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Re: It was a little tongue in cheek fionwe1987 Send a noteboard - 01/07/2020 06:23:20 AM

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I believe prison reform is necessary. I believe police reform is also necessary. I do not accept the far right planks of the Republican platform. I am a moderate. A centrist. I also reject the far left planks of the Democratic platform.


If this is true, then your choice is beyond clear, for this election at least. The far right plank of the Republican Party is in control of it. The far left flank of the Democratic party is... Incredibly not.

I'm incredibly invested in it's rise. I'm a huge fan of AOC and Pramila Jayapal and Ayanna Pressly and the new wave of smart, talented, forward thinking progressives in the party. But they do not control the party.

They're also pretty clear eyed about that, and the fact that the Democratic party is a big tent. I can link you to interviews from Jayapal and AOC where they say so clearly, and accept that while in another other country, they'd be part of a different party, they know their coalition has plenty of people who are centrists. Which means going along with half-measures and compromise when necessary.

And it isn't just words. They've bucked Pelosi once in a while, but unlike the far Right plank of the GoP, the Progressive caucus and the Squad are pretty clearly on the record settling for what they see as half measures as preferable to burning the House down because they don't get their way.

Their rise, of course, is fueled by the realization that many "centrists" have ended up compromising by voting for a Far Right plank. Where owning the libs matters more than any governing, conservative or liberal. That has been incredibly frustrating to many young people who see a world burning while the majority of government is focussed on not even passing half-measures.

If you want to keep them contained, voting for the GoP simply won't help. Maybe you stave them off this election. But it won't last. Your better bet is to work for the end of the GoP as it is. You want the Bidens and Schumers of this world as the center left party that is broadly socially liberal but fiscally conservative, without letting that mean complete blindness to the need for regulation to prevent things like Climate change, and without idiotic notions of mask wearing taking away freedom.

Which leaves AoC, Warren, etc to form a left party whose focus is economic and climate progressivism. Putting the balance back between conservatism and progressivism where it belongs, rather than this mutant idiocy where one side represents an increasingly isolated sliver of America that needs to be appeased with nativist, racist bullshit, and all pretense of fiscal conservatism is tossed aside in the name of owning the libs. And on the other side, you have this uncomfortable "enemy of my enemy is my friend" party that is becoming increasingly unwieldy.

I think your choice this election is clear. Send the resounding message that nativism and racism are not acceptable. That polarization for the sake of it that results in a shameful performance containing a disease that it is quite possible to contain isn't something that happens without consequence.

<Quote> AOC said today that reallocation of some of the NYPD budget is not enough. Defund means completely defund. I believe that is madness. Murders have already spiked in Democratic run cities like New York where the police are under political and literal assault. How much worse could it get?

I went looking for quotes on this. I'll quote the Washington Examiner, which even you can accuse of being a left-wing mouth piece:


“Defunding police means defunding police,” the Democrat said in a statement Tuesday to the Gotham Gazette, Fox News reported. “It does not mean budget tricks or funny math. It does not mean moving school police officers from the NYPD budget to the Department of Education’s budget so the exact same police remain in schools.
...
It does not mean counting overtime cuts as cuts, even as NYPD ignores every attempt by City Council to curb overtime spending and overspends on overtime anyways,” she continued. “It does not mean hiring more police officers while cutting more than $800 million from NYC schools.

“If these reports are accurate, then these proposed ‘cuts’ to the NYPD budget are a disingenuous illusion,” she added. “This is not a victory. The fight to defund policing continues.”


She's opposing window dressing "cuts". Defund the police doesn't mean letting murders rage unchecked. It means unbundling things like mental health support, school safety, etc from policing. Didn't you agree with this in the other thread? What in AoCs statement makes you think she wants to eliminate cops? Don't just read the headline. Read her full statements, and tell me what is specifically objectionable in her irritation at the NyC city councils attempt at placation that doesn't actually change anything?

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.washingtontimes.com/news/2020/jun/30/aoc-says-nypd-budget-cuts-not-enough-defunding-pol/


I am extremely conflicted right now. Six months ago I was firmly in the red camp for the sake of my retirement. Not so much anymore. So much has changed.

Give me a break fionwe. I’m trying.

I'll move past what exactly you think was so rosy 6 months ago when insane wildfires were raging in Australia, we nearly got to war with Iran over nothing, no witnesses were allowed in the Senate trial of Trump's impeachment, and Trump was blithely praising China's response to the Coronavirus and ask...

What exactly are you waiting for? What event will convince you that short term thinkers, itself a phrase that is laughable when applied to Trump, cannot steward the economy for any length of time to success?

As our economy has ground to a halt, and you've seen that the idea that the growth personal wealth cannot be completely severed from the consequences of the severe inequality in the country, and that a complete divorce from reality can keep a presidency going has been shown to be an absurd fantasy... What <I>fact</I> of this administration makes you think 4 more years of Trump on the helm, or the complete obstructionism of the GOP Senate is going to be good for this country, for you, or your pocketbook?

Is there another round of tax cuts that you think will solve everything that is wrong? Some more hedge fund deregulation? Ending Obamacare?

Trump hasn't even signaled this is his plan for his second administration. When Sean Hannity asked him this low-ball question:

""What's at stake in this election as you compare and contrast, and what are your top priority items for a second term?""

To this, Trump answered, and I shit you not...

“One of the things that will be really great — the word experience is still good, I always say talent is more important than experience, I’ve always said that — but the word experience is a very important word, a very important meaning,” Trump said.

Watch the entire discussion, as Trump then launches into an attack on Bolton (who will, one presumes, not be a part of Trump's second term, but who knows?). Is this cunning plan giving you goosebumps?

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It was a little tongue in cheek - 01/07/2020 04:20:08 AM 365 Views
Re: It was a little tongue in cheek - 01/07/2020 06:23:20 AM 352 Views
a couple of points - 01/07/2020 07:42:32 PM 358 Views
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Re: a couple of points - 01/07/2020 10:05:08 PM 359 Views
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yes I suppose it was a foolish comment. - 01/07/2020 05:44:05 PM 356 Views
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I kind of did when I wrote it, lame as it sounds now. - 01/07/2020 07:51:21 PM 330 Views
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Part of real common ground, real synchronization - 01/07/2020 11:43:49 PM 318 Views
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Found the article (or at least something similar). - 01/07/2020 11:04:53 PM 339 Views

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