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How on earth do you figure that? Legolas Send a noteboard - 21/09/2014 08:53:31 PM

View original postOf course, then I'd like to see Westminster arranged in US fashion, with a Senate having 25% members from each of the four states and a House of Representatives with proportional representation, which would really act like a kick in the balls to Labour.

If by "kick in the balls" you mean it would give Labour an absurd amount of power, then sure, but that seems like a rather far stretch of the meaning of the phrase. Labour would have to do extremely well indeed in an election to get a majority of the English seats in this Senate, but with their large majorities in Scotland and Wales, they'd be all but guaranteed a permanent "Senate" majority, even if you assume that the Conservatives managed to convince the DUP to caucus with them.

Within the English state, of course, the Tories would be quite comfortable, but that's about it.

Also, last I checked, the US House of Representatives didn't have proportional representation, but essentially the same system as the British Parliament, i.e. first past the post in single-member districts. If they actually did get proportional representation in the UK, both Labour and the Conservatives would lose out, while the Lib Dems, UKIP, Greens and other smaller parties would benefit greatly. Perhaps you meant something else by proportional representation - merely that in the House, England would not be as badly disadvantaged as in the Senate?

So as for your proposals - there's something to be said for installing a separate English parliament and harmonizing the powers of the four states (everything else is already done), and I certainly think there's also something to be said for proportional representation, but it'll never fly. A "Senate" with equal representation for the four states is a terrible idea however, as it's absurdly unfair to the English (even more unfair than the present state of things where non-English MPs get to vote on strictly English affairs but not the other way around).

There is a more radical but intriguing possibility, but it will be a very long time before that becomes viable if it ever does. Which is to genuinely go to an American or German model - not having four states, but fifteen, twenty, however many. Everybody agrees that the English cities and regions need more autonomy - perhaps having a state of Cornwall or a state of Yorkshire within the United Kingdom, just like the states of Wales and Scotland, is not that absurd. It would certainly solve the problem of the massive disparity in size between England on the one hand and the other three on the other.

As a Belgian, I can safely say that federal countries with only a very small amount of constituent parts are a pain in the ass - it works considerably better with more states as there is room for shifting coalitions and it's not always a fight along the same lines.

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Scotland voted No! - 19/09/2014 08:14:21 AM 1109 Views
Looking at all the resources provided in the thread below..... - 19/09/2014 02:50:34 PM 599 Views
I had hoped that when push came to shove they would think instead *NM* - 19/09/2014 03:32:22 PM 330 Views
As am I. - 19/09/2014 07:39:29 PM 696 Views
They need to have four states along US lines with a Federal government. - 21/09/2014 12:02:21 AM 610 Views
Naaaaaah, let's not - 21/09/2014 01:02:00 AM 742 Views
The current US gridlock is not a one-sided matter. - 22/09/2014 01:11:03 AM 586 Views
He's also the president - 23/09/2014 03:33:54 PM 688 Views
And each member of Congress won elections, too. - 23/09/2014 04:25:21 PM 624 Views
I couldn't care less about Obama - 23/09/2014 09:27:28 PM 768 Views
Of course they should be able to do that. The system was desinged so they can - 24/09/2014 05:38:48 PM 678 Views
I'm sure it was designed like that - 25/09/2014 07:16:16 PM 675 Views
for all the pissign and moaning it has worked for over 200 years - 26/09/2014 02:30:39 PM 658 Views
It's not working *NM* - 27/09/2014 03:16:59 AM 313 Views
working better then any other system out there. *NM* - 29/09/2014 01:12:10 PM 333 Views
On what basis do you make that claim? *NM* - 29/09/2014 02:48:08 PM 443 Views
US GDP (and GDP per capita), US as only remaining superpower, but we still have limited government. - 29/09/2014 03:07:55 PM 608 Views
Ha! *NM* - 29/09/2014 11:25:07 PM 314 Views
Yes, and democracy is an awful system - 26/09/2014 04:07:00 PM 595 Views
What hyperbolic nonsense. *NM* - 27/09/2014 03:18:07 AM 343 Views
None of that is hyperbole or nonsense. *NM* - 27/09/2014 11:18:50 PM 351 Views
How on earth do you figure that? - 21/09/2014 08:53:31 PM 631 Views
Oh, actually I like the multiple state idea better - 22/09/2014 01:09:12 AM 597 Views
Eh. The UKIP is populist more than anything else. - 22/09/2014 07:02:10 AM 758 Views
I fail to see that. - 22/09/2014 05:16:08 PM 663 Views
Your ancestors are rolling in their graves, Scots! *NM* - 20/09/2014 11:40:26 PM 263 Views
Which ancestors? The ones who signed the Act of Union probably aren't. *NM* - 22/09/2014 01:11:48 AM 264 Views
They're probably in hell *NM* - 22/09/2014 02:49:09 AM 270 Views
Hell is an independent Scotland, is it? I agree. *NM* - 22/09/2014 05:09:54 PM 264 Views
Actually, Hell is any kind of Scotland - 23/09/2014 11:07:50 PM 679 Views

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