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Re: but apparently it's only okay for some groups/people and not others. nossy Send a noteboard - 25/05/2013 09:49:48 PM

View original postIf a Christian killed a Muslim and then another Muslim came on this board complaining about violent Christians, and I said something like "I hate it when Muslims look down their noses at Christianity when their own religion has had all sorts of violent terrorists," I doubt anyone would be calling the Muslim out for defending his religion and its followers, even if I didn't personally say he himself was one of those terrorists.

Do you honestly doubt that? I've tried to give it some heavy thought, and I think you're completely wrong on this point.

I can't speak for everyone, but I do not mind people saying that there are many muslims who choose (and teach) violence - it's obviously a fact. I do, however, mind people claiming that my own religion was never supported by violence and never deserved the opportunity to evolve. I feel we have to offer the same chance to this religion, w/o legally backing the idea that a whole group of people should be judged as potentially violent. For me, there is a difference between knowing that there is currently much unrest in primarily Muslim countries and saying it's ok to treat anyone who looks like they belong there as a potential criminal.

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Maybe it is time to start treating muslims a little differently? Anonymous2000 - 23/05/2013 03:55:28 AM 2608 Views
Nah, you're just a bigot. *NM* Ghavrel - 23/05/2013 08:21:33 AM 749 Views
Yes, I am against religions that call for violence. *NM* Anonymous2000 - 23/05/2013 12:23:31 PM 659 Views
Wasn't aware you were against Judaism, Christianity, Islam, Hinduism, Zoroastrianism, Shinto... *NM* Ghavrel - 23/05/2013 12:59:04 PM 729 Views
Where does Christianity call for violence? Jeordam - 23/05/2013 03:55:11 PM 1135 Views
Dueteronomy 13: 1-5 states that you must kill prophets of other religions. Hieshyn - 23/05/2013 07:44:48 PM 1197 Views
The Old Testament is not Christianity. It is where Christianity CAME from. *NM* HyogaRott - 23/05/2013 09:25:12 PM 680 Views
FALSE! Dannymac - 24/05/2013 01:41:50 PM 1234 Views
*sigh* And in fulfilling the "law" he created a new covenant which supplanted the old.. HyogaRott - 24/05/2013 06:09:43 PM 1186 Views
All the death of Christ did was attone for the sins of the world. Hieshyn - 26/05/2013 03:00:26 AM 1347 Views
Sorry, you are wrong. HyogaRott - 28/05/2013 04:17:51 PM 1191 Views
...I can think of a rather larger difference. Starts with J and ends with S. *NM* Ghavrel - 28/05/2013 11:54:28 PM 761 Views
Yeah, but not really, both religions acknowledge his existence, but differ on his role. HyogaRott - 29/05/2013 06:00:03 PM 1203 Views
Net result: All of God's children can enter into Heaven. Hieshyn - 30/05/2013 05:26:20 PM 1391 Views
No. The New Covenant SUPPLEMENTS, not supplants, the Old. Joel - 12/08/2013 02:45:55 AM 1493 Views
Ok....and? Jeordam - 23/05/2013 10:36:55 PM 1060 Views
You asked for an example, I gave one. I'm not here to argue with you. *NM* Hieshyn - 26/05/2013 02:57:27 AM 680 Views
You might want to slap some qualifiers on there *NM* Isaac - 23/05/2013 07:50:43 PM 714 Views
Actually, I very intentionally didn't put any qualifiers on that... Jeordam - 23/05/2013 10:38:24 PM 1130 Views
The Cleansing of the Temple shows a legitimized use of physical force. *NM* Ghavrel - 24/05/2013 05:05:55 AM 764 Views
Oh, boo hoo.... Jeordam - 24/05/2013 03:50:18 PM 1202 Views
LOL. Ghavrel - 24/05/2013 04:45:50 PM 1131 Views
Violence.... Jeordam - 24/05/2013 05:32:47 PM 1114 Views
Whipping people to drive them away of something is violence. It's not negotiable. Ghavrel - 24/05/2013 06:06:42 PM 987 Views
You are something... Jeordam - 24/05/2013 06:29:03 PM 1064 Views
We've gone from "Where does Christianity call for violence?" to "not all violence is bad." *NM* Ghavrel - 24/05/2013 09:09:30 PM 743 Views
To be fair, that is a good journey to make. Joel - 12/08/2013 02:51:17 AM 1114 Views
Also, spanking has been pretty soundly debunked as good parenting. Maybe not a good analogy. *NM* Ghavrel - 24/05/2013 06:16:18 PM 706 Views
Because children are more behaved now.... Jeordam - 24/05/2013 06:21:43 PM 1040 Views
I don't favor spanking but the studies 'debunking it' are mostly 'bunk' Isaac - 24/05/2013 10:29:28 PM 1132 Views
Yes. nossy - 24/05/2013 10:42:51 PM 1077 Views
Re: Yes. Isaac - 25/05/2013 12:22:56 AM 1107 Views
Congratulations; you now understand why (or one reason) my posts tend to run long. Joel - 12/08/2013 02:53:24 AM 1341 Views
You know better than that. Ghavrel - 25/05/2013 06:52:32 AM 1106 Views
I think you just claimed that my statement as to my opinion is anecdotal evidence of that opinion Isaac - 25/05/2013 09:26:21 AM 1213 Views
I was talking about your reference to your upbringing as relevant to the statistical trend. *NM* Ghavrel - 25/05/2013 09:49:19 AM 665 Views
Yes, but I wasn't claiming it was relevant in that way Isaac - 25/05/2013 10:15:52 AM 1076 Views
... ? *NM* Ghavrel - 25/05/2013 12:58:43 PM 701 Views
I couldn't remember the code for *NM* Isaac - 25/05/2013 07:57:48 PM 659 Views
I wouldn't belong to any other kind of religion. Cannoli - 25/05/2013 01:21:45 AM 1094 Views
And the night was finished with a mob of white men attacking the police in the name of bigotry snoopcester - 23/05/2013 09:51:02 AM 1025 Views
In the name of a religion that preaches violence? Anonymous2000 - 23/05/2013 12:21:59 PM 1179 Views
Islam "preaches" violence just about as much as Christianity does. Nebhead - 23/05/2013 12:46:00 PM 1112 Views
it's actually pretty funny because many people understand Islam to, derivatively, mean peace Fox and Ravens - 23/05/2013 01:44:18 PM 1113 Views
Your argument is logically flawed Tom - 23/05/2013 02:02:33 PM 1194 Views
Re: Your argument is logically flawed Fox and Ravens - 23/05/2013 02:34:22 PM 1211 Views
No, it actaully does not. HyogaRott - 23/05/2013 01:51:51 PM 1195 Views
Maybe they will be, I don't know, KILLED for standing up Nighthawk - 23/05/2013 02:24:59 PM 991 Views
Exactly HyogaRott - 23/05/2013 03:52:25 PM 1115 Views
Couple of things nossy - 23/05/2013 08:13:57 PM 1430 Views
Unfortunately they are NOT consistant in their messaging... see my link HyogaRott - 23/05/2013 09:30:53 PM 1312 Views
Well, "consistent" doesn't mean "never says things HyogaRott doesn't support." nossy - 23/05/2013 09:46:51 PM 1066 Views
There is a difference between putting forth a good PR spin occasionally and making a stand. HyogaRott - 24/05/2013 01:55:48 AM 1019 Views
Really? Of all the criticisms you could make of Qaradawi, you whine about that? Legolas - 23/05/2013 09:58:50 PM 1143 Views
I think the key point there is that the MCB supported him for a visa in spite of that... Isaac - 23/05/2013 11:05:14 PM 1089 Views
So much for my attempt to bring a little levity to things. Legolas - 24/05/2013 08:07:24 PM 1134 Views
My ability to detect humor and sarcasm in writing is very sporadic Isaac - 24/05/2013 10:28:03 PM 1002 Views
That's a shame. Legolas - 24/05/2013 11:55:37 PM 946 Views
Re: That's a shame. Isaac - 25/05/2013 02:25:31 AM 1035 Views
Re: That's a shame. Legolas - 25/05/2013 12:17:13 PM 953 Views
Sure, I'll bite. Legolas - 23/05/2013 09:23:54 PM 1128 Views
Until the "unwashed masses" no longer show up dancing in the streets... HyogaRott - 23/05/2013 09:40:59 PM 1036 Views
I hope you like black and white. nossy - 23/05/2013 09:50:03 PM 990 Views
Not sure which point you think I missed that I should have responded to... HyogaRott - 24/05/2013 01:52:20 AM 1049 Views
I think I must have confused you. nossy - 24/05/2013 08:46:42 PM 956 Views
I suppose that depends on which "points" precisely you thought you were making. Legolas - 23/05/2013 09:54:55 PM 1056 Views
Not really HyogaRott - 24/05/2013 02:36:41 AM 1076 Views
Yawn. Bored now. Legolas - 24/05/2013 08:18:27 PM 1002 Views
whatever *NM* HyogaRott - 28/05/2013 04:18:56 PM 605 Views
Do "unwashed masses" publicly APOLOGIZING for terrorism count? Joel - 12/08/2013 03:04:56 AM 1310 Views
Re: No, it actaully does not. Stephen - 24/05/2013 02:29:04 AM 1184 Views
Now let's not start with bullshit here Tom - 23/05/2013 01:54:48 PM 1380 Views
Tom, this is a rare occurance when we agree. HyogaRott - 23/05/2013 03:59:49 PM 980 Views
That may be so, but the response was addressed to Ben. Tom - 23/05/2013 04:13:47 PM 1107 Views
Oops, my bad messed up reading the discussion tree... HyogaRott - 23/05/2013 06:15:34 PM 1065 Views
Excellent post - anyone that thinks all religions are the same is a complete moron. Anonymous2000 - 24/05/2013 03:32:26 AM 1224 Views
I don't approve of a great deal of popular Islamic thought. Ghavrel - 24/05/2013 05:13:51 AM 1226 Views
My thoughts exactly. *NM* ironclad - 24/05/2013 09:13:18 AM 605 Views
I agree. *NM* Stephen - 24/05/2013 12:05:46 PM 666 Views
Do you think that it will truly happen? Jeordam - 24/05/2013 05:47:50 PM 1183 Views
Might have something to do with colonialists ruining everything they can get their hands on. Ghavrel - 24/05/2013 06:09:13 PM 1068 Views
The first step on the road to recovery is aknowledging your responsibility for where you are and do HyogaRott - 24/05/2013 06:22:42 PM 1027 Views
Oh, so its our fault... Jeordam - 24/05/2013 06:38:14 PM 1081 Views
It's always our fault *NM* ßelals Girl - 24/05/2013 07:40:24 PM 791 Views
In general, I agree nossy - 24/05/2013 09:01:53 PM 1213 Views
That word "our" is interesting, don't you think? Legolas - 24/05/2013 09:09:24 PM 1054 Views
That was beautiful. *NM* Ghavrel - 24/05/2013 09:12:09 PM 724 Views
No, Ghavrel was doing that ßelals Girl - 25/05/2013 12:03:09 AM 1147 Views
I'm sure we all do it, that's kind of the point. Legolas - 25/05/2013 12:26:25 AM 1003 Views
but apparently it's only okay for some groups/people and not others. ßelals Girl - 25/05/2013 02:20:21 AM 1195 Views
Exactly. Tom - 25/05/2013 06:26:57 AM 1132 Views
Hyperbole? nossy - 25/05/2013 09:57:56 PM 943 Views
Has anyone ever told you that? Ghavrel - 25/05/2013 10:33:32 PM 1201 Views
No, I really don't think so. Legolas - 25/05/2013 11:18:05 AM 1005 Views
*bashes face against keyboard in frustration* ßelals Girl - 25/05/2013 09:28:58 PM 1004 Views
Perhaps I should bow out and let Ghavrel speak for himself, then. Legolas - 25/05/2013 09:53:28 PM 1155 Views
It's accurate. *NM* Ghavrel - 25/05/2013 10:25:04 PM 676 Views
Re: but apparently it's only okay for some groups/people and not others. nossy - 25/05/2013 09:49:48 PM 1057 Views
Re: but apparently it's only okay for some groups/people and not others. ßelals Girl - 26/05/2013 12:48:45 AM 1174 Views
Hm nossy - 26/05/2013 10:10:49 AM 1137 Views
Also, yeah. Historically oppressive groups aren't equal to historically oppressed groups. Ghavrel - 25/05/2013 10:31:58 PM 1133 Views
Too simplistic AND a blatant justification for double standards I thought you didn't have ßelals Girl - 26/05/2013 01:02:07 AM 1120 Views
That's not racism. Racism requires systematic oppression. *NM* Ghavrel - 26/05/2013 01:14:08 AM 667 Views
No ßelals Girl - 26/05/2013 01:57:11 AM 1143 Views
Where whitey firmly belongs, in no small part because of posts like that. Ghavrel - 26/05/2013 02:00:59 AM 1106 Views
Lulz, you're claiming every member of a group deserves something because of what I said? ßelals Girl - 26/05/2013 02:11:36 AM 1075 Views
And now you know how Muslims feel. *NM* Ghavrel - 26/05/2013 03:48:33 AM 684 Views
I already knew ßelals Girl - 26/05/2013 04:02:02 AM 1038 Views
Just about every group has historically oppressed and BEEN oppressed at some time. Joel - 12/08/2013 04:00:54 AM 1147 Views
No. Ghavrel - 25/05/2013 10:28:24 PM 1057 Views
Oh, I don't think he's talking about past "colonialism" only. Tom - 25/05/2013 06:18:11 AM 1075 Views
Possibly. Some people do, to be sure, and there is some truth in that view. Legolas - 25/05/2013 11:27:36 AM 979 Views
What a load of bullshit. Tom - 25/05/2013 06:14:02 AM 1068 Views
I don't think you can reasonably claim to separate Salafi thought from the geopolitics of the time. Ghavrel - 25/05/2013 10:23:03 PM 1089 Views
This is why I want to get the HELL out of there. Joel - 12/08/2013 04:16:39 AM 1219 Views
The difference with Islam is they lost the empire game but they were conquers random thoughts - 27/05/2013 12:42:05 AM 1192 Views
I'm gonna have to disagree with some of that. Legolas - 27/05/2013 07:06:53 PM 1038 Views
Yes it was very complex and the Crusaders were not saints (even the sainted ones) random thoughts - 29/05/2013 04:15:57 AM 1132 Views
Fair enough on all counts, then. *NM* Legolas - 29/05/2013 07:37:34 PM 645 Views
No, it had a bunch of opportunistic brown folks systematically dismantling it for centuries. Joel - 12/08/2013 03:43:00 AM 1072 Views
Some of my ancestors lived and caved and bashed each over the heads with rocks random thoughts - 26/05/2013 04:38:56 PM 1079 Views
Well yes. nossy - 26/05/2013 05:08:08 PM 1026 Views
I would prefer to say that random thoughts - 27/05/2013 01:26:57 AM 1239 Views
Of course you would. nossy - 27/05/2013 10:19:46 AM 1140 Views
I in no way support profiling people based on race or religion random thoughts - 29/05/2013 04:11:01 AM 1203 Views
Ok. nossy - 29/05/2013 08:54:34 PM 1220 Views
I think about the evolution of Western religion a lot. Joel - 12/08/2013 03:23:37 AM 1424 Views
There has been 14,000+ terrorist actions in the name of Islam since 9/11. Anonymous2000 - 24/05/2013 03:30:30 AM 1297 Views
That isn't a grown up answer. snoopcester - 23/05/2013 04:35:16 PM 1152 Views
Re: In the name of a religion that preaches violence? ßelals Girl - 23/05/2013 07:28:42 PM 1138 Views
His head will only be chopped off is he draws or insults Muhammad! *NM* Anonymous2000 - 24/05/2013 03:34:21 AM 708 Views
What does he have to do to get on TV? *NM* ßelals Girl - 24/05/2013 07:45:53 PM 639 Views
Statistically snoopcester - 24/05/2013 10:22:29 AM 1199 Views
What kind of horrifying bugs to you guys HAVE over there??? ßelals Girl - 24/05/2013 02:13:23 PM 1180 Views
Hardly any snoopcester - 24/05/2013 02:16:46 PM 1316 Views
Your solution is profiling...because it's time to *stop* thinking all folks are the same? *NM* Sareitha Sedai - 23/05/2013 02:36:32 PM 615 Views
I don't think we've ever encouraged people to think all folks are the same Isaac - 23/05/2013 07:29:54 PM 1009 Views
"Perhaps it's time to stop thinking all folks are the same?" ~A2k Sareitha Sedai - 23/05/2013 07:49:12 PM 991 Views
I think he's pointing to the encuragement of willful blindedness with that remark Isaac - 23/05/2013 08:15:55 PM 1030 Views
I think probably not. nossy - 23/05/2013 07:57:53 PM 1091 Views
See Tom's post above for the facts..... *NM* Anonymous2000 - 24/05/2013 03:36:18 AM 630 Views
That your original post was absurd? Thank you, but I got that on my own. *NM* nossy - 24/05/2013 09:09:21 PM 624 Views
It shows what a silly little fool you are, but that's your choice. *NM* Anonymous2000 - 24/05/2013 09:19:04 PM 612 Views
Hey man, you're the one who told me Tom's post had the facts. nossy - 24/05/2013 09:20:53 PM 1012 Views
It means exactly what I said. He did a great job! *NM* Anonymous2000 - 24/05/2013 09:23:44 PM 663 Views
Yes, he did. nossy - 24/05/2013 09:30:42 PM 1064 Views
Also, don't tell him I said I take him seriously. *NM* nossy - 24/05/2013 09:34:59 PM 654 Views
But wouldn't religion-based profile activities... Jeordam - 23/05/2013 10:54:33 PM 995 Views
My brain is slow right now, but I think I completely agree. nossy - 23/05/2013 11:00:31 PM 1143 Views
You mean like this? Larry - 24/05/2013 08:15:16 PM 1184 Views
Sorry bu the comparison isn't valid random thoughts - 25/05/2013 09:50:34 PM 1020 Views
+1 - Larry is an honest guy and will realize his error. *NM* Anonymous2000 - 25/05/2013 10:53:14 PM 657 Views
Numbers alone do not change the validity of such Larry - 25/05/2013 11:15:17 PM 1114 Views
Yes it does. Anonymous2000 - 26/05/2013 12:23:27 AM 1101 Views
*sigh* Larry - 26/05/2013 12:46:49 AM 1012 Views
I think asking most Americans for recognition of a non-binary political paradigm is a bit much. *NM* Ghavrel - 26/05/2013 01:16:30 AM 680 Views
no liberalisn is sane and well thought in comparison random thoughts - 26/05/2013 04:04:39 PM 986 Views
no but they do tell a story random thoughts - 26/05/2013 04:27:26 PM 930 Views
UPDATE - Cleric/Teacher of one of the murderers praises him for "courage". Anonymous2000 - 24/05/2013 09:22:24 PM 1114 Views
Do you have a functional link? *NM* Stephen - 25/05/2013 12:19:01 AM 668 Views
The link works for me (Yahoo news) - here is the text. Anonymous2000 - 25/05/2013 02:05:41 AM 1270 Views
Re: Maybe it is time to start treating muslims a little differently? dart_board - 27/05/2013 02:28:31 PM 1689 Views
Please have a look at the attached list and tell me who "they" are, exactly. nossy - 27/05/2013 03:22:41 PM 1137 Views
Just as a little aside Tom - 28/05/2013 12:51:48 AM 1025 Views
Ever helpful. nossy - 28/05/2013 10:23:12 PM 1210 Views
Re: Please have a look at the attached list and tell me who "they" are, exactly. dart_board - 28/05/2013 04:56:55 PM 1597 Views
Re: Please have a look at the attached list and tell me who "they" are, exactly. nossy - 28/05/2013 10:18:40 PM 1185 Views
Re: Please have a look at the attached list and tell me who "they" are, exactly. dart_board - 29/05/2013 08:57:17 PM 1629 Views
I'm having warm feelings. nossy - 29/05/2013 09:38:45 PM 1180 Views
Re: I'm having warm feelings. dart_board - 30/05/2013 12:46:57 AM 1483 Views
"Who else? Major League Baseball. " Joel - 12/08/2013 04:34:48 AM 1394 Views
I can't believe I missed this thread. *NM* Dan - 01/06/2013 10:08:08 AM 894 Views
How much did you miss it, really? Joel - 12/08/2013 04:38:21 AM 1105 Views
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