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She still made plenty of choices and she did choose to kill. Vivien Send a noteboard - 05/04/2012 07:13:47 PM
"She does use the tracker-jackers on the group below her tree, with full awareness of the possible lethality, so it isn't even like she was trying not to kill anyone, either."

Absolutely! She made the choice and the action to drop the nest of the wasps when she was in that tree. She knew what it would do and she did think about it and make that choice. It caused 2 deaths (in the book it was 2 though in the movie it was only 1) and it's not like she was shocked by that outcome. Dropping the nest of deadly wasps is not that different from throwing a bomb, I don't see how anyone could argue that Katniss did not make choices or that she chose not to kill.

Katniss could have just stayed up in that tree and who knows something else could have happened to remove the threat of the careers without making Katniss be responsible for the deaths.

The Rue thing... It kind of makes me wonder, let's say Rue is not killed and it's the end of the Hunger Games and the 3 people that are left are Rue, Katniss, and Peeta. What happens then? If Katniss values Rue's life over her own, does Peeta respect that choice or still seeks to keep Katniss alive at any cost? Does Katniss kill Peeta and then herself so that Rue can live?

Or does Rue somehow manage to kill them both to be the victor and her innocent angelic thing was all a clever ruse? Or it wasn't a ruse, she's still the same Rue but when it comes down to it she wants to live and values her life over the life of her friends.


Not actively pursuing and killing the other competitors in NOT the same as not making a choice. She was forced (with some slight volunteering) into a situation where she was presented with 2 options (Kill or be killed), and chose the third (survival). This choosing the third, non-presented, option is not unique to this story and is a common element in stories themed around maintaining morality in an "immoral" environment.
While she did try to avoid killing and preferred to get away and survive where she could, she never actually refused or refrained from killing, except with people for whom she cares (Peeta, Rue). I think the reviewer touched on that, that she was never in a position to refuse that option. For instance, the guy from Rue's district letting her go, or the Foxface girl, could both have been instances of morally conflicting choices. Neither was a "villain" per se, and were presented somewhat sympathetically, but they were also conveniently removed without Katniss having to make a choice about their lives or hers, as the Games bosses would almost certainly not have allowed the loophole they made for her and Peeta. She does use the tracker-jackers on the group below her tree, with full awareness of the possible lethality, so it isn't even like she was trying not to kill anyone, either.

Though the capitol has removed so many of the people's freedoms, Katniss is able to maintain her free will and choose to not descend into the violent murder role that the capitol has chosen for her.
She only refused to kill her friend. I think the reviewer was aware of this issue, but complained that she was spared the necessity of having to make this choice when it could result in her death.

In the end it could be debated that her choice to maintain her morality was more important to her than her own life when she chose double suicide when the gamemakers' reneged on their implied promise of a possible two survivors. I say debate because IIRC it is not 100% clear whether she would have gone though with it even if she felt the gamemakers were going to allow their deaths.
Agreed
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The Hunger Games gets a ... different kind of review. Artsapat - 03/04/2012 03:37:39 PM 2182 Views
"Written by a female with femalist themes" Vivien - 03/04/2012 04:38:54 PM 966 Views
Ok, I did and basically it's garbage. *NM* Vivien - 03/04/2012 04:53:00 PM 786 Views
I grant that I haven't read the Hunger Games yet LadyLorraine - 03/04/2012 05:10:38 PM 914 Views
No, it's totally off. *NM* Aeryn - 03/04/2012 05:39:03 PM 777 Views
fair enough. like I said, I haven't read it yet. *NM* LadyLorraine - 03/04/2012 07:20:34 PM 725 Views
It's not. That's what shallow idiots say about things where women have power or physical skills *NM* Cannoli - 04/04/2012 03:45:22 PM 813 Views
I can only speak for the film, which was not feminist. ironclad - 03/04/2012 06:01:18 PM 879 Views
Where do I start? Vivien - 03/04/2012 07:43:18 PM 888 Views
Hermoine was the most kick ass of the Potter kids. MightyYT - 04/04/2012 03:08:17 AM 752 Views
So? Hunger Games has lots of male characters. Vivien - 04/04/2012 05:30:21 AM 807 Views
But that is exactly what feminist means "it could have been a boy just as well" Aeryn - 04/04/2012 01:42:43 PM 871 Views
His racism point... Artsapat - 04/04/2012 02:32:43 PM 693 Views
Makes me almost wish I knew the source material so I could judge what he is saying A Deathwatch Guard - 03/04/2012 10:50:48 PM 793 Views
Why don't you think the Hunger Games are feminist? Vivien - 03/04/2012 11:17:53 PM 900 Views
Why would I consider it to be femenist? A Deathwatch Guard - 04/04/2012 01:51:24 AM 783 Views
I just don't consider feminism as something that has to be radical. Vivien - 04/04/2012 05:42:59 AM 861 Views
Completely agree with your first paragraph ironclad - 04/04/2012 08:22:35 AM 838 Views
Re: Completely agree with your first paragraph DomA - 04/04/2012 01:43:55 PM 800 Views
To you "feminist" is a dirty word? To me, it means acceptable. Differences in definitions I think Aeryn - 04/04/2012 01:50:32 PM 789 Views
Unfortunately truly ordinary female characters are so rare that the exceptions stand out Aeryn - 04/04/2012 01:49:16 PM 831 Views
Fair enough ironclad - 04/04/2012 02:33:22 PM 870 Views
Stop using female as a noun! Vivien - 04/04/2012 03:51:13 PM 796 Views
It's stuff like that that makes you lose cred ironclad - 04/04/2012 05:26:24 PM 796 Views
It's fairly derogatory as a noun, though, have to agree with Vivien on that one. Legolas - 04/04/2012 07:30:18 PM 791 Views
I don't think Jens was really using it that way, though LadyLorraine - 04/04/2012 07:34:28 PM 725 Views
Thank you! ironclad - 04/04/2012 08:03:38 PM 825 Views
Of course he didn't intend it that way, but that's how it sounds. Legolas - 04/04/2012 08:06:03 PM 808 Views
I understand that, but it's still such a ridiculous thing to get fussed over LadyLorraine - 04/04/2012 09:20:01 PM 845 Views
You are rather exaggerating just how "fussed" anyone did get, you do realize. Legolas - 04/04/2012 09:51:22 PM 761 Views
Her tone was not just "informative". It was accusatory LadyLorraine - 04/04/2012 10:17:57 PM 733 Views
Female is perfectly acceptable to use in a medical/clinical setting. *NM* Vivien - 04/04/2012 10:36:57 PM 976 Views
so if your problem is people using it disparagingly... LadyLorraine - 04/04/2012 10:45:10 PM 705 Views
That's not what I said. Vivien - 04/04/2012 10:51:41 PM 818 Views
I'm going to have to just outright disagree with you then. *NM* LadyLorraine - 04/04/2012 10:54:25 PM 750 Views
Which flies in the face of it's ordinary usage, which smacks of needless revisionism. Dan - 06/04/2012 09:42:15 AM 754 Views
Oh please. Stop telling females to shut up. *NM* Aeryn - 09/04/2012 12:45:58 PM 792 Views
If I wanted to be accusatory... Vivien - 04/04/2012 11:05:37 PM 773 Views
Accusatory of what.i think you meant annoyed. So youre annoyed she was annoyed? Let's out this to re *NM* Aeryn - 09/04/2012 12:44:17 PM 818 Views
Are you a native English speaker, Legolas? (Clarified to preempt possible internet tears) Dan - 06/04/2012 09:29:28 AM 790 Views
Nope. (edit) Legolas - 06/04/2012 07:23:54 PM 788 Views
Re: Nope. (edit) Dan - 07/04/2012 04:51:30 AM 855 Views
"Female that"? That's even worse. Legolas - 07/04/2012 11:42:00 AM 741 Views
Ok. Dan - 07/04/2012 03:27:16 PM 1023 Views
Let's try and whittle this down some so as to help you with the quotes. Legolas - 07/04/2012 05:42:32 PM 740 Views
However he meant it, it was unpleasant to read. Just use "woman" instead. *NM* Aeryn - 05/04/2012 08:13:13 PM 688 Views
Re: It's fairly derogatory as a noun, though, have to agree with Vivien on that one. DomA - 05/04/2012 02:21:21 AM 795 Views
I think the language difference is really interesting. nossy - 05/04/2012 03:13:03 PM 803 Views
English is not French, and it's not German. Particularly the connotations of American English words Dan - 06/04/2012 09:39:00 AM 868 Views
LOL! You don't say... DomA - 06/04/2012 05:06:20 PM 773 Views
LOL u so mad Dan - 06/04/2012 06:19:28 PM 769 Views
The prospect of "losing cred" is not going to stop me from speaking my mind. Vivien - 04/04/2012 10:30:03 PM 751 Views
My dear Aeryn - 09/04/2012 01:07:34 PM 799 Views
LOL ironclad - 09/04/2012 01:57:53 PM 647 Views
guess what, it is a noun. *NM* LadyLorraine - 04/04/2012 07:26:39 PM 631 Views
That's the first time I have ever heard/seen anyone say that. nossy - 04/04/2012 08:19:02 PM 769 Views
well it's important that you say "female human" LadyLorraine - 04/04/2012 09:28:45 PM 759 Views
Re: That's the first time I have ever heard/seen anyone say that. Vivien - 04/04/2012 10:48:07 PM 750 Views
wait, so now you're claiming it's a grammatical thing? *NM* LadyLorraine - 04/04/2012 10:58:31 PM 753 Views
No, I have issues with words that begin with the letter f. Vivien - 04/04/2012 11:09:45 PM 781 Views
ooookay then. LadyLorraine - 04/04/2012 11:11:23 PM 838 Views
Re: That's the first time I have ever heard/seen anyone say that. nossy - 05/04/2012 02:08:26 AM 820 Views
Re: Stop using female as a noun! dacole - 05/04/2012 02:18:47 PM 701 Views
If dislike of the use of female as a noun makes me crazy town, I'm not the only crazy in here. Vivien - 05/04/2012 05:59:16 PM 738 Views
For the record, I certainly don't think you're crazy town. nossy - 05/04/2012 07:23:18 PM 752 Views
Oh, so now we're using 'dislike' instead of 'should'. It's funny how you fell back on that. Dan - 06/04/2012 10:01:59 AM 769 Views
Fascinating. Vivien - 06/04/2012 09:54:47 PM 797 Views
Re: Fascinating. Dan - 07/04/2012 03:54:26 AM 775 Views
Just in case (however slim that chance may be) you are genuinely interested in citations/references. Vivien - 07/04/2012 05:34:37 AM 775 Views
What a joke. Do you even know what grammar is? Dan - 07/04/2012 05:57:40 AM 834 Views
Oh, come off it. This should be the point where you admit to being wrong. Legolas - 07/04/2012 12:11:07 PM 709 Views
Sorry, no. Read better. Dan - 07/04/2012 02:23:10 PM 749 Views
*deletes long reply* Let's focus on the essence here. Legolas - 07/04/2012 06:38:08 PM 735 Views
Re: *deletes long reply* Let's focus on the essence here. Dan - 07/04/2012 09:26:34 PM 839 Views
Aha, we found the problem Aeryn - 09/04/2012 01:03:35 PM 822 Views
You're being disingenuous. Aeryn - 09/04/2012 12:57:38 PM 749 Views
Re: If dislike of the use of female as a noun makes me crazy town, I'm not the only crazy in here. dacole - 09/04/2012 03:09:06 AM 763 Views
Nothing wrong with your use of female. You should ignore those crazy foreigners saying otherwise. *NM* snoopcester - 06/04/2012 02:49:41 PM 653 Views
I think I'll start saying males instead of men. If the males here don't mind? *NM* Aeryn - 09/04/2012 12:58:54 PM 737 Views
To be fair Artsapat - 04/04/2012 02:37:25 PM 788 Views
You didn't see thmovie? She is far from passive Aeryn - 04/04/2012 01:46:16 PM 812 Views
Re: You didn't see thmovie? She is far from passive Artsapat - 04/04/2012 02:23:33 PM 761 Views
Re: You didn't see thmovie? She is far from passive Bored - 04/04/2012 07:51:46 PM 778 Views
This Cannoli - 05/04/2012 12:20:04 AM 758 Views
Interesting. I really need to read these books soon, evidently. *NM* Legolas - 03/04/2012 10:52:43 PM 724 Views
I got half way through the review and got bored. MightyYT - 04/04/2012 03:09:58 AM 733 Views
And it appears the writer of the article completely missed a central point of the story *spoilers* Mat Maniac - 04/04/2012 05:44:40 AM 798 Views
I think that might be debatable Cannoli - 05/04/2012 06:59:35 PM 772 Views
She still made plenty of choices and she did choose to kill. Vivien - 05/04/2012 07:13:47 PM 722 Views
The reviewer is kind of full of it, but makes a good point about the character Cannoli - 04/04/2012 04:22:30 PM 823 Views
Out of curiosity (this off topic) LadyLorraine - 04/04/2012 07:32:25 PM 721 Views
Rachel, of course. Cannoli - 05/04/2012 12:17:41 AM 780 Views
Well. Now I've actually seen it. (mild spoilers) Legolas - 09/04/2012 12:17:03 AM 832 Views
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