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Because we do not live in Paradise. Jeordam Send a noteboard - 17/06/2020 05:36:58 PM

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But you're asking the wrong questions. It's not "does the worker deserve $15/hr," but "why is the wealth being created by the worker going somewhere other than to him?" And the answer is simple: because somebody else owns the franchise. That person extracts wealth by virtue of allowing people to operate the means of production.

If our country WEREN'T captivated by the lust for money, why are there people choosing between rent and medicine each month?


"Why is the wealth being created by the worker going somewhere other than to him?" I'd say because that worker isn't generating wealth in a vacuum. Instead, that worker is generating wealth selling a product (which he didn't buy), cooking with tools (which he didn't buy), and selling to customers (which he didn't attract). That worker is not entitled to the full wealth that he is helping to generate.

And why are some people choosing between rent & medicine? The simple answer is that we don't live in a perfect world, and they are going to have to make some decisions on what is the most needed. Most of us will never live in a situation where every need is met. Almost none of us will live in a world where every want is met. The more nuanced answer is that all of the financial decisions that the individual has/is making would need to be examined to see if the choice is truly between rent and medicine.

~Jeordam

ex-Admin at wotmania (all things wot & art galleries)
Saving the Princess, Humanity, or the World-Entire since 1985
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I'm curious. damookster - 08/06/2020 06:59:18 PM 1131 Views
Knowledge is always uncertain, there will always be under and overreactions. Roland00 - 08/06/2020 07:06:35 PM 356 Views
I would expect so, yes. *NM* Legolas - 08/06/2020 08:00:59 PM 192 Views
That yes is for which question? Or is it for both? *NM* damookster - 08/06/2020 08:23:06 PM 195 Views
The first one. Otherwise I'd have said no and yes. *NM* Legolas - 08/06/2020 09:19:48 PM 188 Views
Yes, I believe we will... fionwe1987 - 08/06/2020 10:15:30 PM 387 Views
Why are you so invested in either closing down the country or the seriousness of the flu? Cannoli - 09/06/2020 06:37:24 PM 428 Views
Because I care about my fellow human being, cockroach. Go infest somewhere else. I'm done with you. *NM* fionwe1987 - 09/06/2020 08:35:42 PM 201 Views
Except you don't. You really, REALLY want this disease to be worse than it is. Cannoli - 12/06/2020 11:06:50 AM 395 Views
Sure. Anyone who disagrees with you wants mass poverty or mass death. No other possibility exists... fionwe1987 - 12/06/2020 02:44:08 PM 381 Views
Fionwe same as other alt-left crazies Nargs - 16/06/2020 05:24:12 PM 416 Views
I dunno what's "alt" about it. We're the mainstream. Which must scare you fionwe1987 - 16/06/2020 06:06:44 PM 370 Views
Dissonance Nargs - 16/06/2020 08:02:08 PM 367 Views
Do you think it's possible to disagree, even vehemently damookster - 16/06/2020 08:14:50 PM 410 Views
I'm sure it is, in some conditions. fionwe1987 - 16/06/2020 09:43:50 PM 395 Views
I am not a middle aged white man. I'm an old white man. damookster - 16/06/2020 06:15:52 PM 409 Views
Evidence is not on your side, damook *NM* Nargs - 16/06/2020 07:27:39 PM 202 Views
Much like... Jeordam - 16/06/2020 07:34:14 PM 424 Views
Statistically Insignificant Nargs - 16/06/2020 08:07:03 PM 362 Views
Stats don't tell the whole story. damookster - 16/06/2020 08:06:17 PM 352 Views
You're right but on race? Nargs - 16/06/2020 08:08:40 PM 396 Views
Yes, you're right. damookster - 16/06/2020 08:17:04 PM 354 Views
You realize that's not a contradiction, right? fionwe1987 - 16/06/2020 09:49:56 PM 386 Views
A few points gban007 - 17/06/2020 09:29:15 PM 374 Views
I wasn't going to say it but... Nargs - 16/06/2020 08:17:57 PM 402 Views
Again: you really are a loathsome little ball of slime. Ghavrel - 10/06/2020 02:11:52 AM 363 Views
It's not my world, it's theirs. Cannoli - 12/06/2020 11:13:14 AM 393 Views
Burning down corporate stores and taking their stolen wealth is a moral good. *NM* Ghavrel - 15/06/2020 12:04:52 AM 202 Views
Stolen Wealth? Jeordam - 15/06/2020 04:50:59 PM 390 Views
How does one determine what is Original Sin? Roland00 - 15/06/2020 05:17:37 PM 380 Views
So then.... Jeordam - 15/06/2020 09:59:31 PM 370 Views
I'm uncertain if this is what Ghavrel meant, but I'd assume you don't need proof that slavery... fionwe1987 - 15/06/2020 07:59:07 PM 366 Views
So we're talking about reparations....? Jeordam - 15/06/2020 09:42:37 PM 381 Views
Why must money solve "all" issues? fionwe1987 - 15/06/2020 11:32:05 PM 356 Views
So then money won't... Jeordam - 16/06/2020 06:09:24 PM 365 Views
fionwe1987 - 16/06/2020 06:29:59 PM 372 Views
Those aren't codified examples Jeordam - 16/06/2020 07:31:49 PM 368 Views
Well that's some special nonsense fionwe1987 - 16/06/2020 09:55:42 PM 378 Views
We're having a discussion...please try and not denigrate me. Jeordam - 17/06/2020 05:26:36 PM 362 Views
But I didn't clearly state I want to denigrate you. You're inferring intent. How's that ok? fionwe1987 - 17/06/2020 06:06:28 PM 366 Views
Pain and Death they *actively* choose... Jeordam - 17/06/2020 06:39:13 PM 391 Views
They make no such choice. Which is why they're out there protesting fionwe1987 - 17/06/2020 07:00:25 PM 415 Views
Sigh Roland00 - 16/06/2020 08:15:12 PM 349 Views
Nah I just straight up think capitalism is evil. Reparations should be paid, though. *NM* Ghavrel - 16/06/2020 09:22:46 AM 178 Views
Fair enough. *NM* fionwe1987 - 16/06/2020 02:54:11 PM 178 Views
aaah... Jeordam - 16/06/2020 06:10:16 PM 379 Views
Re: Stolen Wealth? Ghavrel - 16/06/2020 09:21:32 AM 343 Views
Rather it should be The State? *NM* damookster - 16/06/2020 12:10:59 PM 178 Views
What is "the State" fionwe1987 - 16/06/2020 02:57:34 PM 347 Views
my comment was directed to Ghavrel. damookster - 16/06/2020 04:49:39 PM 353 Views
You shouldn't make assumptions... fionwe1987 - 16/06/2020 06:10:02 PM 357 Views
Lemme tell you about this cool thing called syndicalism... *NM* Ghavrel - 17/06/2020 06:46:38 AM 189 Views
There's a lot I like about that... *NM* fionwe1987 - 17/06/2020 06:07:47 PM 165 Views
Syndicalisme révolutionnaire, peut-être? *NM* damookster - 17/06/2020 06:29:00 PM 162 Views
I'm actually still a reformist, believe it or not. *NM* Ghavrel - 18/06/2020 03:29:18 PM 178 Views
Bah *NM* damookster - 18/06/2020 03:36:20 PM 162 Views
I been thinking about the different religious sects of Himboism, suddenly ... Roland00 - 29/06/2020 01:30:09 AM 340 Views
The only state with legitimacy is the Kingdom of Heaven. *NM* Ghavrel - 16/06/2020 08:57:26 PM 170 Views
Are we talking about the Mormon Sect? Roland00 - 16/06/2020 09:06:14 PM 338 Views
My bad damookster - 16/06/2020 10:20:14 PM 367 Views
In fairness, I usually talk policy goals as a social democrat. Ghavrel - 17/06/2020 12:34:45 AM 353 Views
They The Shrike - 17/06/2020 06:29:35 PM 379 Views
damookster - 17/06/2020 06:40:30 PM 389 Views
I go by she and her, but thank you. <3 *NM* Ghavrel - 18/06/2020 03:45:46 PM 191 Views
I try to be very sensitive to this. damookster - 18/06/2020 03:55:01 PM 385 Views
It means a great deal to me. I can't overstate how much it means to your grandson. *NM* Ghavrel - 18/06/2020 04:04:53 PM 207 Views
Catholicism by itself is a Performance Arts Piece Roland00 - 18/06/2020 01:17:45 AM 357 Views
A Catholic?! What?! I'm an Episcopalian. Ghavrel - 18/06/2020 03:45:24 PM 401 Views
No thanks. Not into non-democracies. *NM* The Shrike - 17/06/2020 06:26:29 PM 175 Views
Ah a fellow Devil's Party Member. *NM* Roland00 - 18/06/2020 01:13:37 AM 157 Views
I can empathize with this view, actually, though I no longer hold it. *NM* Ghavrel - 18/06/2020 03:47:24 PM 188 Views
That's the debate, isn't it. Jeordam - 16/06/2020 06:16:10 PM 348 Views
Economists have been arguing this for over 400 years. Roland00 - 16/06/2020 08:22:57 PM 347 Views
You could let the market determine that, I guess. Ghavrel - 16/06/2020 08:56:23 PM 375 Views
Because we do not live in Paradise. Jeordam - 17/06/2020 05:36:58 PM 344 Views
Exactly. So the worker should own the means of production with other workers. Ghavrel - 17/06/2020 06:11:21 PM 351 Views
So my question then is.... Jeordam - 17/06/2020 06:46:11 PM 377 Views
Sigh...I just can't not. Roland00 - 18/06/2020 01:20:09 AM 332 Views
You know "talent" in the Bible is explictly referring to money, right? Ghavrel - 18/06/2020 03:43:11 PM 377 Views
Jesus also said it is easier for a camel to pass though a needle's eye... damookster - 18/06/2020 03:49:43 PM 342 Views
This is true! Ghavrel - 18/06/2020 04:04:16 PM 391 Views
Thou shalt not steal. *NM* The Shrike - 15/06/2020 11:10:34 PM 172 Views
"Ye blind guides, which strain at a gnat, and swallow a camel." *NM* Ghavrel - 16/06/2020 09:19:26 AM 173 Views
"Render unto Caesar the things that are Caesar's" *NM* damookster - 16/06/2020 12:13:15 PM 153 Views
Pride goes before destruction, and a haughty spirit before a fall. *NM* The Shrike - 16/06/2020 12:15:04 PM 164 Views
"Your gold and silver is cankered; and the rust of them shall be a witness against you..." *NM* Ghavrel - 16/06/2020 10:15:41 PM 180 Views
Is a concern of mine gban007 - 08/06/2020 10:16:09 PM 403 Views
A natural experiment fionwe1987 - 08/06/2020 10:42:34 PM 344 Views
Yes, we probably will. But demonstrators wearing masks are not normal life. Ghavrel - 09/06/2020 07:10:31 AM 384 Views
I'm not sure that's a valid comparison. damookster - 09/06/2020 05:57:31 PM 344 Views
Agreed. These aren't comparable situations. fionwe1987 - 09/06/2020 06:09:27 PM 359 Views
Down South that is called Communism Mookie. Roland00 - 09/06/2020 06:32:06 PM 347 Views
Alabama is down south, right? aerocontrols - 09/06/2020 10:08:15 PM 352 Views
I was comparing it to a control situation of no state action in response to SARS-CoV-2. Ghavrel - 10/06/2020 02:09:19 AM 358 Views
We have all the same rules here in Seattle Bad Ash - 10/06/2020 07:45:59 PM 367 Views
I figured you aerocontrols - 09/06/2020 10:09:36 PM 350 Views
About your original question... fionwe1987 - 17/06/2020 09:25:38 PM 375 Views
that is encouraging damookster - 17/06/2020 09:44:10 PM 380 Views
Re: that is encouraging fionwe1987 - 17/06/2020 10:10:34 PM 358 Views
Seems indoors with strangers is more a predictor than outdoor protests. Roland00 - 27/06/2020 02:38:07 AM 442 Views
Tips, maybe? fionwe1987 - 27/06/2020 05:10:30 AM 394 Views
Perhaps Roland00 - 27/06/2020 10:19:39 PM 334 Views
A 315 city study, BLM protests did not cause a spike in COVID cases. Roland00 - 27/06/2020 10:19:05 PM 350 Views
Sigh, here is some bad news. Case Reports and a Lab study suggests COVID may cause type 1 diabetes Roland00 - 28/06/2020 06:11:45 AM 323 Views
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