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winning in TAR had nothing to do with OP strength... that was pure skill and later Moghedien lost! darius_sedai Send a noteboard - 11/12/2010 04:14:26 PM

I dont think Mesaana is the lowest female forsaken - Egwene has met Moghedian - and knows her strength - she is aware of Nyneave's strength - she is even aware of Sharina's strength which potentially is greater than Nyneaves. So explain why would she say....'Light, but that woman had been strong'(page 578 Towers of Midnight) regarding Mesaana - if she had met women of greater strength. When u are accoustmed to being around Nyneave and Sharina who is YOUR OPINION are stronger - you wouldn't be in awe or even intimidated by one far less stronger - you may say to yourself - this woman is stronger than me - but not "...LIGHT, but that woman had been strong..." - which would translate in normal english as Jesus Christ F***k that woman is strong!!!!! Plus i know ppl go on abt Nyneave wasn't at her full potential when she confronted Moggy - however we know women can sense each others potential - and NOT THEIR current strength - if Moggy was weaker that much weaker than Nyneave i doubt she would have confronted her.... but if you say - Moggy was hoping her superior skills would win - surely after losing once - and knowing that this person is much stronger than you - MOggy by nature would have stayed clear of Nyneave - rather than try taking her on again. lastly on Nyneave - what makes you think she hadn't reached her full potential - or how far from full potential she was... i mean she could have already been 85%, 95% etc - you lot forget she is a WILDER aand had been using the power subconciously for a long time!!!


but odds are she was very close even at the time of TSR. When she had been actively channeling (and being Forced) for well over a year.

The Path of Daggers
Unweaving

Elayne knew she herself had not yet reached her full potential, and neither had Nynaeve. How close were Metarra and Talaan? She had grown accustomed to knowing that only Nynaeve and the Forsaken were stronger than she. Well, Egwene, but she had been forced, and her own potential, and Aviendha’s, matched Egwene’s.

We also know from the same quote that Egwene is further along toward her full strength than Elayne and Aviendha, but we have no idea how close to full strength she is ... Nicola's comment that "no woman had gained so much of her strength so quickly" is an indication that Egwene at that time had not reached her full potential either, only most of it.

A Crown of Swords
A Pair of Silverpike

Fidgeting with her skirt, Nicola stepped closer. Large eyes met Egwene’s perhaps more directly than a novice's should have. "Mother, I want to go as far as I can." Her hands plucked at her dress, but her voice was cool and self-possessed, fit for an Aes Sedai. "I won’t say they are holding me back, but I am sure I can become stronger than they say. I just know I can. You were never held back, Mother. No one has ever gained so much of her strength as fast as you. All I ask is the same chance."

At any rate the entire premise of this chain is out the window now that we know how greatly Moiraine was reduced. Seems to me that Sanderson got confused with Cyndane and Moiraine's situation ... Moiraine was the one dramatically reduced to a very weak channeler, not Cyndane. Sanderson basically let something slip and got a little lucky!


which means - Moggy and her are pretty well matched as equals - nyneave was already almost at her potential - and Moggy lost not due to lack of strength - but due to lack of will. SEcondly in T'Arinod - Moggy won!!!! Nyneave was rescued by Brigette - everyone assumes Moggy lost all her battles - Infact barrin g the first confrontation Moggy won all others - and Nyneave escaped by sheer luck!!


Nynaeve was a match for Moghedien before she was at full strength. Implying that now (assuming she's hit full strength) Nynaeve is a good bit stronger.

Nynaeve later defeated and captured Moghedien in TAR ... not sure where you are getting the Moghedien won all the other confrontations ... they are 2-1 in Nynaeve's favor. With the only confrontation with the Power going to Nynaeve!
Domani Drag Queen in the White Tower ... Aran'gar watch out!
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Thanks to Sanderson, we now have a DEFINITIVE female Forsaken strength list... - 18/11/2009 05:56:58 PM 2173 Views
Sounds good - 18/11/2009 06:08:15 PM 1083 Views
Re: Sounds good - 18/11/2009 06:12:53 PM 1123 Views
Re: Someryn - 18/11/2009 06:20:44 PM 1130 Views
I acknowledge that possibility... - 18/11/2009 06:24:30 PM 1009 Views
Someryn implies that Graendal is stronger. - 19/11/2009 01:51:31 PM 1104 Views
Excellent point...I'd forgotten about that... - 19/11/2009 02:00:30 PM 1017 Views
As I understand it... - 18/11/2009 06:23:26 PM 1106 Views
My view is that the new list is just a revised one, after RJ changed his mind on some things... - 18/11/2009 06:28:53 PM 1149 Views
Agreed. - 18/11/2009 06:31:22 PM 961 Views
I suppose that's possible. *NM* - 18/11/2009 06:31:42 PM 767 Views
I agree with this interpretation on the new vs. old list - 18/11/2009 07:13:02 PM 1038 Views
Re: Sounds good - 18/11/2009 07:11:17 PM 957 Views
Also, a couple more questions, if I may... - 18/11/2009 07:18:50 PM 949 Views
Re: Also, a couple more questions, if I may... - 18/11/2009 07:23:45 PM 978 Views
One problem... - 18/11/2009 06:10:06 PM 1148 Views
No... - 18/11/2009 06:14:48 PM 1050 Views
That's not a problem. - 18/11/2009 06:31:37 PM 996 Views
Why on earth would there be multiple restrictions on Cyndane's strength? - 18/11/2009 06:47:56 PM 902 Views
Sorry buddy - 18/11/2009 07:36:00 PM 1025 Views
Re: Sorry buddy - 18/11/2009 09:49:01 PM 941 Views
But Nynaeve and Mogheiden were of equal strength - 18/11/2009 06:15:52 PM 1194 Views
Nynaeve matched Moghedien when Nynaeve was not close to her full potential yet... - 18/11/2009 06:19:07 PM 1231 Views
I agree...and I have a question regarding Moghedien. - 18/11/2009 06:30:07 PM 1039 Views
Cyndane has to be above Graendal. *NM* - 18/11/2009 06:33:16 PM 579 Views
You're right. I'll post new list below. *NM* - 18/11/2009 06:39:36 PM 599 Views
Was she? Nyn was mid20s and a wilder, I thought she had reached full strength - 18/11/2009 08:00:24 PM 1073 Views
She really hasn't had that much time channelling though. - 18/11/2009 08:07:31 PM 742 Views
Wilders rarely reach their full potential if they're blocked. *NM* - 18/11/2009 08:43:30 PM 619 Views
I know the Cleansing forced her a bit. - 18/11/2009 08:44:59 PM 1028 Views
That's been said before- anyone know where it says that in the text? - 19/11/2009 05:53:50 AM 810 Views
More or less agreed. I was right about Nynaeve! - 18/11/2009 06:29:27 PM 954 Views
IMO... - 18/11/2009 06:37:19 PM 1068 Views
I don't know... - 18/11/2009 06:56:10 PM 937 Views
I still think Alivia is below Lanfear's strength level... - 18/11/2009 06:59:01 PM 1248 Views
That just doesn't make sense... - 18/11/2009 07:02:17 PM 1065 Views
I agree that Lanfear and Alivia are tied. *NM* - 18/11/2009 07:06:19 PM 606 Views
All of my instincts indeed argue that 4 of the Forsaken CANNOT be below Nynaeve, but... - 18/11/2009 07:06:25 PM 896 Views
But why doesn't it make sense? - 18/11/2009 08:47:42 PM 795 Views
I don't think... - 18/11/2009 07:08:09 PM 1128 Views
Damane never recieve special status... - 18/11/2009 08:52:32 PM 925 Views
Good point... - 18/11/2009 09:00:51 PM 958 Views
Thing is... - 18/11/2009 09:10:45 PM 1009 Views
My point was... - 18/11/2009 09:05:28 PM 996 Views
I agree *NM* - 18/11/2009 09:10:46 PM 567 Views
If Tuon had the strongest... - 18/11/2009 09:12:22 PM 909 Views
Sera must be stronger... - 18/11/2009 09:25:00 PM 906 Views
There's no reason to be certain about it... - 18/11/2009 09:28:26 PM 951 Views
Well, the Bloodknives are precisely Tuon's tools - 18/11/2009 09:32:46 PM 906 Views
There are SIX women stronger than Nynaeve, and at least five are accounted for... - 18/11/2009 09:46:28 PM 955 Views
There are six stronger women named on the list - 19/11/2009 11:40:52 AM 964 Views
I'm not ignoring Sera! - 19/11/2009 06:13:43 PM 829 Views
You misunderstand me... - 19/11/2009 06:16:31 PM 918 Views
I doesn't make "sense". Let's leave it... - 19/11/2009 06:19:52 PM 907 Views
But Alivia (while strong in the OP) is an old fraile lady on her deathbed. *NM* - 18/11/2009 09:41:33 PM 602 Views
Pardon? Don't understand this really. *NM* - 19/11/2009 11:45:21 AM 444 Views
You keep saying Alivia was "a common damane" - 28/11/2009 08:58:42 PM 795 Views
You were right about Nynaeve, I was right about Graendal! Well done! - 18/11/2009 06:37:42 PM 1048 Views
Yes. This is one WoT debate coming to a close... - 18/11/2009 06:54:06 PM 818 Views
I have one problem with your list. - 18/11/2009 06:36:02 PM 1013 Views
RJ said the Forsaken ALWAYS overrate themselves... - 18/11/2009 06:54:45 PM 869 Views
Mesaana is cold and calculating. - 18/11/2009 07:03:49 PM 920 Views
I'm sorry, but I find it mindblowing that you find this mindblowing. - 18/11/2009 06:36:37 PM 957 Views
Some of us have been debating this for 5 years on Wotmania... - 18/11/2009 06:57:08 PM 1012 Views
I think it goes like this: - 18/11/2009 06:53:07 PM 951 Views
There is a side effect to all of this rearrangement...we may have to rethink the wonder girls. - 18/11/2009 07:04:17 PM 1015 Views
We'll have to re-read the sections where Moghedien is captured. - 18/11/2009 07:08:07 PM 917 Views
Damn. That's a thought I definitely DON'T relish. Thankfully... - 18/11/2009 07:09:18 PM 946 Views
Where does she say this? - 18/11/2009 08:54:39 PM 955 Views
No, she explicitly refers to herself vs Moghedien... - 18/11/2009 09:01:53 PM 952 Views
Here are the quotes... - 18/11/2009 09:24:24 PM 969 Views
Oh come on. You're totally twisting that passage to suit your argument... - 18/11/2009 09:54:56 PM 858 Views
I could say the same... - 18/11/2009 10:50:44 PM 881 Views
So let me get this straight... - 19/11/2009 06:44:03 AM 897 Views
No... - 19/11/2009 07:37:29 AM 951 Views
Look at it this way... - 19/11/2009 10:23:06 AM 924 Views
Dude, there were other quotes... - 19/11/2009 06:15:32 PM 831 Views
What about Sammael? The debate about Sammael and Rahvin has been decided now too. - 18/11/2009 08:03:35 PM 991 Views
Totally disagree... - 18/11/2009 08:08:34 PM 1039 Views
Re: Totally disagree... - 18/11/2009 08:22:07 PM 927 Views
Males likely go like this... - 18/11/2009 08:27:27 PM 886 Views
Dude, Rand is scared of Graendal... - 18/11/2009 09:05:28 PM 894 Views
Disagree... - 18/11/2009 09:09:45 PM 1006 Views
Disagree back... for the last time though... - 18/11/2009 09:39:25 PM 851 Views
About the top 6... - 18/11/2009 10:08:37 PM 934 Views
And One Power Battles turn political on a regualr basis, do they? - 18/11/2009 10:54:35 PM 979 Views
That's ridiculous... - 19/11/2009 07:19:08 AM 871 Views
Re: That's ridiculous... - 19/11/2009 08:08:14 AM 907 Views
Well... - 19/11/2009 10:29:45 AM 908 Views
This is getting idiotic... - 19/11/2009 06:19:08 PM 908 Views
Re: Dude, Rand is scared of Graendal... - 10/12/2010 07:31:18 PM 910 Views
If Rahvin were stronger... - 18/11/2009 08:59:32 PM 885 Views
Disagreement - 19/11/2009 01:39:49 AM 1009 Views
Some more from Brandon... - 19/11/2009 04:29:41 AM 908 Views
So we're back where we started? - 19/11/2009 04:56:36 AM 710 Views
Re: So we're back where we started? - 19/11/2009 05:18:15 AM 999 Views
Someone must ask him: Is Cyndane one of the 6 above Nynaeve. - 19/11/2009 05:35:10 AM 869 Views
My opinion: down this path lies insanity. - 19/11/2009 02:53:59 PM 946 Views
Thoughts - 19/11/2009 04:55:09 AM 1008 Views
Re: Thanks to Sanderson, we now have a DEFINITIVE female Forsaken strength list... - 10/12/2010 07:55:51 PM 856 Views
we know from a direcet quote in TPoD that Nynaeve had not yet reached full strength - 10/12/2010 08:36:50 PM 915 Views
Re: we know from a direcet quote in TPoD that Nynaeve had not yet reached full strength - 10/12/2010 09:17:48 PM 924 Views
winning in TAR had nothing to do with OP strength... that was pure skill and later Moghedien lost! - 11/12/2010 04:14:26 PM 881 Views

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