Rand cannot die except at Shayol Ghul. Full stop SPOILERS
DrJacJacMcScrumptious Send a noteboard - 05/01/2011 01:52:53 AM
This is probably really obvious and I apologise if all this Theory has been posted before. But bear with me.
We already can see from evidence both current and previous that the pattern will twist things to save it's Taveren whenever they are in danger. For us, that is normal, the Pattern is RJ's plot and plots always contrive massive coincidence to save the story's heroes. But in universe, it is important, as characters can notice that this is inevitable because Taveren was created to justify what most books do anyway. With Rand, this has been taken to ridiculous extremes even before ToM, especially in his fight with Rahvin etc.
He has now realised exactly how much he can rely on the pattern. So far so clear.
But Moridin at some point has realised this. When Moridin decided that FS could kill Matt and Perrin but not Rand, there are multiple reasons:
A) he is worried his link with Rand will mean he could die if Rand does. Maybe, but Moridin seems willing to die for the DO to win anyway (If the DO wins, we think he knows he will die and we have no evidence to suggest he isn't trying to win for the Shadow), and Rand's death means the DO wins. Plus the DO can bring back Moridin even if it is a hassle and Moridin has died multiple times.
B) Rand is needed to free the DO and/or break the Wheel. Maybe, but then we have vastly misunderstood the nature of the bore etc all series as well as the DO's equal and opposite nature to the Creator. This might interesting but seems that it would undermine the entire idealogy of the books
C) it is prophesied that Rand must make it to Shayol Ghul, like Elza thinks. We have now seen a dark book of prophecy. But there is no obvious reason for such a prophecy unless if was made for the pattern to protect Rand or because of another one if these points. Prophecy must have a reason to come true otherwise it is not inevitable, so this cannot stand alone without another reason.
D) Moridin really wants to turn Rand. For philosophical or egomanical or personal reasons. He tried hard early in the series when he was willing to kill Rand as well. But the stakes are higher now and I think Moridin, who post reincarnation seems pretty smart, would be the only FS ablE to ignore his relationship with LTT and Rand to just kill him and win. He turned because if philosophy not LTT apparently so for him the result is the only vital thing
E) the DO is already linked to Rand via Moridin, the uber scars, the taint and/or the TP (if this is distinct from Moridin's link) and killing Rand will harm the DO. Not likely again unless we have overestimated the DO and misinterpreted RJ's ethos for the whole series
F) some other reason we don't know of which would only be revealed in the last book thus breaking the series by making 13 books redundant unless we didn't pick up on really subtle clues. Which I doubt, do if this is the case, I will hate the last book
G) Somewhere along the line, Moridin has realised that Rand cannot be killed as the DR. The only time Moridin was happy too see him killed was when the Choedan Kal were about to be used for something and the risk of losing people trying to kill Rand was worth it is the CK were captured or destroyed in the meantime. Moridin can try and capture Rand or break him or turn him
To win, like the Fisher King in MegaChess or whatever it's called, but he can't physically kill him because the Pattern will save him. He dissuaded the other FS etc from doing so because FS are valuable and in trying to kill Rand they will fail and die. Hence the whole, possibly successful turning tactics because they are less risky and don't seem so prohibited by the pattern.
Obviously the only place the pattern can fail is Shayol Ghul because of the DO presence, so for Rand to die at all, it must be at SG or near, regardless of how Rand dies, unless maybe he kills himself like he considered (with the rest of the world thrown in for measure) on Dragonmount. The LoC plot was an attempt to make the Taveren more vulnerable as well as to weaken the light's forces and increase the DO's influence. With Rand this was futile, but the DO still hopes to get past Perrin and Matt's Pattern approved protection using the chaos effect.
Please criticise and add so I can build some useful conclusions from my otherwise obvious and pointless theory. Thank you
We already can see from evidence both current and previous that the pattern will twist things to save it's Taveren whenever they are in danger. For us, that is normal, the Pattern is RJ's plot and plots always contrive massive coincidence to save the story's heroes. But in universe, it is important, as characters can notice that this is inevitable because Taveren was created to justify what most books do anyway. With Rand, this has been taken to ridiculous extremes even before ToM, especially in his fight with Rahvin etc.
He has now realised exactly how much he can rely on the pattern. So far so clear.
But Moridin at some point has realised this. When Moridin decided that FS could kill Matt and Perrin but not Rand, there are multiple reasons:
A) he is worried his link with Rand will mean he could die if Rand does. Maybe, but Moridin seems willing to die for the DO to win anyway (If the DO wins, we think he knows he will die and we have no evidence to suggest he isn't trying to win for the Shadow), and Rand's death means the DO wins. Plus the DO can bring back Moridin even if it is a hassle and Moridin has died multiple times.
B) Rand is needed to free the DO and/or break the Wheel. Maybe, but then we have vastly misunderstood the nature of the bore etc all series as well as the DO's equal and opposite nature to the Creator. This might interesting but seems that it would undermine the entire idealogy of the books
C) it is prophesied that Rand must make it to Shayol Ghul, like Elza thinks. We have now seen a dark book of prophecy. But there is no obvious reason for such a prophecy unless if was made for the pattern to protect Rand or because of another one if these points. Prophecy must have a reason to come true otherwise it is not inevitable, so this cannot stand alone without another reason.
D) Moridin really wants to turn Rand. For philosophical or egomanical or personal reasons. He tried hard early in the series when he was willing to kill Rand as well. But the stakes are higher now and I think Moridin, who post reincarnation seems pretty smart, would be the only FS ablE to ignore his relationship with LTT and Rand to just kill him and win. He turned because if philosophy not LTT apparently so for him the result is the only vital thing
E) the DO is already linked to Rand via Moridin, the uber scars, the taint and/or the TP (if this is distinct from Moridin's link) and killing Rand will harm the DO. Not likely again unless we have overestimated the DO and misinterpreted RJ's ethos for the whole series
F) some other reason we don't know of which would only be revealed in the last book thus breaking the series by making 13 books redundant unless we didn't pick up on really subtle clues. Which I doubt, do if this is the case, I will hate the last book
G) Somewhere along the line, Moridin has realised that Rand cannot be killed as the DR. The only time Moridin was happy too see him killed was when the Choedan Kal were about to be used for something and the risk of losing people trying to kill Rand was worth it is the CK were captured or destroyed in the meantime. Moridin can try and capture Rand or break him or turn him
To win, like the Fisher King in MegaChess or whatever it's called, but he can't physically kill him because the Pattern will save him. He dissuaded the other FS etc from doing so because FS are valuable and in trying to kill Rand they will fail and die. Hence the whole, possibly successful turning tactics because they are less risky and don't seem so prohibited by the pattern.
Obviously the only place the pattern can fail is Shayol Ghul because of the DO presence, so for Rand to die at all, it must be at SG or near, regardless of how Rand dies, unless maybe he kills himself like he considered (with the rest of the world thrown in for measure) on Dragonmount. The LoC plot was an attempt to make the Taveren more vulnerable as well as to weaken the light's forces and increase the DO's influence. With Rand this was futile, but the DO still hopes to get past Perrin and Matt's Pattern approved protection using the chaos effect.
Please criticise and add so I can build some useful conclusions from my otherwise obvious and pointless theory. Thank you
And the answer came to her instantly: pride. Oh, you hear them say it's a sin; you hear them say it goes before a fall. the shepherd prides himself on keeping the wolf out from the flock. We pride ourselves on making a good history of our lives, a good story to be told.
This message last edited by DrJacJacMcScrumptious on 05/01/2011 at 01:53:34 AM
Rand cannot die except at Shayol Ghul. Full stop SPOILERS
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