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I believe you will also find the number of people too young, old and/or disabled to work has almost invariably been only a tiny fraction of those who are not.
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Social Security was NEVER sustainable. The sustainability of the program when it was presented was an illusion. Its sustainability was based on the US population increasing WITHOUT END. This is a complete physical impossibility, not to mention contrary to all the recorded history of advancing civilizations. It is not now, nor was it ever, a perpetually sustainable program, BECAUSE it is structured as a Ponzi. As long as there is no capital investment and growth, it can not survive, PERIOD. It is simple math (though with VERY big numbers).
Social Security was NEVER sustainable. The sustainability of the program when it was presented was an illusion. Its sustainability was based on the US population increasing WITHOUT END. This is a complete physical impossibility, not to mention contrary to all the recorded history of advancing civilizations. It is not now, nor was it ever, a perpetually sustainable program, BECAUSE it is structured as a Ponzi. As long as there is no capital investment and growth, it can not survive, PERIOD. It is simple math (though with VERY big numbers).
A secondary argument against the program is that it is a VERY bad program (just how bad it is becomes hidden behind those same really big numbers). For every person you can point to and say "see it helped this person" or "It kept that person out of poverty" I can point to that same person and run the numbers for them and show you how much money they COULD HAVE HAD instead with a real investment plan. It is a very basic time/value of money calculation.
With the exception of a few first generation SS retiree recipients everyone else for the last 65 years has been hosed.
I believe you will also find the number of people too young, old and/or disabled to work has almost invariably been only a tiny fraction of those who are not.
I believe you might want to do a little actual research before spouting off, you are WRONG.
Birth rates in every industrialized nation throughout history have declined (probably has a little something to do with the reduced farming population needed, but that is an assumption). This is a historical fact and easily known if you bothered to look. The ratio of workers to SS recipients began at 7:1 and has steadily fallen ever since (you must ALWAYS keep in mind that recipients are paid with current contributions, not invested capital). From the moment it began, its only destiny was failure.
I get that in your liberal political ideology Social Security is a wonderful concept. I get that. OK, fine, whatever, but facts are facts. The Social Security model that has been saddled upon the American People was crafted by morons, it was not, and could not, ever actually work indefinitely; and the people who put it together knew it, and LIED to gain a political advantage.
Can You Name the Largest US Program to ANNUALLY Collect More Than It Spent for 75 Straight Years?
- 28/02/2013 11:03:18 PM
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Medicare? *NM*
- 28/02/2013 11:38:22 PM
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No, Medicare has only been around about half as long.
- 28/02/2013 11:56:32 PM
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Medicare has its own problems, and caused many more. You really do not want to have this debate.
- 03/03/2013 03:03:15 PM
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No, I do not, because Medicare and torts are invariably scapegoated for all problems with healthcare
- 04/03/2013 12:52:37 AM
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I can argue with anyone on this (and have) btut first we need to break out that dictionary
- 04/03/2013 04:45:06 AM
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I am sure you can and have; ability to form arguments does not automatically grant them validity.
- 11/03/2013 09:56:11 PM
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Like I said, short conversation, once everyone uses the same definitions.
- 13/03/2013 03:28:52 PM
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From the way you're shitting yourself with glee, I'm going to say Social Security.
- 01/03/2013 12:45:50 AM
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Also unlike Ponzis, Social Security was not meant to profit—it just did anyway. For 75 years.
- 01/03/2013 01:55:46 AM
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It is a "Ponzi" by definition, any argument to the contrary just makes you look ignorant.
- 02/03/2013 12:02:46 PM
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Wait: An insurer is saying insurance is a Ponzi scheme? 
- 04/03/2013 12:56:30 AM
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- 04/03/2013 12:56:30 AM
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You are making even lese sense than usual... Quite an acomplishment. *NM*
- 04/03/2013 03:31:39 AM
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Maybe, but my math usually checks, and I never have to explain what I omitted.
- 11/03/2013 09:55:50 PM
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My math ALWAYS "checks" - it isn't personal, you are just making absolutely no sense, *NM*
- 13/03/2013 03:27:11 PM
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It's the world's greatest Ponzi scheme, since the government forces us to give money to it.
- 01/03/2013 01:05:05 PM
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Yes, "government forcing people to give money" defines a Ponzi; speeding tickets are Ponzis. 
- 01/03/2013 03:53:02 PM
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- 01/03/2013 03:53:02 PM
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Good lord my friend.....
- 02/03/2013 04:19:35 AM
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I will just link what Isaac said; maybe then you will pay attention to it.
- 02/03/2013 04:56:34 AM
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I really think you terribly misread what I said *NM*
- 02/03/2013 06:59:56 AM
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I really do not think I did.
- 04/03/2013 01:43:02 AM
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I'm pretty confident you have
- 04/03/2013 11:49:19 AM
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We evidently disagree on what constitutes a Ponzi scheme.
- 11/03/2013 09:56:27 PM
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No, I agree with a clear definiton, you seem not to want to absorb that
- 11/03/2013 10:24:47 PM
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Re: Yes, "government forcing people to give money" defines a Ponzi; speeding tickets are Ponzis.
- 02/03/2013 12:22:34 PM
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- 02/03/2013 12:22:34 PM
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Fraud="money contributed is NOT invested for the contributor, but instead redistributed to others"?
- 04/03/2013 12:51:30 AM
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You can try and misrepresent what I have said all you want, you are still wrong.
- 04/03/2013 03:45:24 AM
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Dude, how is QUOTING you misrepresenting you?! And why must I ALWAYS ask that in these threads?
- 11/03/2013 09:56:18 PM
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- 11/03/2013 09:56:18 PM
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Okay, that's a really weird or naive standard to judge SS by
- 01/03/2013 05:25:11 PM
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Great; will you put that on a postcard to Cannoli, A2K, Rick Perry and the rest of your party? 
- 01/03/2013 07:39:44 PM
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- 01/03/2013 07:39:44 PM
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I don't think I'd be telling them anything they don't already know... I mostly agree with them
- 02/03/2013 05:38:56 AM
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Means testing is flat out WRONG, and the contribution limit is a sticky debate
- 02/03/2013 12:43:09 PM
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Tell that to him not me, I didn't express an opinion and my implied one obviously doesn't favor it
- 02/03/2013 05:28:14 PM
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I was, I just hit the repy under the wrong post. He was the first to bering the two topics up. *NM*
- 03/03/2013 04:09:34 AM
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It is insurance against old age poverty, not a longevity lottery.
- 04/03/2013 02:00:24 AM
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It is not insurance, it is a pension plan, that also contains an overpriced LT disability insurance.
- 04/03/2013 04:00:42 AM
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Social Security Insurance; says so right on the label.
- 11/03/2013 09:53:33 PM
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You can call it BedroomWindowVitamins but it does not change what it acutally IS.
- 13/03/2013 04:34:42 PM
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"Sustainable"=/="profitable;" bankruptcy was not always a given, as your fellows claim..
- 04/03/2013 01:35:04 AM
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Sustainable often means profitable, they are not universally synonmous but both at once is ideal
- 04/03/2013 12:25:45 PM
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That is the IDEAL, but NOT point: Sustainability needs no profit, yet profit ensures sustainability.
- 11/03/2013 09:56:48 PM
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Your attacks on republican ideals would have more credit if you understood them
- 02/03/2013 04:27:34 AM
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An ironic charge, since their defenses of those ideals typically suffer from the same defect.
- 02/03/2013 04:51:32 AM
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- 02/03/2013 04:51:32 AM
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I'm rubber you're glue, whatever you say bounces of me and sticks to you. nyah, nyah, nyah
- 02/03/2013 12:58:10 PM
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"Unsustainable"=/="meeting monthly obligations for 75 YEARS and still having $2.5 trillion left."
- 04/03/2013 01:03:09 AM
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Please look up the definition of sustainable. Hint: "its worked so far" isn't it.
- 04/03/2013 04:25:19 AM
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"As it is currently constructed/funded" is one HELL of a qualifier.
- 04/03/2013 04:41:30 AM
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You just don't get it, or apparently are so in love with your political ideology you won't.
- 04/03/2013 04:58:15 AM
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I believe if you check civilizations record you will find the human population has steadily risen.
- 04/03/2013 05:08:38 AM
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*sigh*
- 04/03/2013 12:15:22 PM
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Birth RATES have fallen; POPULATION steadily rose in every period except the Black Deaths peak.
- 11/03/2013 09:56:36 PM
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Ironic that you would make my point while arguing against
- 04/03/2013 06:12:29 PM
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?
- 11/03/2013 09:56:59 PM
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you mistate his posistion and then rationalize that you know what he really meant
- 13/03/2013 12:06:44 PM
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aH yes the great liberal investmetn/retirement plan that offers me a NEGATIGVE rate of return...
- 02/03/2013 11:51:50 AM
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Do you sincerely believe people earning $14,560/year can afford investing 4% of it?
- 04/03/2013 12:53:30 AM
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*sigh*
- 04/03/2013 03:43:08 AM
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I tried it with compound interest; $44.80/month at 4% for 50 years still does not get to $1.25 mill.
- 04/03/2013 04:24:51 AM
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Here are some clues.
- 04/03/2013 04:37:39 AM
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It is math, not the Riddle of the Sphinx: EIther it adds up or does not.
- 04/03/2013 05:02:39 AM
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Math is simple - Either you know how to calculate it or you don't
- 04/03/2013 11:55:24 AM
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SS is supposed to supplement a proper pension, not provide your sole income after retirement
- 05/03/2013 03:53:03 AM
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Did you bother to actually read anything?
- 05/03/2013 02:32:16 PM
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do *YOU* know what "living in poverty" means?
- 05/03/2013 05:49:14 PM
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Re: do *YOU* know what "living in poverty" means? --- yeah, I've BEEN there.
- 05/03/2013 08:01:33 PM
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how about respond to a post with logic and civility instead of being a troll for once?
- 05/03/2013 11:03:00 PM
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All I have used is civility and logic, or least as much civility as was warrented.
- 06/03/2013 04:28:04 AM
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yeah, it's my fault for stooping to your level....
- 08/03/2013 07:22:24 PM
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Re: yeah, it's my fault for stooping to your level....
- 10/03/2013 01:42:26 PM
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i'm not going to keep going in circles so i will finish with this....
- 11/03/2013 10:08:53 PM
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"Rah! Rah! Rah!" Can we please cut out all this blather and bile?
- 05/03/2013 11:53:41 PM
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