuendillar scheme, Egwene had to recruit even novices.

It's not surprising we haven't heard of any WF strong in Earth or Fire. Most of the channelling in the series involved Air/Water, and most of their traditional use of channelling use those two flows. There's probably WF with fair abilities in other flows - in fact the speed at which they learn what the AS teach them confirms that. It's just that SF previously didn't know many weaves that used Earth-Fire-Spirit. They relied almost solely on Air and Water.

(much like the Hero's of the Horn always display the same skills).


You see though that the Heroes are also further evidence that Rand isn't unique and pure talent/skills aren't genetic but tied to the soul.

There's zero evidence that the Wheel shapes the skills/personality of the Heroes. Even the Heroes themselves believe they've been chosen by the Wheel for those skills and that on occasions new Heroes are chosen, not created by the Wheel to have specific skills.

Why does the Wheel isolate the Heroes's souls from the Soul Pool? It could be seen as evidence that the Wheel keeps these souls accessible, in a dimension of the Pattern, to be reborn at need because normally the Wheel has no influence at all over the soul pool and rebirth, that after death and until conception, the soul is out of reach to the Wheel, just like Shai'tan can't reach beyond a certain point.

You could even argue that this is part of the reason why Tigraine had to go to the Waste to become his mother rather than having any random Aiel Maiden.


This is overly complicated for nothing, and a bit illogical since Rand isn't a genetic clone of LTT, yet has the very same "pure talents" as LTT and as far as we can tell, the exact same profile as channeller (or LTT would have commented on the differences in strength, affinities for flows and so on.) . He's not inherited that from his genetics, but from the baggage of his soul. This was also there before he got touched by the taint. Rand trained hard, but he also proved a natural swordsman - Lan just formally honed this talent. He had the same early affinities for music, like LTT - Thom had no problem honing his natural skills.

It's possible that only the genetic combination of Tigraine and Joradin could have produced the child with the necessary genetic traits to become the Dragon.


This sounds very far fetched, every Hero Soul's rebirth would need to be genetically programmed over generations. If the Wheel could foresee so far in advance the imbalances in the pattern, it could correct them at their genesis, it wouldn't need Heroes as corrective mechanisms. In that Rand is a bit of a special case, because the imbalances he's meant to correct involve an external source.

Of course: "Talents or special skills available to members of the circle other than whoever is melding the flows are not available to the person who is. If those Talents or skills are particularly needed, then control of the circle must be passed."

Specific enough for you?

Of course this quote does not cover off on flow affinity ...


What else would the "and special skills" distinct from Talents be but stuff such as aptitudes with flows? It doesn't make sense they would be shared in a circle but "talents" wouldn't be. Most of the weaving Talents are nothing but special aptitudes with some flows, only even more specific, at the level of weaves/categories of weaves. Egwene has great natural skills weaving Earth, linking with her doesn't make those skills pass to the circle leader, none of her abilities as a weaver do. The fact she's good with Earth doesn't provide a greater quantity of Earth to a circle either. She provides raw saidar, that's all. The circle leader's the one who picks the flows and handles them. Selecting a flow is the first step of weaving itself.



Actually we do have some evidence. Corele and Flinn very likely linked when they Healed/Warded Rand's Fain/Ishamael wounds.


Not "very likely linked". We know they did, but not to Heal Rand. Corele linked with Flinn afterward at some point and off-screen (Jordan wasn't about to steal the thunder of the Cleansing with that), to get a demonstration of his Healing.

It's never been suggested they have later attempted mix gender Healing of any kind (Yellows are not prone to experiment with Healing - Nyhaeve is far more daring in this respect). If they did it's off-screen and has provided us with no data so far on mixed gender Healing. I don't think they did, that would have reached notably Nynaeve's ears when she joined that group. Corele would have been all too happy to boast about it to bring Nynaeve down a few notches.

Cadsuane's comment about "Things that have not been done since the Breaking" is suggestive that a male/female link was created to have a more potent affect in the Healing.


The first and ground breaking mixed gender work was the Cleansing itself. That's also when mixed gender circles began again. After the bonded couples started experimenting - the first evidence of true mixed gender work (Rand's aside) - circles using both saidin and saidar combined, was in the aftermath of attack on the Tairen manor. It's the first time Nynaeve noticed it happening, anyway.
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Talents don't make much sense - 07/03/2011 09:34:56 AM 1750 Views
I agree - 07/03/2011 01:18:13 PM 674 Views
Re: Talents don't make much sense - 07/03/2011 02:21:46 PM 821 Views
Re: Talents don't make much sense - 07/03/2011 04:15:28 PM 818 Views
Re: Talents don't make much sense - 07/03/2011 03:51:17 PM 910 Views
I have a slightly different view on your last two points - 07/03/2011 07:30:43 PM 726 Views
Re: I have a slightly different view on your last two points - 08/03/2011 01:29:46 PM 696 Views
thanks for the quote ... truly appreciate it - 08/03/2011 05:07:19 PM 676 Views
Re: thanks for the quote ... truly appreciate it - 08/03/2011 08:59:18 PM 723 Views
I don't find it all that complicated of far fetched - 09/03/2011 04:34:03 PM 585 Views
One thought on the Sea Folk example - 08/03/2011 07:27:15 PM 591 Views
also very possible ... I'm just thinking "outloud" so to speak - 09/03/2011 04:32:08 PM 582 Views
No worries - 'thinking out loud' and going on tangents are my favorite hobbies here - 09/03/2011 05:54:42 PM 553 Views
I don't think they are supposed to make 'sense', really. Maria gave info about Talents in a Q&A - 07/03/2011 04:05:40 PM 834 Views
Gateway Talent? - 07/03/2011 08:19:12 PM 611 Views
Re: Gateway Talent? - 08/03/2011 12:09:21 PM 628 Views
Re: Gateway Talent? - 08/03/2011 02:12:53 PM 635 Views
Re: Gateway Talent? - 08/03/2011 11:15:55 PM 684 Views

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