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Tell that to him not me, I didn't express an opinion and my implied one obviously doesn't favor it Isaac Send a noteboard - 02/03/2013 05:28:14 PM

All I said is that means testing is shifting it more towards insurance then savings. That's not a condemn or condone comment and FYI I don't bother arguing with Joel about everything he says I disagree with when I know he knows I don't agree with him already. If I did that he and I would extend our already lengthy back and forths to doorstopper novel lengths. As to your comment itself, no I don't think means testing is necessarily flat out wrong because it depends on the circumstance.

Hypothetical: I approach 50 18 year olds and offer them this deal. "From this point onward you will pay me $100 a month any month you make over $1000, until you turn 65. At the end of that period I will take the average life expectancy at that time, subtract 65 from it and divide the current sum by that and pay you each 1% of that value annually until you die, using 50% of the cash, and divide the other half up proportional to your payments in" that actually does 'screw' the people who paid in their hundred every month in favor of the guys who missed payments or maybe never paid in a dime because they always made under $1000 a month. Still many might find such a setup attractive. This is means testing, just on the accumulation phase rather than distribution, we could setup a hypothetical on the distribution end to, like people don't collect at all if their assets exceed 1 million or their total monthly income $5000. That's means testing and so long as everyone knew what they were getting into and had the choice, its not wrong.

Means testing isn't 'flat out wrong', a specific setup for it could be, though never if it is voluntary unless fraud is involved or some parallel to usury. I already said I consider the current SS setup to be about as morally bankrupt as SS's bank account will be if we don't fix it, so it would be a pretty obvious and correct guess I wouldn't favor the current system plus means testing.

The intuitive mind is a sacred gift and the rational mind is a faithful servant. We have created a society that honors the servant and has forgotten the gift.
- Albert Einstein

King of Cairhien 20-7-2
Chancellor of the Landsraad, Archduke of Is'Mod
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Can You Name the Largest US Program to ANNUALLY Collect More Than It Spent for 75 Straight Years? - 28/02/2013 11:03:18 PM 1315 Views
It's the world's greatest Ponzi scheme, since the government forces us to give money to it. - 01/03/2013 01:05:05 PM 749 Views
Yes, "government forcing people to give money" defines a Ponzi; speeding tickets are Ponzis. - 01/03/2013 03:53:02 PM 876 Views
Good lord my friend..... - 02/03/2013 04:19:35 AM 788 Views
I will just link what Isaac said; maybe then you will pay attention to it. - 02/03/2013 04:56:34 AM 827 Views
I really think you terribly misread what I said *NM* - 02/03/2013 06:59:56 AM 433 Views
Yes he did. He has very poor reading comprehension skills. *NM* - 03/03/2013 01:07:59 AM 459 Views
I really do not think I did. - 04/03/2013 01:43:02 AM 866 Views
I'm pretty confident you have - 04/03/2013 11:49:19 AM 852 Views
We evidently disagree on what constitutes a Ponzi scheme. - 11/03/2013 09:56:27 PM 777 Views
No, I agree with a clear definiton, you seem not to want to absorb that - 11/03/2013 10:24:47 PM 924 Views
It is neither an investment nor fraudulent. - 12/03/2013 02:34:09 AM 991 Views
Okay, that's a really weird or naive standard to judge SS by - 01/03/2013 05:25:11 PM 799 Views
Great; will you put that on a postcard to Cannoli, A2K, Rick Perry and the rest of your party? - 01/03/2013 07:39:44 PM 822 Views
I don't think I'd be telling them anything they don't already know... I mostly agree with them - 02/03/2013 05:38:56 AM 935 Views
Means testing is flat out WRONG, and the contribution limit is a sticky debate - 02/03/2013 12:43:09 PM 750 Views
Tell that to him not me, I didn't express an opinion and my implied one obviously doesn't favor it - 02/03/2013 05:28:14 PM 882 Views
Your attacks on republican ideals would have more credit if you understood them - 02/03/2013 04:27:34 AM 808 Views
aH yes the great liberal investmetn/retirement plan that offers me a NEGATIGVE rate of return... - 02/03/2013 11:51:50 AM 723 Views
Do you sincerely believe people earning $14,560/year can afford investing 4% of it? - 04/03/2013 12:53:30 AM 883 Views
*sigh* - 04/03/2013 03:43:08 AM 716 Views
I tried it with compound interest; $44.80/month at 4% for 50 years still does not get to $1.25 mill. - 04/03/2013 04:24:51 AM 796 Views
Here are some clues. - 04/03/2013 04:37:39 AM 662 Views
It is math, not the Riddle of the Sphinx: EIther it adds up or does not. - 04/03/2013 05:02:39 AM 814 Views
Math is simple - Either you know how to calculate it or you don't - 04/03/2013 11:55:24 AM 896 Views
Indeed. - 11/03/2013 09:53:59 PM 797 Views
Re: Indeed. - 13/03/2013 05:00:10 PM 981 Views
SS is supposed to supplement a proper pension, not provide your sole income after retirement - 05/03/2013 03:53:03 AM 676 Views
Did you bother to actually read anything? - 05/03/2013 02:32:16 PM 747 Views
do *YOU* know what "living in poverty" means? - 05/03/2013 05:49:14 PM 810 Views
Re: do *YOU* know what "living in poverty" means? --- yeah, I've BEEN there. - 05/03/2013 08:01:33 PM 786 Views
how about respond to a post with logic and civility instead of being a troll for once? - 05/03/2013 11:03:00 PM 871 Views
All I have used is civility and logic, or least as much civility as was warrented. - 06/03/2013 04:28:04 AM 822 Views
yeah, it's my fault for stooping to your level.... - 08/03/2013 07:22:24 PM 859 Views
Re: yeah, it's my fault for stooping to your level.... - 10/03/2013 01:42:26 PM 733 Views
i'm not going to keep going in circles so i will finish with this.... - 11/03/2013 10:08:53 PM 1079 Views
No loss. - 13/03/2013 04:37:41 PM 673 Views
"Rah! Rah! Rah!" Can we please cut out all this blather and bile? - 05/03/2013 11:53:41 PM 751 Views
spoken like a true enemy of the state! - 06/03/2013 12:54:38 AM 718 Views
Re: spoken like a true enemy of the state! - 08/03/2013 03:04:37 PM 777 Views
I was not trolling, but clarifying. - 11/03/2013 09:53:48 PM 800 Views

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