We know that any women captured by the Seanchan in the Westlands are tortured as part of their training but I was under the impression that this was done because female channelers on this side of the ocean don't know or accept the institution of damane.
If a girl is brought up among the Seanchan there is certain some stigma to the family as her name is stricken from the rolls when she is found to be able to channel but I got the impression that quite a few accept their fate quite quickly because they have been brought up to believe that damane should submit.
No doubt their initial training may be harsh but I wonder: does it have to be as cruel as the training among the Aes Sedai and such who refuse to accept that they should serve the empire?
If a girl is brought up among the Seanchan there is certain some stigma to the family as her name is stricken from the rolls when she is found to be able to channel but I got the impression that quite a few accept their fate quite quickly because they have been brought up to believe that damane should submit.
No doubt their initial training may be harsh but I wonder: does it have to be as cruel as the training among the Aes Sedai and such who refuse to accept that they should serve the empire?
I don't think that for a Seanchan woman, torture is necessary and either way I doubt any Sul'dam would actually call it torture in any case. When we see the interactions in Falme when Mat is trying to free Teslyn, the Sul'dam working to break her says "it is a hard way to break a Damane, and it is a shame to break them down so completely, but when trained that way, they always became the meekest Damane." When we see the Sul'dam breaking the Aes Sedai that is TRULY what they are having to do. As much squabbling as we routinely see from the Aes Sedai, there is no doubt that they are some really hardcore women. Just the test for the shawl alone entitles them to being called badasses, and they hold the top tier of power in Randland, bowing to nobody except their own titular head the Amyrlin. It must be incredibly difficult to break them, but like anyone, if you push hard enough they will break, and never be the same.
In training a Seanchan-born Damane, however, I agree with many of the previous comments about the social conditioning regarding damane helping to ease the transition for the newly-collared. When acceptance to a particular fate, sucky as it is, coincides with a strict social norm, it is much easier to accept. When accepting the fate of being treated as dogs, directed everywhere they went, being confined in small spaces, having punishment used on them at every turn (and extreme punishment at that... Egwene up to her neck in boiling water, yikes!) The most powerful women in the "world" would find a harsh transition indeed.
I think it has been viewed as torture because of the extreme measures needed to bring Aes Sedai to heel, combined with the direct violation to Randland social norms thousands of years old.
This message last edited by FanEditor10 on 03/06/2010 at 08:25:57 AM
Seanchan girls. Do they live in terror until 25?
02/06/2010 12:32:14 AM
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It's a huge honor to be a sul'dam, and they test for that on the same day
02/06/2010 01:06:32 AM
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Re: It's a huge honor to be a sul'dam, and they test for that on the same day
02/06/2010 01:50:49 AM
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Re: It's a huge honor to be a sul'dam, and they test for that on the same day
02/06/2010 05:53:14 AM
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Re: It's a huge honor to be a sul'dam, and they test for that on the same day
04/06/2010 07:19:36 PM
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A few details to consider
02/06/2010 01:11:12 AM
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Re: A few details to consider
02/06/2010 02:31:08 AM
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Well, it took centuries for most people to understand breeding/genetics
02/06/2010 08:57:43 PM
- 708 Views
Re: Well, it took centuries for most people to understand breeding/genetics
03/06/2010 03:38:25 AM
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Re: Well, it took centuries for most people to understand breeding/genetics
04/06/2010 07:46:08 PM
- 621 Views
Nobody knows about Sul'dam because it takes them extra long to learn.
03/06/2010 07:58:41 AM
- 1009 Views
I think they retest only the sul'dam
02/06/2010 04:13:55 AM
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I'll have to check my EotW, but I think Eg did have some fevers before Winternight. *NM*
02/06/2010 06:34:35 PM
- 368 Views
Re: I think they retest only the sul'dam
04/06/2010 07:55:56 PM
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Point on the testing
08/06/2010 02:15:26 AM
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Re: Point on the testing
08/06/2010 02:46:06 PM
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I'd think that would be a tiny chance given how diligent the Seanchan are in this regard
08/06/2010 02:58:15 PM
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Remember, Seancean have no idea channeling can be "learned"
02/06/2010 07:04:11 AM
- 804 Views
This is how Damane and Sul'Dam are determined, straight from tGH
03/06/2010 08:14:03 AM
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That doesn't make sense. Are you sure they don't put the BRACELET on the girls, not the collar?
04/06/2010 01:35:08 AM
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I am absolutely sure. Quote from book.
04/06/2010 03:09:08 AM
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Toun, though too young can be collared
06/06/2010 03:29:29 AM
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I don't think Tuon will ever Channel
06/06/2010 03:39:16 AM
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Re: I don't think Tuon will ever Channel
06/06/2010 05:07:40 AM
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I just see all of that as potential plot lines for the planned follow-up Mat/Tuon in Seanchan novels
08/06/2010 02:09:26 AM
- 800 Views
Not at all
02/06/2010 03:52:31 PM
- 617 Views
Re: Are the new damane actually tortured?
02/06/2010 06:56:10 PM
- 772 Views
I think "tortured" is relative...
03/06/2010 08:22:37 AM
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As with most things in Jordan's universe, I don't think it was thought through very seriously.
03/06/2010 08:05:04 PM
- 652 Views
Huh?
03/06/2010 08:44:35 PM
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Sure
03/06/2010 09:00:40 PM
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Bah...
03/06/2010 09:51:09 PM
- 704 Views
Jordan definitely made mistakes with the Ajahs. In particular, the Black Ajah ones who fled.
03/06/2010 10:56:39 PM
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Re: Sure
04/06/2010 04:55:23 AM
- 796 Views
I don't know if that's totally true
04/06/2010 12:09:29 PM
- 625 Views
Maybe you don't read that much serious literature? I just don't see why you are arguing this.
04/06/2010 03:47:50 PM
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I actually don't read much fiction at all to be honest
04/06/2010 04:00:03 PM
- 684 Views
You're right about the fact that I have mostly contempt for Jordan.
04/06/2010 05:42:49 PM
- 650 Views
Meh
04/06/2010 05:03:41 PM
- 680 Views
I love that: "I'm convinced Rand al'Thor is the most monotonous man in the world."
04/06/2010 05:47:01 PM
- 594 Views
I think the number of characters directly contributes to the situation.
04/06/2010 03:51:42 PM
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Re: I think the number of characters directly contributes to the situation.
04/06/2010 05:04:52 PM
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Brandon brings out supporting chars. better, it's true.
04/06/2010 03:17:52 AM
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You're absolutely right. Sanderson gets "inside" the characters a bit more. *NM*
04/06/2010 03:52:29 PM
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