When I say, "body" I mean in the sense of "group" not "anatomy" i.e. as in the AoL.
Joel Send a noteboard - 12/09/2009 09:46:31 AM
I anticipate a generally intact monolithic body of channelers like the Age of Legends Aes Sedai by the Last Battle; this theory seeks to demonstrate how, as well as potential consequences.
The title is simple but the theory complex; counting the third of Aes Sedai waiting for a clear winner between Elaida and Egwene, and the Kin, at least five or six channeling groups exist just within the White and Black Towers, before considering the Wise Ones or Windfinders. Most of those aren’t directly relevant to this theorys purpose, however, which is to forecast the manner and ramifications of resolving conflicts between
1) Shadow and Light loyalists within the White and Black Tower and
The artificial division between male and female channelers represented by those Towers themselves.
Is the division between male and female channelers, who channel completely different sources, can't even tell what the other is doing without artificial methods, also not represented by their radically different anatomy and roles in reproduction? Your starting assumption that the division IS in fact artificial seems highly unreasonable. Perhaps you should prove this point before moving on with the rest of a plan.The title is simple but the theory complex; counting the third of Aes Sedai waiting for a clear winner between Elaida and Egwene, and the Kin, at least five or six channeling groups exist just within the White and Black Towers, before considering the Wise Ones or Windfinders. Most of those aren’t directly relevant to this theorys purpose, however, which is to forecast the manner and ramifications of resolving conflicts between
1) Shadow and Light loyalists within the White and Black Tower and
The artificial division between male and female channelers represented by those Towers themselves.
This is like the joke about the physicist, the chemist and the economist stranded on a desert island with nothing but some cans of food and a cookfire. When confronted with the problem of removing the food from the cans, the physicist begins calculating the force and velocity needed to smash them open. The chemist attempts to figure the point at which the metal of the cans needs to be heated in order to be opened. The economist says he knows what to do, and when asked for his plan, says "First, assume a can opener. Then..." That is a mighty big first assumption you and the economist are asking us to make.
I wouldn't say saidar and saidin are COMPLETELY different; they are, after all, still two halves of the same One Power. There are inherent differences in those halves, but it's still ONE Power; they have more in common than either does with the "True" Power. Integral collaboration is perfectly natural, as evidenced by the greatest works of the AoL that all agree were impossible without BOTH Powers in concert, and by the very mechanism that made such things possible: The Link that men can't even form without the participation of women. Personally, I think involving women with the Strike would simply have tainted the saidar along with saidin, but it's clear LTT deeply resents their non-involvement, blames a their united fronts opposition for arguably the greatest disaster to have ever struck Randland.
I'm certainly not arguing that now that the Taint is gone the Fourth Age will simply be a reprise of the First; I'm still not convinced Tarmon Gaidon isn't going to end with channeling burned out of humanity for thousands of years, but to whatever extent humans remain able to channel it seems a given they will increasingly do so on an egalitarian and cooperative basis. If nothing else, Jordan has established the pre-Bore AoL as a Golden Age only possible because "Aes Sedai" was a gender neutral term, so it's entirely natural, both within the storys framework and the authors tendencies, to restore a single Tower rather than maintaining two distinct ones. Neither Tower wants rogue channelers responsible to no one, and each represents exactly that to the other. The only real reason for separation to begin was the Taint and the prejudices it's built up over the centuries, and while those will take time to completely eliminate, doing so is really the ONLY natural course.
The devastation this could wreak is hard to overestimate. Pevara is a founding member of the Black Ajah Hunters, and as such has already sworn on the Oath Rod that she is not herself Black Ajah, so turning her would immediately provide full access to all the Hunters plans as well as poise a very dangerous but totally unexpected weapon above each of their hearts. What’s more, Taim has every reason to turn her at his first safe opportunity; her role as a Red Sitter and part of Elaidas envoy to Taim, as well as having conceived the plan Elaida accepted to Bond male channelers, marks her as someone with access to if not influence on the Amyrlin herself.
Yeah, no. RtDB already. Elaida is completely ignorant of Pevara's plan, and Pevara does NOT have her confidence of any more access than any Red Sitter might enjoy with an Amyrlin formerly of her Ajah. Elaida knows nothing of EITHER of Pevara's major agendas. You might want to spend more time reading the actual books, and not BS like whatever that Nine Impossible Things source you cited. The so-called 9 things are a colloquial expression used in the second mention of a POSSIBLE Foretelling, in a context that casts doubt on the veracity of said Foretelling, if there ever even WAS one that foretold Rand doing a series of impossible tasks. Get things straight. Yeah, my bad here, and I'll edit accordingly. I read KoD twice not long after its release, but time hasn't allowed me to do re-read much more than a third of TEotW since. It was inconceivable to me that such a controversial plan could be enacted without Elaidas consent; frankly, I see no way to conceal from her something so large within her own Ajah (and whatever the ideal it's clear Elaida still thinks of herself as Red as much if not far more than previous Amyrlins retained their Ajah loyalties) and expect all hell to break loose when she learns of it. Not that I think it will matter much in the end; you may not care for his form, but I suspect Logain will be the first Amyrlin of a reunified Tower.
Nicolas Foretelling told secondhand would be dubious in a vacuum, yes, but that's not how we have them. For one thing, the Aes Sedai speaking of them expresses those doubts, raising the very real possibility disbelief is ironic. That's further supported by our knowledge that everything specifically mentioned in her Foretellings either has happened or soon will ( "battles with the Seanchan or the Ashaman [both have happened, and the Seanchan will attack the White Tower directly soon] an Amyrlin imprisoned [current event] the Dragon Reborn doing nine impossible things [e.g. the Cleansing] visions that might be Tarmon Gai'don [yeah, we know TG is coming] or a bilious stomach. "
Elaidas ignorance doesn't really change my theory much practically though. Pevara's still a Sitter, accompanied by another and acting at the behest of "the Highest" if not the Amyrlin, and in the Usurper Tower the leader of the Red Ajah is probably analogous in power to the Speaker of the House: While the position is nominally inferior to the Keeper of the Chronicles, that positions inherent authority is largely ceremonial, while the leader of the most influential Ajah enough clout to make her effectively second in power only to the Amyrlin herself. The company Pevara keeps makes her (as well as Javindhra) an irresistible target should Taim attempt turning Aes Sedai with Myrddraal links; gaining converts among Red Sitters whose loyalties aren't suspect would be a critical first step in turning Elaida herself, which could be a game changer. And whatever the truth of the matter, Taim's no more likely than I to think this plan was implemented without Elaidas blessing; he hasn't read the KoD Prologue.
“The north and the east must be as one. The west and the south must be as one. The two must be as one. ”
Rand himself has told us this the key to victory, yet it’s always seemed an odd statement. It would be logical for the north and south to be made one, or the east and west; this would be clear argument he should seek the kind of absolute unity he has, but the unity of cardinal directions not in opposition, and the silence on unifying those that are, imply something else. Yet if “the ancient symbol of the Aes Sedai” is to no longer be so ancient, the north and east will be one in the Black Fangs location on the top right, and the west and south one in the White Tears on the lower left, and the two will be one again after eons in a single Tower, neither White nor Black, but Gray. Such is life.
In the end, however, there can only be one realistic outcome unless Jordan intends the series to be a bleak apocalypse in which the villain wins the day. The Last Battle cannot be won without the Dragon Reborn, so he must in the end triumph over Taims subversion to triumph over the Dark One. The Tower in Exile and Usurpers choosing sides in that only means that one of them will be annihilated along with Taims followers, and a single body of male and female channelers, many Bonded to each other, emerge as an integral force to face the Dark One at Tarmon Gaidon. Which, coincidentally, squares with what Elaida has already told us:
“The White Tower will be whole again, except for remnants cast out and scorned, whole and stronger than ever. Rand Al’Thor will face the Amyrlin Seat and know her anger. The Black Tower will be rent in blood and fire, and sisters will walk its grounds. This I Foretell. ” (A Crown of Swords, Prologue : Lightnings)
Rand himself has told us this the key to victory, yet it’s always seemed an odd statement. It would be logical for the north and south to be made one, or the east and west; this would be clear argument he should seek the kind of absolute unity he has, but the unity of cardinal directions not in opposition, and the silence on unifying those that are, imply something else. Yet if “the ancient symbol of the Aes Sedai” is to no longer be so ancient, the north and east will be one in the Black Fangs location on the top right, and the west and south one in the White Tears on the lower left, and the two will be one again after eons in a single Tower, neither White nor Black, but Gray. Such is life.
In the end, however, there can only be one realistic outcome unless Jordan intends the series to be a bleak apocalypse in which the villain wins the day. The Last Battle cannot be won without the Dragon Reborn, so he must in the end triumph over Taims subversion to triumph over the Dark One. The Tower in Exile and Usurpers choosing sides in that only means that one of them will be annihilated along with Taims followers, and a single body of male and female channelers, many Bonded to each other, emerge as an integral force to face the Dark One at Tarmon Gaidon. Which, coincidentally, squares with what Elaida has already told us:
“The White Tower will be whole again, except for remnants cast out and scorned, whole and stronger than ever. Rand Al’Thor will face the Amyrlin Seat and know her anger. The Black Tower will be rent in blood and fire, and sisters will walk its grounds. This I Foretell. ” (A Crown of Swords, Prologue : Lightnings)
It's possible, but it seems a bit out of character for the way they have been portrayed thus far. There is the actual REAL Foretelling (as opposed to the unseen, unconfirmed and highly dubious Foretelling of the Nine Impossible Things) that "the Guardians balance the Servants." They cannot do this if they all become Servants. The Asha'man and Aes Sedai might end up working VERY closely together indeed, but they will maintain their seperate identities. There are simply too many differences to make a complete integration feasible. The two symbols might join to form a perfect circle, but they retain their distinctions and identities. No one has any trouble telling which part is which and neither crosses the bounds of the other. Like male and female genders themselves, I believe they will remain seperate for the foreseeable future. The majority of adult men and women might marry and live together in mixed pairs, but they will never unite as a single gender.
They weren't united in a single gender in the AoL either, but they were united in a single group enhanced rather than inhibited by differences in genders and the True Source. The only reason that ceased was the Taint, which has itself ceased now, so there's no reason to preserve their division and every reason to remove it.
Under the status quo, however, I see the quote you provide as additional support rather than a rebuttal; women are now the only ones continuing to use the ancient title of "Servants" while the term "Guardians" is distinct to men, yet the quote argues they must be balanced with each other. Expecting a perfect balance to come solely from individual channelers pairing off (or perhaps being polyamorous in the case of Greens) is expecting too much, but a single authority composed of and over both Asha'man and Aes Sedai makes a LOT more sense. It's the kind of supporting quote I've not had time to find for two years, keeping me from posting this theory since before KoD, so, thanks. They'll remain distinct individuals AND be part of a larger social body, in a reduced form of the way marriage is supposed to be on an individual level, and in nearly the same way they were during the AoL.
Or such is my expectation; you may well be right and the proof is in the pudding, but I do think my case somewhat stronger at present.
Honorbound and honored to be Bonded to Mahtaliel Sedai
Last First in wotmania Chat
Slightly better than chocolate.
Love still can't be coerced.
Please Don't Eat the Newbies!
LoL. Be well, RAFOlk.
Last First in wotmania Chat
Slightly better than chocolate.
Love still can't be coerced.
Please Don't Eat the Newbies!
LoL. Be well, RAFOlk.
This message last edited by Joel on 12/09/2009 at 09:47:01 AM
The Two Two Towers: Unifying Channelers Ere Tarmon Gaidon.
11/09/2009 06:44:20 PM
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Re: The Two Two Towers: Unifying Channelers Ere Tarmon Gaidon.
12/09/2009 04:39:13 AM
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When I say, "body" I mean in the sense of "group" not "anatomy" i.e. as in the AoL.
12/09/2009 09:46:31 AM
- 519 Views