That's interesting, and I have a weird agree/disagree here; also, that Adam Roberts sucks - Edit 1
Before modification by newyorkersedai at 23/02/2011 02:17:45 AM
I think Darius_Sedai and DomA did a great job highlighting the most frequent critiques delivered against the series. I just wanted to follow up and say that ultimately, I think it has less to do with him being a bad writer, and more to do with the sheer fact that certain themes and details didn't clarify themselves until well after the series progressed
I think that it's less about the themes clarifying then it is actually being utilized. RJ had so much sheer *story* to write that the basic contrast between light and dark, and what they must do to fight each other - it only becomes clear now that it's entered the "termination phase" and another, blunter writer, has tackled the task.
- unlike most authors and series with limited installments (one, two or three book trilogies, for example), "The Wheel of Time" was released in such a way that there was no opportunity to go back and re-do or touch up prior scenes before they became part of the final version.
Yes, but I've always kept in mind that RJ was snookered into this series just like we were. It was supposed to be a 3, maybe 4 book series. Then it became 5 of 6. Then it became, "whenever I'm done telling the story that these characters are going to live through.
For example, I read "The Shadow Rising" well before I read "The Eye of the World", and to me, there is a huge difference in quality of writing and originality; the latter felt like a derivative piece of fanfiction, while the former is easily one of my favorite books in the series and alternative fiction, in general.
This series to me feels as if it had been born from great ideas, but ultimately the weight of all the characters and story lines drag it down from being as well-executed as it could be. For me, the key word is execution. It's a great series, but for one this large, an editorial and creative team might have been needed to keep the universe coherent and tightly woven.
That doesn't make Robert Jordan a bad writer; it makes him an ambitious writer. I don't think he was entirely successful in delivering the potential the early part of the series held, but neither do I think he was a failure - I think most fans have lists of books, characters and storylines in the series that were boring, lacking in believability or just plain sloppy, so it's not really possible to claim he succeeded on all fronts.
This series to me feels as if it had been born from great ideas, but ultimately the weight of all the characters and story lines drag it down from being as well-executed as it could be. For me, the key word is execution. It's a great series, but for one this large, an editorial and creative team might have been needed to keep the universe coherent and tightly woven.
That doesn't make Robert Jordan a bad writer; it makes him an ambitious writer. I don't think he was entirely successful in delivering the potential the early part of the series held, but neither do I think he was a failure - I think most fans have lists of books, characters and storylines in the series that were boring, lacking in believability or just plain sloppy, so it's not really possible to claim he succeeded on all fronts.
In truth, it's the story lines and characters that make WoT so good. I think that RJ had issues with properly conveying some moments and changes for characters in a way that didn't shortchange them. I actually felt "weirded out" in TDR when Rand was suddenly an absent, tertiary (though plot-driving) character. I really grew to like it, and that book in particular.
So maybe RJ erred greatly in trying to give that sort of attention to particular, long-!## plots that happened to some characters. This, and the need to identify every random Accepted, Wind Finder, and guardsman, seems to be the big problem.
But becoming Queen, especially for a major character ruling a major nation with a complicated situation, is a big deal. It's just that So, too, with losing your wife, gaining control of more sophisticated players in a deadly mire, and getting her back.
It just took a massive amount of words to do it. Going through it involved an almost excruciating level of detail. And other things were happening at the same time - possibly more exciting things. And we're barely learning about the incredible plots of the bad guys, or the things that they can do.
So many interesting/exciting details and points are largely left on the sidelines... While we learn more about how badly Perrin deals with adversity. Or how often Elayne will mince around people that are spitefully mad over actions that can be blamed on a Forsaken.
To a large degree, however, all those additional characters (much as their inclusion annoys me often) actually do fit in with the theme: the Dragon must fight, but the fight is for the whole world and all the great and small people in it; they all can contribute; all these people, light and dark, are important to this tale.
I'm actually pretty taken with DomA's idea that this was an experimental effort that didn't succeed in several ways. A lot of that "feels" true. And in this sort of attempt, it's almost impossible for someone to face-plant. Jordan certainly did a fine job for a while before greater flaws started to show.
To some degree, though, I gave RJ a big sign of confidence: I always figured that his Conan books would read differently from WoT, at least in part. The odd voice of the WoT series feels like the right voice for the series. I figured that was the WoT-style, not quite RJ's absolute style.
If I were asked to write something that isn't entirely my style, I would sacrifice my personal preferences for what the piece requires. If I accepted a writing assignment for a leftist or far-right magazine, I would write something that would fit into source it would be a part of. If one slant puts S. Palin in a bad light, then I'll put her in a bad light - and good, if good. You can see it in all those parody pieces I wrote.
In closing, though I know you don't necessarily endorse Adams' criticism, but Adam Roberts is an ass. The English have this particular knack for criticizing things with back-handed compliments, then analyzing things as if they're talking about the frolics of a half-daft child. That's pedantic, insulting, and annoying.
He takes the time to pick apart how long it takes RJ to describe Rand's first encounter with a Myrdraal. Then he says it's kind of homey, but the "compliments" he writes are simultaneous insults. And belittling ones at that. He could have just analyzed the moment and talked about whether or not it works.
And for god's sake, the length is pointless, because it's our lead's first encounter with evil in the story. Like, what story *wouldn't* take its time with that first moment? Well, ADams may have other accurate critiques to make, but he's in full-on condescending British jack-ass mode in his "critique."
He might as well have written, "it's not a particularly bad effort, for one of those other little people who try at things but fail like spectacular inferior people who aren't subjects of the Crown." Roberts can take his two first names and go analyze himself.