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Re: I'm inclined to think the a'dam stops Dream Walking Datakim Send a noteboard - 26/05/2010 09:49:24 PM

If it didn't Moghedien would have found a Black Sister and gotten herself free... or would have pulled Nynaeve or Elayne into TAR at some point and gotten revenge ... too many options for her if it didn't stop her.

But it seems likely that death or madness akin to Machin Chin eating your soul would be the outcome if you left TAR in Spirit form.


This seems likely.

I wonder if this might also explain the other bizarre thing with the whole Moghedien episode that I have often wondered about. When Nynaeve imagined the a'dam collar around Moghediens neck while they were both in TAR, why is it that Moghedien did not just imagine the a'dam into nothingness? I mean we know that is possible, we have seen people change their clothes or imagine things such as bushes or other items into vanishing.

Why did Moghedien who is supposedly such a master of TAR not just get rid of the collar with her mind. For that matter, why did she not just choose to wake up in the real world and free herself from the collar that way. We know that dreamers can wake up at-will.

This would all be explained if the a'dam has some inbuilt block that neutralises all dream-abilities. Once Nynaeve imagined the thing around Moghedien's neck, Moghedien was no longer able to influence TAR in any way, or leave TAR willingly. Maybe dreamers were a lot more common in Seanchan and something like this was required to prevent the damane from forcibly pulling the sul'dam to TAR and killing her in her dreams or something.
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Help me out with a TAR problem Sidious - 26/05/2010 08:10:07 PM 1378 Views
Re: Help me out with a TAR problem Datakim - 26/05/2010 08:28:34 PM 807 Views
No I don't mean that Sidious - 26/05/2010 08:37:27 PM 822 Views
Re: No I don't mean that darius_sedai - 26/05/2010 08:39:42 PM 697 Views
Re: No I don't mean that Sidious - 26/05/2010 08:52:22 PM 598 Views
I'm inclined to think the a'dam stops Dream Walking darius_sedai - 26/05/2010 09:26:20 PM 551 Views
Re: I'm inclined to think the a'dam stops Dream Walking Datakim - 26/05/2010 09:49:24 PM 543 Views
And it seems the woman wearing the bracelet has strange dreams too darius_sedai - 26/05/2010 10:54:26 PM 632 Views
Re: I'm inclined to think the a'dam stops Dream Walking HyogaRott - 27/05/2010 06:46:42 PM 538 Views
I think it would be the latter RugbyPlayingAshaman - 27/05/2010 07:11:17 PM 642 Views
I have a few mundane my reasons as to why Moghedien probably wouldn't and couldn't do that. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 26/05/2010 11:39:14 PM 548 Views
Re: I have a few mundane my reasons as to why Moghedien probably wouldn't and couldn't do that. Datakim - 26/05/2010 11:50:56 PM 517 Views
Re: I have a few mundane my reasons as to why Moghedien probably wouldn't and couldn't do that. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 27/05/2010 12:06:55 AM 539 Views
Re: I have a few mundane my reasons as to why Moghedien probably wouldn't and couldn't do that. Datakim - 27/05/2010 12:21:53 AM 576 Views
Re: I have a few mundane my reasons as to why Moghedien probably wouldn't and couldn't do that. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 27/05/2010 02:58:36 PM 584 Views
I disagree darius_sedai - 27/05/2010 03:21:05 PM 555 Views
Re: I disagree RugbyPlayingAshaman - 27/05/2010 07:08:41 PM 602 Views
If she could enter TAR she could drag an AS in with her, compell them and make them take it off darius_sedai - 27/05/2010 07:14:26 PM 650 Views
Re: If she could enter TAR she could drag an AS in with her, compell them and make them take it off RugbyPlayingAshaman - 27/05/2010 09:21:11 PM 744 Views
I think we are saying pretty much the same thing here darius_sedai - 27/05/2010 09:24:37 PM 583 Views
We are close to the same idea, but different in where we think her ability will stop. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 27/05/2010 09:37:28 PM 571 Views
*nods* *NM* darius_sedai - 27/05/2010 11:29:10 PM 261 Views
But channelling is not a requirement to enter TAR BlackAdder - 27/05/2010 08:31:21 AM 514 Views
The a'dam affects things in Channelers other than the ability itself darius_sedai - 27/05/2010 01:58:34 PM 697 Views
I don't agree. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 27/05/2010 03:02:08 PM 577 Views
you are misreading me I think darius_sedai - 27/05/2010 03:11:50 PM 711 Views
Re: you are misreading me I think RugbyPlayingAshaman - 27/05/2010 06:30:29 PM 625 Views
Re: you are misreading me I think HyogaRott - 27/05/2010 06:42:36 PM 637 Views
That's the point. darius_sedai - 27/05/2010 06:57:35 PM 597 Views
Re: That's the point. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 27/05/2010 07:10:25 PM 564 Views
Re: That's the point. darius_sedai - 27/05/2010 07:16:49 PM 560 Views
We may never know! RugbyPlayingAshaman - 27/05/2010 09:21:48 PM 600 Views
I would be very surprised if it came up in the books darius_sedai - 27/05/2010 09:25:29 PM 561 Views
Interesting idea. Datakim - 26/05/2010 09:38:04 PM 525 Views
Fascinating Idea #4 on this thread. Thanks, Sid! *NM* newyorkersedai - 26/05/2010 10:31:48 PM 278 Views
Channeler heal thyself Datakim - 26/05/2010 11:40:25 PM 650 Views
There may be a clue to this in the descriptions of astral projection in comics and psychic studies RugbyPlayingAshaman - 26/05/2010 11:59:42 PM 600 Views
Re: Help me out with a TAR problem cmoorejr - 26/05/2010 08:35:49 PM 572 Views
Doesn't work entyti - 26/05/2010 08:37:40 PM 782 Views
we've seen this fail darius_sedai - 26/05/2010 08:38:06 PM 536 Views
I don't mean that Sidious - 26/05/2010 08:39:32 PM 520 Views
I'd say you either die or just wake up if you tried that darius_sedai - 26/05/2010 08:40:31 PM 530 Views
As far as I know... Etzel - 26/05/2010 08:38:36 PM 561 Views
This could work DomA - 26/05/2010 08:43:21 PM 747 Views
Thanks Sidious - 26/05/2010 08:51:17 PM 572 Views
Re: Thanks DomA - 26/05/2010 09:12:10 PM 533 Views
So I think this disproves it newyorkersedai - 26/05/2010 08:49:55 PM 811 Views
Is that really true? Sidious - 26/05/2010 08:53:45 PM 600 Views
Sid, I made some edits, but really nothing's certain. Look again, pls. *NM* newyorkersedai - 26/05/2010 08:55:30 PM 288 Views
I would generally agree with your edits Sidious - 26/05/2010 08:57:32 PM 555 Views
yes and no darius_sedai - 26/05/2010 09:31:53 PM 474 Views
Re: yes and no Datakim - 26/05/2010 09:55:46 PM 511 Views
5+ entries for "Book 4-6 Thing " now... Funny that we wrote slight variations simultaneously newyorkersedai - 26/05/2010 10:24:03 PM 512 Views
well Moghedien somehow managed to create a whole Body for Birgitte darius_sedai - 26/05/2010 10:36:45 PM 564 Views
Could Rahvin turn Rand into a fishman if he was just there in Spirit? newyorkersedai - 26/05/2010 10:19:05 PM 533 Views
And I agree with your response newyorkersedai - 26/05/2010 09:49:00 PM 533 Views
You have to enter TAR in the Flesh to leave it in the Flesh. krassos - 26/05/2010 10:06:02 PM 651 Views
Re: You have to enter TAR in the Flesh to leave it in the Flesh. darius_sedai - 26/05/2010 10:57:06 PM 524 Views
The short answer to Birgitte krassos - 27/05/2010 02:37:13 AM 527 Views
I think this is possible. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 26/05/2010 11:28:51 PM 578 Views
Dream gateway! Datakim - 27/05/2010 12:05:31 AM 517 Views
I think the problem is that you can only channel Spirit through your T'A'R form RugbyPlayingAshaman - 27/05/2010 03:05:13 PM 508 Views
if you dream yourself into T'A'R then you're just a creation of your own mind Jim - 27/05/2010 12:02:38 AM 506 Views
aren't we all? *NM* newyorkersedai - 27/05/2010 12:04:08 AM 239 Views
if that was true you couldn't die in T'A'R Foxhead - 27/05/2010 12:08:10 AM 491 Views
Why not? krassos - 27/05/2010 03:41:10 PM 631 Views
if it's just a creation of your mind? Foxhead - 27/05/2010 04:03:29 PM 568 Views
is it possible to Travel in T'A'R when dreaming? Foxhead - 27/05/2010 12:06:57 AM 525 Views
I don't think anybody has said this before... Fanatic-Templar - 27/05/2010 04:01:28 AM 604 Views
Your real body can only channel Spirit. Gher - 27/05/2010 05:25:08 AM 607 Views
Yes, but you need real One Power to affect the real world. Fanatic-Templar - 27/05/2010 06:46:21 AM 596 Views
Yes, I agree with that, but I was mostly just replying to your question about sleep-channeling. Gher - 27/05/2010 06:56:18 AM 512 Views
The only real situation we have to compare... Fanatic-Templar - 27/05/2010 06:59:51 AM 503 Views
That's a weird situation. Gher - 27/05/2010 07:09:21 AM 559 Views
Well, yes. The Birgitte situation can't be compared directly to Sidious' Fanatic-Templar - 27/05/2010 08:01:38 AM 567 Views
Re: The only real situation we have to compare... HyogaRott - 27/05/2010 07:11:45 PM 609 Views
If something that didn't exist before existed after... Fanatic-Templar - 27/05/2010 08:58:55 PM 550 Views
Re: If something that didn't exist before existed after... HyogaRott - 28/05/2010 02:09:01 PM 612 Views
Actually I don't think so.. darius_sedai - 28/05/2010 02:31:27 PM 513 Views
Plus, their ability to affect reality comes from the magic of the Horn of Valere. Fanatic-Templar - 28/05/2010 06:14:21 PM 446 Views
your dream self couldn't exit TAR... Onarishma - 27/05/2010 06:39:26 AM 560 Views
TAR constructs cannot leave it. fionwe1987 - 27/05/2010 04:57:12 PM 719 Views
Not just constructs ... anything reflected in TAR cannot leave it ... Shishka - 27/05/2010 10:05:37 PM 694 Views
Re: Help me out with a TAR problem HyogaRott - 27/05/2010 06:58:18 PM 512 Views
shucks everyone already thought of this... *NM* HyogaRott - 27/05/2010 07:08:50 PM 246 Views
problem solved... sort of? lummox - 28/05/2010 02:48:13 AM 639 Views
I agree with those saying that if you don't physically enter TAR... TaskmasterJack - 29/05/2010 09:32:40 PM 575 Views
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