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Populism is not (only) in the positions, but also in the rhetoric and the details. Legolas Send a noteboard - 22/09/2014 09:02:26 PM

The definition of populism is very simple: telling the public at large whatever it wants to hear at any given time, without much regard to any consistent ideology. To an even bigger extent than mainstream politicians already do. There are populist politicians everywhere, but in the US system it's not really possible to have entire populist parties - each party also must have almost by definition a group of politicians who actually get things done and hammer out policies with difficult compromises, and another group which sets the ideological lines and ensures they are at least somewhat adhered to. In Europe there are plenty of parties which are populist as a general policy, with at best lip service paid to the notion of serious, consistent ideology and policies.

The UKIP used to be a single issue party, with the single issue being the exit from the EU. Before long, they naturally segued into the complaints about too many foreigners coming to the UK, though to their credit they made sure that at least in their leadership there was always a clear stance against racism - Farage has refused to join forces in the European Parliament with nastier parties, even big ones like the Front National. It doesn't take a genius to see that the slow death of the openly racist British National Party is largely if not entirely due to the UKIP sucking them dry, though.

And now in the last year or two, they are trying to branch out and build policies on other topics too. But still, it's obvious that those are the two points that define the party.

View original postLooking at their policies on wikipedia, they seem fairly closely in line with the Republican Party in the United States (minus a few extreme social positions):


View original postTaxation: lower taxes, especially on corporations

Sure, but don't expect them to present anything remotely like a credible budget. Which is not to say the main parties don't engage in a little fantasy here and there, but they are rather more closely watched.

Do read e.g. this. This is literally the first hit if you enter "UKIP economic policy" on Google. Seems I was a little premature in saying that the UKIP was less inclined than the continental populist-right (a better term than far-right, really) parties to go with whatever economic policy sounds best to the voters at any given time.

View original postHealth: cutting waste, allowing vouchers (i.e., a private system)

Hardly a private system. The NHS is sacred in the UK.
View original postEU: get the Hell out before it's too late

In many ways a carbon copy of Alex Salmond's stance: if you tell yourself and your neighbours loudly enough that you really will be better off by leaving the union, it doesn't matter what the facts are. By the time people will face reality, it's too late to go back. The British businessmen, much like the Scottish ones, are not quite so eager to gamble.

In fairness, this is no different from what the Euro-sceptic wing of the Tories has been doing for decades. But again, that's the difference between a governing party and a populist one: in the UKIP, leadership doesn't need to worry about doing the responsible thing, they have the same luxury the Tory backbenchers have.


View original postThe only thing I didn't include was their position on the monarchy since the US doesn't have one. However, I can't see how their positions are markedly different from US Republican positions. Why are they "populist" rather than "conservative" in your opinion?

Because US Republicans actually (and generally quite vehemently) believe that their economic policy is the right one, and aren't generally inclined to ditch it at the first sign of shifting public opinion. On immigration there is more populism in the Republican Party (I remember several elections ago, this guy Tom Tancredo - he seems like a perfect fit for the UKIP), but as I said, it's never the whole party acting like that, there are always the more responsible members looking for a real solution also.

Gay marriage is another good example - why does the UKIP advocate drawing the line at civil unions? Because the Tories abandoned that stance, and left it open for the first claimant to take - most Britons have no problem with same sex marriage, which is why the Tories decided to embrace it (that, and it was a useful proxy for their general message that they had modernized and changed), but there's still some votes to be had in opposing it. Though they then managed to state in an interview that if granted power they would not overturn same-sex marriage, before subsequently denying that - a classic way of letting voters believe that whichever stance they like best is the real one.

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Scotland voted No! - 19/09/2014 08:14:21 AM 1108 Views
Looking at all the resources provided in the thread below..... - 19/09/2014 02:50:34 PM 598 Views
I had hoped that when push came to shove they would think instead *NM* - 19/09/2014 03:32:22 PM 330 Views
As am I. - 19/09/2014 07:39:29 PM 695 Views
They need to have four states along US lines with a Federal government. - 21/09/2014 12:02:21 AM 610 Views
Naaaaaah, let's not - 21/09/2014 01:02:00 AM 742 Views
The current US gridlock is not a one-sided matter. - 22/09/2014 01:11:03 AM 586 Views
He's also the president - 23/09/2014 03:33:54 PM 688 Views
And each member of Congress won elections, too. - 23/09/2014 04:25:21 PM 623 Views
I couldn't care less about Obama - 23/09/2014 09:27:28 PM 768 Views
Of course they should be able to do that. The system was desinged so they can - 24/09/2014 05:38:48 PM 677 Views
I'm sure it was designed like that - 25/09/2014 07:16:16 PM 675 Views
for all the pissign and moaning it has worked for over 200 years - 26/09/2014 02:30:39 PM 658 Views
It's not working *NM* - 27/09/2014 03:16:59 AM 313 Views
working better then any other system out there. *NM* - 29/09/2014 01:12:10 PM 333 Views
On what basis do you make that claim? *NM* - 29/09/2014 02:48:08 PM 443 Views
US GDP (and GDP per capita), US as only remaining superpower, but we still have limited government. - 29/09/2014 03:07:55 PM 608 Views
Ha! *NM* - 29/09/2014 11:25:07 PM 314 Views
Yes, and democracy is an awful system - 26/09/2014 04:07:00 PM 595 Views
What hyperbolic nonsense. *NM* - 27/09/2014 03:18:07 AM 343 Views
None of that is hyperbole or nonsense. *NM* - 27/09/2014 11:18:50 PM 350 Views
How on earth do you figure that? - 21/09/2014 08:53:31 PM 630 Views
Oh, actually I like the multiple state idea better - 22/09/2014 01:09:12 AM 597 Views
Eh. The UKIP is populist more than anything else. - 22/09/2014 07:02:10 AM 758 Views
I fail to see that. - 22/09/2014 05:16:08 PM 662 Views
Populism is not (only) in the positions, but also in the rhetoric and the details. - 22/09/2014 09:02:26 PM 857 Views
Your ancestors are rolling in their graves, Scots! *NM* - 20/09/2014 11:40:26 PM 263 Views
Which ancestors? The ones who signed the Act of Union probably aren't. *NM* - 22/09/2014 01:11:48 AM 264 Views
They're probably in hell *NM* - 22/09/2014 02:49:09 AM 270 Views
Hell is an independent Scotland, is it? I agree. *NM* - 22/09/2014 05:09:54 PM 264 Views
Actually, Hell is any kind of Scotland - 23/09/2014 11:07:50 PM 679 Views

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