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The more, the merrier. Aemon Send a noteboard - 19/04/2011 05:26:29 PM
My friend and I have the exact same LG model LCD-HD, only his is 120hz and mine is 240hz. The SOA is considerably more noticeble on his TV than mine, to the extent that I don't see it on mine but do on his.


This could be a matter of settings. It's hard to say without knowing specifics, but a lot of times those "automotion" (branding name differs) features have multiple levels corresponding to the amount of smoothing being applied. If his tv is set to use a greater degree of smoothing than yours, it may have a greater SOA, despite having a lesser refresh rate. As to whether 240 makes a difference over 120 in general. . .eh. Depends on who you ask. I've not compared them in person, so I can't make this call. I will point out, though, that the human eye can only detect so much "smoothness," and you definitely get diminishing returns as you go up the refresh rate ladder. Maybe there's another reason besides additional smoothness to set 240 above 120, but, if so, I don't know what it is.

It appears that 120hz leads to 5:5 pulldown, but from there I'm not sure why the SOA is still present as the odd framing rate is resolved. Shouldn't that clear the "judder", or is that something different than SOA?


From everything I've read, these are two different issues. If I understand DomA correctly, he seems to be saying that isn't so. I don't believe he's right on that, but he does seem to be something of an expert, so you can decide who to believe. :P I tried to provide at least one link to back up what I was saying, but the site I linked to was hardly the authority on such matters, so. . .*shrugs* In any case, I'll explain the issue as I understand it.

1) Soap Opera Effect: everything looks "too smooth." This is caused by the TV's circuitry algorithmically creating intermediate frames, instead of displaying the same frame many times in a row.

2) Judder: This is caused by a tv running at a frame rate that is not a multiple of the source input. Typically, you will find this when watching 24fps input (most blu-rays) on a 60hz tv (most low-end televisions). The following link will explain the technical side of the problem better than I can: link.

To prevent judder when watching 24p source material, you need a tv capable of refreshing at a multiple of 24. This is common for LCDs, which often have 120 or 240hz modes. These tvs generally have a "cinema" mode (again, it's called a lot of different things) that sets the tv to use its higher refresh rate, WITHOUT using the automotion processing that causes the SOA. In other words, it displays one frame five times, followed by the next at five times, etc. Rather than displaying one frame, then displaying four algorithmically generated intermediate frames, then the next "real" frame, etc.

With my 240hz, the math says that's a 10:10 pulldown. Is that correct? Could that alone be reason for why I don't see the SOA on my TV compared to his? I will admit that I'm not sure of the status of Truemotion for either TV atm. Is there something about 120hz which doesn't clear the SOA but 240hz would?


I'm still betting it's a matter of settings. You probably have your automotion processing set lower than he does. As I understand it, the SOA is basically just the picture being "too smooth," and (in theory) a 240hz tv should be capable of more smoothness than a 120hz tv. Whether that's noticeable in practice is up for debate.

Either way, djwilons post seems vastly exaggerated regarding the ineffectiveness of LCD-HD's. My TV picture is beautiful, everyone comments on it's awesomeness, blu-rays (especially Avatar) are a dream to see, and standard DVD's even shine like never before. Gaming of course rocks. :|


LCD HDTVs have a great picture, no doubt about that. The soap opera effect of automotion processing bothers some people, but other people love it. For those who don't, just turning it off should work fine. I have no idea what your tv is set to use, but I'd say you either don't have a lot of processing enabled, or else you've learned to like the SOA. :P Either one is perfectly fine, and I'm sure you've got a great tv.
This message last edited by Aemon on 19/04/2011 at 05:27:06 PM
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