Active Users:476 Time:27/12/2024 01:26:50 AM
Re: facing a jury implies cross examination. a grand jury is at the mercy of the DA running it Cannoli Send a noteboard - 26/11/2014 05:59:41 AM

if Darren Wilson was not a police officer, and simply told a kid "Get out of the fucking street", fought with him, then gunned him down and subsequently lied about it and had his co-workers cover for him, we would be justifiably outraged at a murder in which the killer was going to escape justice.
In the first place, you left out "credible robbery suspect" (credible, because he had actually committed a robbery). In the second place, a large part of the outrage in such a situation would stem from his not having the authority to do any such thing. Darren Wilson IS a police officer, and DID have the right to make a pedestrian get out of the street. He did have the right to confront a robbery suspect. You keep trying to claim that the robbery is retroactive, while harping on Brown's juvenile status, as if that has the slightest bearing on any of Wilson's actions. Although, that's a another crime, since the take from his robbery was tobacco products, which no juvenile is allowed to possess. That "kid" was 6'4" tall, and weighed as close to 300 pounds as made no difference. Whatever his flaws of judgment, stemming from his immaturity, he was more than capable of harming people, which is the criterion under which subjects of violence are judged. He was not shot because of his guilt or his past crimes or his age or race. He was shot because he tried to grab a cop's gun, after he came to the cop's attention by committing serious and minor offenses, because he first ran from the police, and then threatened a police officer. The evidence showed that Brown had turned back towards the cop, and moved in the cop's direction before he was killed.
so, yes police officers should be given the same rights as civilians and stand for the potential crimes they commit while on (or off) duty.

on the flip side, are the rights guaranteed by the Constitution suspended for young, unarmed black American males?

Well, you seem bound and determined to suspend the right to due process for Wilson. And unarmed is bullshit. 6'4" tall. 300 pounds. He robbed a store while unarmed! What the FUCK does that have to do with ANYTHING? Since when is it incumbent upon law enforcement, or anyone, to meet the standards of a fair fight?


it would certainly appear so based on the vast number of "justifiable" police killings over just this year alone. Mike Brown, Ezell Ford, Kajieme Powell, Eric Garner, Darrien Hunt, John Crawford, Tamir Rice, and the list goes on and on. all killed by police, all unarmed except for Crawford, who had a toy gun he picked up off the shelf of the Walmart he was shot at, and Rice, who was a 12 year old with a toy gun.
They brandished them at armed police officers. No one said their deaths were a good thing, they were simply ruled honest mistakes on the part of the officers. If the list goes on and on, why did you stop? Millions of black males walk away unharmed from confrontations with police officers every year. How many? Well, based on the disproportionate number of murders committed by that demographic, I think we can all agree the number is "too many".

And you're a flat-out liar as well. Hunt and Powell were both armed, Ford and Brown tried to grab cops' guns, and Crawford and Rice appeared to be carrying guns, to officers who responded to reports of suspicious armed individuals. Both of those "toy" guns were pellet guns, that were actually capable of shooting projectiles. In the case of Crawford, he was carrying it around the store out of its packaging, and in the case of Rice, he drew it on cops. In each case, there was the possibility of officers feeling threatened.

Since the grand jury was still out last I heard in the Garner case, you can hardly say it was ruled justified. His own obesity was as likely a factor in his death as the excessive force used by the police. The alternative to a chokehold, however, would be beating him into submission, which leads to riots.

You are the racist here, since you judge each and every one of those cases solely on the color of the skin of the people involved. By your own account of Crawford's encounter, he chose to argue with armed police officers, rather than drop the toy gun. Rice drew his "toy" on a couple of cops. It was sad and tragic, but no one with any brain cells is seriously putting forth any motivation for their murders.


if we believe in the Constitution and we also believe in fairly applying the laws and rights conveyed by it, the discrepancy with how it is applied leaves a lot to be desired.

You have no proof that the Constitution is NOT being applied evenly. All you are doing is presupposing a discrepancy based on the outcome. As your ilk are quick to point out every time a black man gets violent with police or resists arrest, the black experience and culture is different from that of whites. Therefore, they are not always going to behave in the same manner.

Cannoli
“Tolerance is the virtue of the man without convictions.” GK Chesteron
Inde muagdhe Aes Sedai misain ye!
Deus Vult!
*MySmiley*
Reply to message
these things should be simple: shoot someone dead -> face a jury trial to determine your guilt - 18/11/2014 11:38:11 PM 1050 Views
You are 100% correct - 19/11/2014 05:42:34 PM 597 Views
He is facing a jury - 22/11/2014 06:01:28 AM 619 Views
facing a jury implies cross examination. a grand jury is at the mercy of the DA running it - 25/11/2014 09:58:46 PM 583 Views
Re: facing a jury implies cross examination. a grand jury is at the mercy of the DA running it - 26/11/2014 05:59:41 AM 645 Views
nice to see you are still not allowing facts to cloud your judgment - 29/11/2014 12:30:42 PM 622 Views

Reply to Message