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They should keep making them actually filibuster, yes. Joel Send a noteboard - 18/01/2010 10:09:01 PM
It requires some real commitment rather than just partisan rancor, and that you find enough people who sincerely don't want the legislation (rather than simply wanting to stop an opponent) to get up there and say why. It also makes really ASININE filibusters look like what they are, forces Senators on each side to make a decent case to the public. I don't think it's a coincidence that it was after Strom Thurmond stood up there reading the Bible aloud to stop the Civil Rights Act (and didn't see any hypocrisy in it) that they decided "OK, you don't have to actually ARGUE AGAINST a bill, just vote against ending debate. )

I don't really think the filibuster is within the spirit of the Constitution; if the Founders had wanted that as a standing inviolable rule they could have put it in the Constitution. It's there SOLELY because each chamber is allowed to set its own rules, in much the same way we all have the right to freedom of assembly but any local mayor can prevent an assembly by requiring a permit they refuse to issue. It wouldn't be a problem if DC weren't so partisan now, if the filibuster only came up in sweeping legislation, but when :censored: Republicans filibuster Clintons judicial nominees and ten years later :censored: Democrats filibuster Bushs while the same Republicans who led the previous one call it "unprecedented" there's not much you can do. Both sides are becoming the same, and for all the accusations of extremism from both sides, both the charges and their basis are 95% rhetoric: Neither party will veer too far from the center, because that cedes victory to the other, but that leaves a choice between John Jackson and Jack Johnson. I actually don't want to get rid of the filibuster, it feels wrong, but if it continues to be used more and more often and partisanly, maybe that's the lesser of two evils.

Which is a real shame, because many things need reform at a fundamental level here. We need a more progressive tax system with a lot less write offs and loop holes (George W. Bush paid a lower percentage tax in 1992 than my mother did, even though he earned about ten times more and she'd just declared bankruptcy. ) Our educational system is worse than ever; I was just talking with someone yesterday who thought athletic scholarships were stupid, but I pointed out that education if often a function of class over here, and such things were designed to alleviate that. It's a completely different paradigm when the state pays for most schooling and all that determines whether and where you go to college is whether you've taken advantages of the opportunities provided. Our healthcare system is a sad joke; forget Canada: MEXICO is starting to have problems with Americans coming down there to mooch medical care they can't afford here. When Americans are slipping over the Rio Grande in search of a better life, something is seriously wrong, and shouting "tax and spend" and "creeping socialism" won't change that. Just about every industry you can name has been so successfully deregulated the only way to further protect profits is constant demands for tort reform, but we wonder why banks and investment firms (to the extent there's still a difference) keep conning consumers and taxpayers out of billions.

We are slitting our own throats; I just wish the educational system hadn't been so thoroughly butchered so few can see that.
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Could the Dems really lose in Mass - Kennedy's seat? - 18/01/2010 03:19:29 PM 584 Views
to quote yogi berra: it ain't over till it's over - 18/01/2010 04:10:26 PM 168 Views
Oh, if Brown wins, I'm sure he will be out next election..... - 18/01/2010 04:28:05 PM 167 Views
it works both ways you know - 18/01/2010 04:37:40 PM 179 Views
I disagree... - 20/01/2010 04:11:15 AM 199 Views
Even if he loses and it is close I think it will scare a lot of democrats - 18/01/2010 04:15:03 PM 178 Views
You may be right on that last bit, unfortunately... *NM* - 18/01/2010 04:18:37 PM 80 Views
Agreed - blunder of epic proportions! *NM* - 18/01/2010 04:30:18 PM 78 Views
If we don't get a handle on healthcare it will destroy the economy. - 18/01/2010 06:01:18 PM 169 Views
It makes people question their priorities - 18/01/2010 08:17:16 PM 239 Views
Maybe they should. - 18/01/2010 09:47:11 PM 195 Views
You act like America is a collective - 18/01/2010 10:16:39 PM 254 Views
Is it? What are the Republicans offering for the non-insured? - 18/01/2010 10:20:42 PM 156 Views
Tort reform - 18/01/2010 10:33:01 PM 154 Views
purchase insurance across state lines - 18/01/2010 10:44:54 PM 156 Views
the dems don't see insurance companies as the enemy either - 18/01/2010 11:09:24 PM 155 Views
Exactly. - 19/01/2010 02:09:49 AM 260 Views
that simply proves they are inept - 19/01/2010 01:45:33 PM 153 Views
Of course they did nothing for the 6 years they controlled Congress. - 19/01/2010 12:39:44 AM 162 Views
That isn't true, my mother-in-law can now afford to buy her medicine - 19/01/2010 01:57:28 PM 235 Views
Curious about the last part. - 20/01/2010 12:05:40 AM 245 Views
There are some basic flaws in your argument - 20/01/2010 03:18:58 PM 154 Views
America, like all groups of people, IS a collective, however diverse. - 19/01/2010 02:02:24 AM 287 Views
but it doesn't think like a collective - 20/01/2010 03:25:29 PM 146 Views
Yes, I realize human beings are selfish; that's something to overcome, not embrace. - 20/01/2010 06:21:33 PM 140 Views
Human nature can not be overcome it can only be redirected - 20/01/2010 07:03:46 PM 154 Views
That's a bigger debate than politics. - 20/01/2010 10:42:02 PM 263 Views
I know who I'm voting for! - 18/01/2010 04:26:29 PM 199 Views
I'm starting to think..... - 18/01/2010 04:33:23 PM 180 Views
Certainly, he wouldn't stand a chance without protest votes. *NM* - 18/01/2010 04:45:37 PM 85 Views
That whole "filibuster-proof" concept was a lot more valid... - 18/01/2010 04:44:51 PM 194 Views
I have seen this argument elsewhere and I am not sure it makes sense - 18/01/2010 05:28:57 PM 235 Views
It does not make sense if it's used in a partisan way, that's true. - 18/01/2010 05:43:10 PM 263 Views
I think the fillibuster is with in the spirit and the law on the constitution - 18/01/2010 06:03:55 PM 237 Views
Fair enough. - 18/01/2010 10:00:16 PM 163 Views
Any argument made by Dowd is suspect from the start - 18/01/2010 10:39:28 PM 194 Views
They should keep making them actually filibuster, yes. - 18/01/2010 10:09:01 PM 329 Views
Fight the good fight, my man...er...dog! - 18/01/2010 05:48:08 PM 160 Views

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