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You are making assumptions here. Roland00 Send a noteboard - 13/02/2019 01:27:12 AM

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Maybe. Even today many doctors and private hospitals won't accept new Medicare patients due to the caps in the payment schedule. If you assume Medicare would have to accept anyone who wanted to buy in, irrespective of preexisting conditions, then it would have much more inherent risk. Which means higher costs or even lower payouts, making it even less desirable for health care providers.

Medicare for all would have to be a single payer system with all other forms of health insurance disbanded. Obviously this is the end goal for those who promote it.


You are making assumptions here and they are betraying biases you may not be completely aware of. For example in the UK (and numerous other countries I am not going to list them all) private and public insurance can coexist and not the whole entire market suddenly decides to drop Medicare.

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For example you assumed that Medicare buy in will be a high risk pool and nobody without pre-existing conditions will buy health insurance that does not have a pre-existing condition. People will want to buy health insurance even if they do not have a pre-existing condition. People will buy health insurance from a private or public source based off cost and benefits, many people do not have an ideology that assumes private is automatically going to be better, or public is automatically going to be better.

Have you ever consider that a medicare buy in will also have employers who will buy their employees in compared to private insurance?

You can't just assume that a medicare buy in will turn into a high risk pool. Furthermore even if the youth has a pre-existing condition covering a younger person that is 18 to 64 is often cheaper than a 65+ person. Sometimes a person with a pre-existing condition that is younger will be more expensive than an older person generally and sometimes this is not the case. Furthermore older people have more pre-existing conditions generally so we are also comparing not a healthy old person to an unhealthy young person in a binary fashion but instead dealing with a dataset that is far more complex.

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Furthermore if you think only high risk people will join a Medicare Buy In (which is a huge assumption I have already dealt with), depending on the details of the plan in the 2nd or 3rd year when the costs for the buy in patients goes up based off the numbers of the 1st year, the buy in cost should go up accordingly.

How is this different than the current status quo where patients either can't have insurance due to cost, or they do have insurance but they are put in an unfortunate situation where costs are keeping on going up? Where is the harm of having a new version of the status quo which is similar to the existing status quo? Under your logic Damookster we did not harm anyone we just created an arbitrage that no one really win or loss we just have a public system that mirrors the private system.

But the possible gain for this "risk" to cause a change is your great fear may not occur. From a betting / odds perspective you should take this change.

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The details of these plans matter, and assuming you know the details will be good or bad without seeing the details is ideology speaking. You are not really thinking or evaluating, instead it is "reflex" aka a form of "habit" without true analysis.

"The devil is in the details", but also simultaneously quote Not all angels reside in heaven. Some walk the earth." Reality is a mixed kind-of-thing to see reality as it really is we have to look, and to evaluate any form of legislation the legislation has to be written and only then can it be analyzed. Until then we are asking "How many angels can dance on the head of a pin?" And such conversations are pure motivated reasoning nonsense where people talk past each other if your goal is to win these conversations.

There is no winning or losing in these conversations instead it is an exchange of values where two people try to synchronize or they do not try to synchronize. What is the German Term again? It is often translated as "Transvaluation of Values," or a Re-examining which values you prioritizes and whether these values are valuable.

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Medicare for All - just add 36% points to your marginal tax rate - - 11/02/2019 02:30:53 PM 1052 Views
That is just to cover the additional costs. - 11/02/2019 03:36:23 PM 526 Views
Very good point! *NM* - 11/02/2019 04:07:17 PM 281 Views
But I heard we can just print some $1 Trillion coins and pay for it that way *NM* - 11/02/2019 03:38:01 PM 289 Views
All paid via Bitcoins! - 11/02/2019 04:07:46 PM 490 Views
I can't even imagine... - 11/02/2019 04:47:31 PM 542 Views
Agreed, it would destroy a lot of households. *NM* - 12/02/2019 04:59:45 AM 312 Views
You realize this is a ridiculous comparison, right? - 11/02/2019 06:06:55 PM 700 Views
Eliminating my health insurance costs benefits my employer far more than me. - 11/02/2019 06:34:44 PM 556 Views
I agree, it's not obvious where that money would go. - 11/02/2019 08:14:31 PM 544 Views
The Trump tax cuts put an extra $300 per month in my take-home pay. - 11/02/2019 08:18:04 PM 518 Views
I was talking about the corporate tax reduction part. - 11/02/2019 08:39:08 PM 544 Views
So if they just took the money your employer is already paying... *NM* - 11/02/2019 11:43:02 PM 298 Views
Mookie why can't I buy into Medicare, why do you get Medicare? - 12/02/2019 12:47:42 AM 513 Views
I do not have Medicare even though I’m old enough to qualify. - 12/02/2019 12:52:04 AM 505 Views
I repeat why can't I buy into Medicare? - 12/02/2019 01:06:26 AM 482 Views
I liked Mike Tyson’s version. - 12/02/2019 03:06:51 AM 513 Views
I never answered your question, did I? - 13/02/2019 12:33:55 AM 493 Views
Buy in, he said. - 13/02/2019 12:41:29 AM 494 Views
Less than private insurance? - 13/02/2019 12:59:44 AM 493 Views
You are making assumptions here. - 13/02/2019 01:27:12 AM 492 Views
You’re right, I am. - 13/02/2019 02:08:02 AM 506 Views
Nothing wrong with that - 13/02/2019 03:18:40 AM 506 Views
I’m sorry Roland that your experiences have been so negative. - 13/02/2019 03:33:20 AM 504 Views
by the way, I’m on my third dirty Cajun martini... - 13/02/2019 03:41:51 AM 503 Views
It is probably good that I am broke right now - 13/02/2019 04:21:37 AM 516 Views
Yup... - 13/02/2019 05:00:42 AM 491 Views
Yes , you are right - 13/02/2019 05:16:07 AM 522 Views
I'll have to take your word for it... - 11/02/2019 07:14:15 PM 532 Views
Fair enough. - 11/02/2019 08:22:13 PM 510 Views
*nods* - 11/02/2019 10:16:12 PM 529 Views
Is it really wasteful? I think that is just your moral intuition. - 12/02/2019 12:55:21 AM 479 Views
Have you ever worked with the US government? - 12/02/2019 05:30:44 PM 523 Views
I can't import the paperwork and accounting software without importing their values? - 12/02/2019 06:08:07 PM 493 Views
As someone who writes technical documents and consults with software.... - 12/02/2019 09:30:33 PM 495 Views
Too many cooks, thus we must remain with the Status Quo? *NM* - 12/02/2019 10:06:32 PM 264 Views
On US government inefficiency... - 13/02/2019 12:45:39 AM 509 Views
I agree with you. - 13/02/2019 06:42:21 PM 466 Views
How is it ridiculous? - 12/02/2019 12:45:40 AM 520 Views

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