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Sorry, I credited you w/knowing the Deep South, Appalachia and TX sound nothing like any UK accents Joel Send a noteboard - 29/07/2015 07:42:21 PM

My bad; I should stop overestimating people, but it will not happen again: Promise.


View original postI said the modern southern accent was close to Victorian English, probably much closer than what is poke in England today.

You also said "the" Southern dialect is the "largest" English one, which is dubious at best. When that doubt was noted, you doubled down by switching the topic from dialect to ACCENT (which is a different thing) and saying the Southern accent (which ONE?!) is most like Victorian English and thus probably most like British English (good luck convincing anyone outside or even most WITHIN the US that the British speak "accented US English.)and modern Englishare : ONE Southern dialect.
View original postBut yes it does all come down to how you subdivide the accents and I went with what linguist say but you go with whatever makes you happy. Just treat it the same way you do politics and religion.

When discussing "ya'll" v. "you guys" etc. it comes down to dialect; accent is a(n irrelevant) question of how to pronounce words like "tomato" that are spelled and used the same in all English dialects. It might be wise to consult Wikipedias authoritarian lingual scholars further before proceeding further here. Either way, while majorities on half of all continents use English as a native language (and the majority of at least one more speaks it,) "ya'll" is rarely found outside the Southern US (ironically, the biggest exception is in urban US areas, largely due to the Great Migration from the South.) In terms of accents (once again) only ONE of many Southern accents is even remotely like Victorian OR modern British English, and that particular "Southern" accent is closer to New Englands, Britains and South Africas than to ANY other Southern one.

Just treat "dialect" and "accent" like "patriotism" and "proof," declaring them redefined however serves your preferred worldview.

Edit, because I forgot to mention: Those OTHER three continents where majorities speak English, even if not as natives? Guess which dialect AND accent most of the instructors demand all students use. Hint: NO American one. Also, another example of the difference between dialect and accent it that, while the word has existed for centuries in dialects throughout the UK, Queen Victorias famous apocryphal line is not "We ain't amused," because that word was beneath the lips of even most of her SERVANTS. This is probably a good place to stop digging.

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This message last edited by Joel on 29/07/2015 at 08:08:36 PM
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Y'all, you guys, yous guys, or hey you all? - 25/07/2015 05:38:44 PM 1046 Views
Y'all may be the American South's greatest gift to the English language. - 27/07/2015 12:14:47 AM 685 Views
*whistles innocently* - 27/07/2015 04:17:43 AM 816 Views
"Hey, you guys!" is only correct if you are Rita Moreno - 27/07/2015 04:15:07 AM 650 Views
Perhaps, but you're also wrong. - 27/07/2015 04:45:48 AM 890 Views
Both spellings are "correct" to the extent EITHER are. - 27/07/2015 05:04:43 AM 871 Views
Funny.... - 29/07/2015 12:13:35 AM 750 Views
It is also correct if you are Sloth... on a pirate ship... *NM* - 29/07/2015 07:09:56 PM 553 Views
I will defer to you and Jeordam on that one - 29/07/2015 07:45:31 PM 724 Views
well since language is a democracy and the souther dialetic is the largest Y'all wins - 27/07/2015 02:07:22 PM 805 Views
The Southern dialect is the largest by what metric? - 27/07/2015 06:26:20 PM 798 Views
It also the accent most similar to what Victorian brits would have spoken - 27/07/2015 07:45:09 PM 720 Views
Whoa, now: The PIEDMONT accent may be closest to Received Pronunciation, but is not the whole South - 28/07/2015 12:37:56 AM 804 Views
I don't make the catagories but all the southern accents tend to be close *NM* - 28/07/2015 02:12:15 PM 502 Views
Except, as you noted, Virginias accent is closer to Englands (and New Englands, and South Africas) - 28/07/2015 11:00:46 PM 767 Views
that is not what I said - 29/07/2015 02:14:49 PM 779 Views
Sorry, I credited you w/knowing the Deep South, Appalachia and TX sound nothing like any UK accents - 29/07/2015 07:42:21 PM 727 Views
read slower and then read again until you understand what I said - 29/07/2015 08:14:19 PM 1002 Views
"The people in the American South were Victorian Brits"?! I must have read that too fast - 29/07/2015 10:39:08 PM 736 Views
Erm. Not really sure what you're saying here... - 29/07/2015 11:35:26 PM 688 Views
Would "UK English" have been better? - 30/07/2015 10:47:53 PM 735 Views
Not really. - 31/07/2015 07:30:41 AM 691 Views
David Crystal estimates proficient non-natives outnumber native English speakers 3:1 - 10/08/2015 02:45:58 AM 667 Views
Interesting stuff. - 10/08/2015 07:12:26 PM 765 Views
Who says "yous guys"? Seriously? - 27/07/2015 07:56:28 PM 717 Views
B-movie mobsters - 28/07/2015 12:40:04 AM 888 Views
They said it when I lived in Chicago - 28/07/2015 02:10:27 PM 704 Views
Scots. - 28/07/2015 02:42:28 PM 748 Views
I have heard it a couple of times. - 28/07/2015 03:13:20 PM 697 Views
Isn't fake culture almos the defintion of hipster? *NM* - 28/07/2015 05:18:53 PM 369 Views
Depends, are trying to sound cool, like a douche, or Joe Pesci? *NM* - 29/07/2015 07:12:28 PM 559 Views
The distinction between the first two is negligible - 29/07/2015 07:52:50 PM 738 Views

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