The way I read it the various circles strength was QUITE relevant; it allowed them to not only match but defeat multiple Forsaken in battle. No doubt the fact that the most experienced channelers were leading each circle helped, but the reason I think the Forsaken survived is that once they realized they were outmatched they ran. The only who didn't, of course, is also the only one who didn't survive. That the rest aren't all mindtrapped leads me to believe even the DO realizes he demanded the impossible that time.
Demandred was dodging massive attacks when he encountered Damer Flinn's mixed Circle - he felt his defensive weave absorb more energy than it should, and started fighting back.
Graendal encountered a Circle of women, one of whom had an angreal. She walked straight towards them while throwing killing weaves. She killed one of the members of the Circle before she left.
Cyndane encountered a woman with a vastly more powerful collection of angreal and ter'angreal. She fought back and held her ground with an impressive seismic tremor to signal that she wasn't afraid of confronting a more powerful channeler. She left the battle after horribly burning the other womans' arm which surely neutralized her.
Aran'gar encountered a mixed Circle with a sa'angreal - he tried to destroy the leader, missed and ended up fighting the survivors after lethally injuring one of the men.
The common theme is that even if the Forsaken didn't destroy all of their opponents, for the most part, they escaped after defeating vastly more powerful enemies. They didn't run away and have their weaves immediately powerless.
The defeated vastly more powerful enemies? Because the way I remember it their mission was an utter failure, despite the fact they were keenly aware of how important it was to a master with little tolerance for failure. They didn't even inconvenience Rand and Nynaeve. They can claim a 2:1 kill ratio, that's about it. To me, the common theme is that they ran for their lives following complete defeat. That they bothered to engage I attribute to typical Forsaken arrogance and the fact the DO made clear that, no matter the cost, saidin was NOT to be cleansed. To the point that the order against killing Rand was rescinded.
Keep this in mind, as well - none of the Forsaken we saw who fought started running as soon as they confronted these opponents. They stood their ground and if anything, the only one that came closest to fleeing was Demandred, and in terms of what we've heard, he should be the one least threatened.
He also seems, from what we've heard, to be among the most wise and cautious. Sort of the antithesis of the guy who charged right up to Rand and was turned to ash.
I think Shannows main point is correct; as he says, we've seen that stronger channelers have an innately greater facility with the Power. They'll also be able to practice weaves weaker channelers may be able to form, but can't activate (and suddenly I'm thinking about how Sorilea was able to show Caddy the Traveling weave despite the fact Egwene had only recently rediscovered it, which factors into my "Is Sorilea the Darkfriend, or Bair?" theory. ) So, yeah, it's POSSIBLE a college QB will be more accurate than an NFL QB with a stronger arm, but it's hardly the rule, because the pros stronger arm has given him the chance to throw a lot more passes to a lot better receivers covered by a lot better defenders.
But we've also seen much weaker channelers with Talents, affinities and skills that enable them to compete and exceed what stronger channeler can do in at least their one area of expertise. Keep in mind that any Yellow Ajah Sister can exceed Rands' healing capacity, and we've already met a member of the Kin that can maintain a Shield that can hold a vastly more powerful channeler.
The real analogy would be: A pro NFL QB might have a stronger arm, but it is the person that has a weapon or tool they can use skillfully that will win an actual life or death fight. What use is bragging about how much you can bench press in optimum, controlled conditions when you are on a battlefield where a single piece of shrapnel, no matter how small, can be fatal?
Talents obviously change things, yes; Nynaeve is as strong as Moghedien but was held by a much weaker channeler who said herself that she could hold one of the Forsaken. Of course, a Talent is not, in itself, a skill; it's a Talent. It can be augmented and increased by skill, obviously, but if it were the same thing Talents could be developed and they wouldn't be natural talents.
The point of my analogy was the NFL QB with the stronger arm will very rarely have JUST a stronger arm; his greater power will create opportunities to develop greater skill than the college QB who lacks such opportunities. That doesn't mean a rookie starter can't have the least interceptions if he's just got a knack for throwing fade passes, but that's an innate ability rather than a developed skill, and the exception rather than the rule, so relying on it is unwise (just ask Brett Favre....
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Honorbound and honored to be Bonded to Mahtaliel Sedai
Last First in wotmania Chat
Slightly better than chocolate.
Love still can't be coerced.
Please Don't Eat the Newbies!
LoL. Be well, RAFOlk.
Last First in wotmania Chat
Slightly better than chocolate.
Love still can't be coerced.
Please Don't Eat the Newbies!
LoL. Be well, RAFOlk.
On One Power Rankings
- 29/09/2010 12:33:53 AM
2580 Views
Moghedien's an oppourtunist, but a coward as well. I wouldn't call her "the" most dangerous. *NM*
- 29/09/2010 12:51:28 AM
303 Views
Moghedien is mindtrapped and can't do a thing unless Moridin is dead or she steals her trap *NM*
- 29/09/2010 01:12:57 AM
201 Views
Mesaana will get no angreal...
- 29/09/2010 01:55:21 AM
465 Views
Mesaana will get no more angreal.
- 01/10/2010 12:04:47 PM
471 Views
- 01/10/2010 10:18:14 PM
363 Views
- 01/10/2010 10:18:14 PM
363 Views
You are correct, however, there are some general guidelines...
- 29/09/2010 09:18:49 AM
731 Views
Partially correct.
- 29/09/2010 02:34:07 PM
408 Views
Have to disagree about the Cleansing.
- 01/10/2010 12:26:32 PM
555 Views
Re: Have to disagree about the Cleansing.
- 01/10/2010 10:09:25 PM
412 Views
Re: Have to disagree about the Cleansing.
- 03/10/2010 10:47:20 AM
610 Views
Re: You are correct, however, there are some general guidelines...
- 30/09/2010 12:57:54 AM
686 Views