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Re: Sure HyogaRott Send a noteboard - 17/07/2013 03:26:15 AM

View original postThe verdict was far from proper, but it is what it is. The prosecution spent too much time on the how of their fight rather than the why of their fight. The only reason they are in a fight is completely because of Zimmerman's actions. If he waits for Martin to actually commit a crime, he comes off as a much more sympathetic figure, rather than a simply pathetic figure. The prosecution seemed to phone it in and proved more of the defense's case than they should have, but then I don't think they wanted the case at all from the beginning.

You also should stop treating Zimmerman as though he were an actual law enforcement officer. I have no doubt that an actual officer is sensitive about his weapon, just as I have no doubt Zimmerman was acutely aware of where his weapon was located. Just because he had a license to carry a weapon does not mean he was a full-fledged law officer. And we are still only left with Zimmerman's version of events, and one of the biggest problems comes from your continued insistence that his story is the absolute truth for whatever reason you have for believing him. We all can see that Zimmerman distorted many facts to make himself the victim.

And yes, the physical evidence refutes his claims of a vicious attack, no matter your belief that it does not. Somehow Martin slammed Zimmerman's head into the pavement multiple times without touching him? It is not believable. Just as it is not believable that he simply left his vehicle to find a street sign of a street he has been the de facto watchman of for several years, even though he admits to pursuing Martin on foot at one point. So either he got out of his vehicle and was ambushed, or he pursued Martin and ended up in a fight. The two stories are mutually exclusive but yet both were told by Zimmerman at one time. Thankfully for Zimmerman, he was not on trial for truth-telling or he would be in prison for sure for all the lies and distortions he has told in this case.


I am not treating or crediting Zimmerman for anything, I am simply looking at the established facts of the case, unlike you, I am looking at ALL of them. It is also extremely obvious that you and weapons and violence do not have even a passing acquaintance.

Martin had a right to self defense if, and only if, Zimmerman initiated violence with him. I have said it before, and I will say it again, there is exactly ZERO unambiguous evidence that this occurred. Even the prosecution did not really try to establish that theory otherwise he would have filed an assault charge as well. There are many theories as to why they did not try this, very bad evidence (even worse than their evidence for murder) is one, though my personal opinion is that it would have opened Martin's history to being introduced into evidence and that would have completely torpedoed the prosecution. Regardless, they did not, so Martin acting is self defense from aggression by Zimmerman was not ANY real element of the prosecution's case. This is why there was so much emphasis on the how of the altercation instead of the why.

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Zimmerman = Not Guilty - 14/07/2013 04:04:07 AM 1776 Views
Any charge, other than stupidity, was rediculous. *NM* - 14/07/2013 04:24:09 AM 502 Views
Stupidity+Death= Manslaughter *NM* - 14/07/2013 05:27:39 AM 473 Views
But hey... - 14/07/2013 05:35:11 AM 999 Views
And THAT is the scary precendent this case sets for the populace - 14/07/2013 05:28:03 PM 1129 Views
Oh puhleeze... can you get any more rediculous? *NM* - 14/07/2013 07:22:52 PM 623 Views
HyogaRott baby, you are hurting me here. Can you please stop this? - 14/07/2013 11:29:00 PM 882 Views
If inline spellcheck doesn't catch it, I probably won't either. - 15/07/2013 06:29:29 AM 812 Views
you really are small minded little bigot - 15/07/2013 03:57:01 AM 900 Views
+1 - Seriously has imlad always been this nuts? *NM* - 15/07/2013 04:32:33 AM 536 Views
Your reply is partisan and obnoxious. - 15/07/2013 02:15:13 PM 902 Views
So it was okay that he was on top of a guy, pounding his head into the pavement? - 14/07/2013 06:45:17 PM 904 Views
If you can believe Zimmerman's side of the story is 100% truth, I have a bridge for sale... - 15/07/2013 05:35:08 PM 1002 Views
do you have actual evidence to support zimmerman lied? *NM* - 16/07/2013 05:43:42 PM 502 Views
Sure - 16/07/2013 06:49:20 PM 786 Views
Re: Sure - 16/07/2013 07:53:27 PM 946 Views
Re: Sure - 16/07/2013 10:07:13 PM 985 Views
Re: Sure - 17/07/2013 03:26:15 AM 924 Views
The kid decided to beat a man who had a gun and got shot for it - 15/07/2013 03:46:38 AM 879 Views
In a sane world, here is how their interaction plays out - 15/07/2013 05:44:26 PM 843 Views
Yes. And the fact that he didn't simply ask him what he was doing, tells me he was racial profiling - 15/07/2013 08:59:41 PM 835 Views
The only way that statement makes sense is if it is sarcasm - 16/07/2013 12:46:59 PM 787 Views
And tomorrow I get to preach about the Good Samaritan. - 14/07/2013 05:26:50 AM 1064 Views
Where's your forgiveness?? Judge not lest ye be judged. - 14/07/2013 07:10:14 PM 828 Views
Did I say a thing about Zimmerman? No. - 14/07/2013 08:44:26 PM 966 Views
Oh my gosh. I'm so sorry. Which neighborhood watch were you referring to? - 15/07/2013 12:46:44 AM 928 Views
Float your concept of grace in front of your priest sometime. - 15/07/2013 04:31:34 AM 799 Views
Danny... - 15/07/2013 01:32:03 PM 896 Views
You'd think the rain of venom in here would make everyone's soapbox too slippery to stand on - 15/07/2013 01:05:41 PM 844 Views
+1 *NM* - 15/07/2013 06:40:15 PM 558 Views
would that be true for most of politics as well? *NM* - 16/07/2013 12:58:33 PM 522 Views
Depends on the case, but those aren't individual life and death criminal trials - 16/07/2013 01:52:00 PM 763 Views
when the president gets involved it is safe to polotics are at play. - 16/07/2013 06:23:54 PM 817 Views
That's not an unfair remark but it justifies criticizing him, not also getting involved in the case - 16/07/2013 06:59:53 PM 829 Views
When a case shows glaring holes in the law, it should by nature cause those laws to be reconsidered - 16/07/2013 07:18:57 PM 922 Views
I'm not sure what those 'glaring holes' are, but a specific person shouldn't be needed to show them - 16/07/2013 08:18:38 PM 822 Views
It is a bit difficult to not use the case when the specificity of the case is the problem.... - 16/07/2013 11:06:59 PM 892 Views
I sympathize with that but I think it remains a moral necessity to do so - 17/07/2013 12:14:39 AM 956 Views
Re: I sympathize with that but I think it remains a moral necessity to do so - 17/07/2013 05:29:56 PM 956 Views
I think you've over-personalized this case - 17/07/2013 08:00:50 PM 876 Views
I think this case is simply the closest example at hand of a perceived lack of justice - 17/07/2013 10:34:38 PM 931 Views
Re: I think this case is simply the closest example at hand of a perceived lack of justice - 18/07/2013 01:39:17 AM 1070 Views
Jury instructions - 18/07/2013 04:12:29 AM 1022 Views
Jury Instructions 2 - 18/07/2013 06:22:33 PM 879 Views
I just want to comment on two points from your reply - 19/07/2013 09:47:06 PM 783 Views
I'm pretty throughly exhausted of this - 19/07/2013 10:46:22 PM 890 Views
Nice. - 16/07/2013 09:01:50 PM 974 Views
Thanks - 16/07/2013 09:48:00 PM 809 Views
Well said. - 17/07/2013 02:25:36 PM 974 Views
it is possible to discuss a case based on what the evidence shows - 17/07/2013 06:03:05 PM 963 Views
Of course it is possible, one just fails to see how it can serve any good end - 17/07/2013 09:43:02 PM 830 Views
Exactly. *NM* - 18/07/2013 02:08:25 AM 587 Views
That just brings us full circle to my orignal reply to you - 18/07/2013 02:52:15 AM 866 Views
Re: That just brings us full circle to my orignal reply to you - 18/07/2013 04:09:51 AM 980 Views
are agree with your general concept - 18/07/2013 05:20:41 PM 1105 Views
Good. - 15/07/2013 02:11:12 PM 797 Views
Perhaps one day black people will have the same rights as whites in the US - 15/07/2013 05:30:00 PM 966 Views
Congratulations on making one of the dumbest statemets of the year. *NM* - 15/07/2013 09:00:46 PM 564 Views
You have tried retroatcively making Martin a criminal here, despite him doing nothing wrong - 15/07/2013 10:52:32 PM 852 Views
So you support attacking creepy crackers who you think are following you? - 16/07/2013 12:56:52 PM 847 Views
The law suggests that if I fear for my safety, I am justified in attacking first in self-defense - 18/07/2013 11:00:58 PM 917 Views
there is zero evidience to support that assumption - 19/07/2013 04:25:15 AM 785 Views
Let's see - Martin was using drugs..... - 16/07/2013 04:56:13 PM 840 Views
Does that mean he should have been hunted down and shot? *NM* - 16/07/2013 05:22:43 PM 514 Views
He wasn't, so your question is irrelevant. - 16/07/2013 05:37:27 PM 766 Views

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