Re: i'm quite curious about one thing, since i know you're such a numbers guy
Isaac Send a noteboard - 11/11/2012 05:48:09 PM
Actually I can think of more than one person here who knows the GOP's inner workings better than Tom, starting with myself, what with being a party official and all. And not living in NY state. Tom's smart and knows his stuff but he wouldn't make that claim and I've no idea what you base it off of. We all know what happened this time perfectly well, we relied on a lot of Obama's people not showing from 2008 and more of ours showing, as best as I can tell, in Ohio anyway, we actually ran a better ground game too, his worked in the end, ours didn't, in all probability it was just took less effort per voter for them then for us and they had a bigger pool. Sort of like 2004 in reverse, not a 2008 or a 1984 re-election.
i'm wondering how you reconciled the number of websites predicting obama wins across the swing states with your own view of the race as it happened. obviously we know at this point that nate silver pretty much predicted the electoral map for every state, including every senate race but heitkamp/berg. but there were other sites like huffington post, talking points memo, electoral-vote.com and others which had obama up with relatively comfortable margins. as i said in another comment to you, the margin of victory in most states would suggest the opposite of a close race but it seems like the GOP was pretty blindsided by how badly romney was doing.
Well first off I mostly ignore polls and blogs except to look at their sampling rates and crosstabs if time permits, it really didn't so very little reconciling happened. It might help if I explain how I do polling locally and if you want I can even email you the excel sheet I juggle numbers on the downticket with, but loosely:
Q1: "Would you describe... Dem, Ind, GOP"
Q#: "In the race for X between Republican John Jackson and Democrat Jack Johnson who..."
And that generates a grid, a 3x3 matrix in this case.
A B C
D E F
G H I
Where A for instance is self-identified DEms voting for the Dem candidate and E are self-ID Indies who are undecided and I self-ID GOP voting Republican. I'm not really interested here in the sum of responses, just the percentage for Self-ID and that candidate.
Now I say, "These represent the average voter in outlook, but not turnout figures", let us assume X+Y+Z=1 and X is the percent of the voters who Self-ID as Dem and Y as Indy and Z as Republican.
DEm John Jackson get: Dem = AX + DY + GZ
and Republican Jack Johnson gets: GOP = CX + FY + IZ
and Undeicdeds are Und = BX + EY + HZ
and incidentally those C and G values, Dems voting Republican and Republicans voting for a Dem, are decently high even on up ticket candidates but when I tell a far-downticket candidate "You need to consolidate your base" I just got done circling G and I and showing him or her some of their colleagues lower and higher scores respectively.
Now that's all pretty ironclad, as much as any polling can be, but then to get a real projection we have to pick values for X, Y, and Z and guess how UN is going to break. We use historical data for that in part but places change a lot in even 20 years and you'll only have 4 or 5 races to compare with. So it's a guessing game and I'll pick a best and worst case reasonable scenario... ironically my worst case scenario nailed every local race on the head within 2 points except a 3-way race. I remember telling one of them when asked how to counter that, "You can't, if they pull of that turnout we get crushed, end story, but they won't" of course in my own head 'they won't' actually meant 'no point worrying about it since we can't do shit if they do'. Well they did. So the polling data was right but the projection for turnout wasn't and polling that is all guesswork I don't care what anyone says, ten educated guesses, 1 will be right. I've never seen a likely voter modeling system that 'made sense' and I really do think everyone with reputations for getting it right just guessed mostly right twice in a row and did some spin and convincing to make them sound righter.
So not really blindsided, at least locally, but then Romney polled very well with Republicans locally and they voted that way too, it was the R-D-I make up on Nov 6th that blind-sided us and it's not like no one believed it possible, just thought it unlikely and knew there wasn't shit to do about it if it was.
The intuitive mind is a sacred gift and the rational mind is a faithful servant. We have created a society that honors the servant and has forgotten the gift.
- Albert Einstein
King of Cairhien 20-7-2
Chancellor of the Landsraad, Archduke of Is'Mod
- Albert Einstein
King of Cairhien 20-7-2
Chancellor of the Landsraad, Archduke of Is'Mod
What next for Romney and the Republican party?
07/11/2012 03:51:50 PM
- 993 Views
In my view, more moderation is needed.
07/11/2012 04:17:05 PM
- 523 Views
Pretty sure seniors are growing MORE numerous, not less. You're probably right about the rest. *NM*
07/11/2012 05:03:17 PM
- 512 Views
That's true, but I don't think that's the right way to look at it.
07/11/2012 05:18:52 PM
- 538 Views
Yeah, I hear what you're saying, and I agree with the overall point.
07/11/2012 07:52:33 PM
- 766 Views
Libertarian is the way to go IMO.
07/11/2012 05:19:29 PM
- 473 Views
totally agree, i was quite disappointed Johnson didn't get better results *NM*
07/11/2012 06:15:09 PM
- 285 Views
I'd say they're pretty much done
07/11/2012 07:54:44 PM
- 488 Views
They're through. They've been utterly crushed, demolished, and annihilated after last night.
07/11/2012 10:34:47 PM
- 566 Views
Well Romney is retiring but no the GOP is hardly 'done'
08/11/2012 12:51:44 AM
- 455 Views
I do hope the Republican party have the same lax attitude, I love seeing them lose *NM*
08/11/2012 12:46:32 PM
- 228 Views
I imagine lots of idiots feel the same way on both sides about both parties *NM*
08/11/2012 11:05:29 PM
- 251 Views
If you're relying on the democrats crashing and burning
09/11/2012 02:45:41 PM
- 510 Views
the dems played the "wait for the repubs to crash and burn" strategy and it worked out ok this year
09/11/2012 05:01:53 PM
- 563 Views
Off topic, but is your Shift key broken?
09/11/2012 05:47:12 PM
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do you have similar problems when talking to people with weird hair color or clothes IRL?
09/11/2012 07:09:24 PM
- 438 Views
The Dems learned their lesson from the Gore campaign
09/11/2012 06:25:23 PM
- 549 Views
i beg to differ
09/11/2012 07:22:40 PM
- 418 Views
The facts speak for themselves
09/11/2012 07:46:20 PM
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Re: The facts speak for themselves
11/11/2012 01:13:05 AM
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i'm quite curious about one thing, since i know you're such a numbers guy
11/11/2012 02:01:31 PM
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Re: i'm quite curious about one thing, since i know you're such a numbers guy
11/11/2012 05:48:09 PM
- 722 Views
I've also got a question for you
11/11/2012 02:16:07 PM
- 441 Views
Re: I've also got a question for you
11/11/2012 04:51:55 PM
- 485 Views
Re: I've also got a question for you
11/11/2012 05:48:52 PM
- 585 Views
There's also the fake or exaggeration aspect that might be in play but I can't judge that
11/11/2012 06:44:16 PM
- 945 Views
I think you were taking that statement rather literally
11/11/2012 07:36:14 PM
- 493 Views
I took it as a literal statement, the language implied as much to me...
11/11/2012 08:45:16 PM
- 567 Views
Oh, I can absolutely count on them crahsing and burning, that's a given, happens to both regularly *NM*
09/11/2012 06:28:51 PM
- 271 Views
You can't count on exploiting that
09/11/2012 06:39:47 PM
- 600 Views
'Mistakes' is subjective, sometimes you have to play your hand
11/11/2012 01:09:31 AM
- 470 Views
how are 300+ EVs "the skin of his teeth"?
08/11/2012 05:46:51 PM
- 484 Views
Because he barely won them? *NM*
08/11/2012 11:06:14 PM
- 214 Views
only OH, NC and FL are within 2% margin, i'd hardly call that "barely won"
08/11/2012 11:25:54 PM
- 493 Views
What makes you think Hillary won't be running?
08/11/2012 06:07:38 PM
- 464 Views
hillary has stated time and again she is done when she steps down as sec'y of state
08/11/2012 11:27:56 PM
- 430 Views
While I agree with the overall point that the Republican party isn't done by any means
08/11/2012 11:53:12 PM
- 393 Views
Romney is done; the last defeated nominee to be renominated was Nixon.
08/11/2012 04:53:52 PM
- 660 Views