You did not say it, but citing the importance of cheaper supplies suggests it.
Joel Send a noteboard - 25/01/2012 11:10:04 AM
You may recall that is how the article said Chinese suppliers could present Apple a warehouse full of glass samples to test: Because it cost the supplier nothing, thanks to government subsidies.
That's ultimately just some small gesture that nobody cares about when making real decisions. At most it grasped Apple's attention and forced them to give the Chinese supplier fair consideration. I didn't see anything about government subsidies playing a meaningful role in making that supplier the most competitive. The clustering of supporting industries and suppliers, on the other hand, was a real factor.
The samples themselves were a small gesture; that subsidies let the company fill a warehouse with them at no cost is not: It is a big reason supply costs are so much lower in China (hence the article cited it as such.) Considering that Apple itself created a clustered supply chain in "Silicon Vally North," I suspect those subsidies are a bigger factor in outsourcing than clustering is. Were supply chain clusters the only factor they could be easily addressed (and tend to be anyway; companies were prone to centralize supplies to save money even when they did not fear outsourcing.) Federal subsidies are a bigger challenge, because crony capitalism that is Chinas norm is far more contentious in the West.
I am unsure what that has to do with the outsourcers contention they go overseas because America no longer produces workers with the education and skills for the demanding jobs they need done. Yet when I did manufacturing work before leaving the States all it required was a HS diploma or GED. The company was, however, in the process of building a Indonesian plant to take over a major product line our plant had been producing for years: Because the labor cost was lower.
I'm unsure why you seem to think it should have something to do with it, considering that I was talking about something else.
Because according to the article, despite its assertion that supply costs are outsourcings critical cause, "companies and economists" claim that "Though Americans are among the most educated workers in the world, the nation has stopped training enough people in the mid-level skills that factories need." Which might make sense if not for the fact so much of the manufacturing going overseas is unskilled entry level assembly work.
But if you want me to talk about that, fine. Outsourcing of genuinely low-skilled work is one thing, outsourcing of the iPhone and the like quite another. For one thing, the former is really all about the wage costs, and so some companies move from country to country several times, always looking for the next undeveloped country with low wages - Eastern Europe had such factories for a while, now they're leaving again. The latter is quite a different story and far more difficult to move from one country to another. The article said something about those Chinese workers being paid only USD 17 a day; while that is obviously well below Western minimum wages, it's several times what unskilled easily replaceable workers get. So when they talk about America not having those workers, what they mean is workers who *do* have a not insignificant amount of technical training and knowledge - and large amounts of such workers. I don't think it's so far-fetched to say the US and other European countries have too few of those, for a variety of reasons - people choosing less marketable careers, people being either under-educated or over-educated for it, and the like.
It may be difficult, but obviously not so much so that companies are unable to do it on a large scale, because they are. In the articles real world example of a former Apple engineer who wound up earning $12/hr at a call center in his old office when his job went to China, it was not because he lacked education to do his job, but simply because an equally educated Chinese worker could and would do it for far less.
Not that I dispute America is falling behind in college educated labor, or that it hurts our competitiveness, but the issue there at the moment is (contrary to the claims of outsourcers) not lacking such workers, but that those we have are now losing their jobs to outsourcing just as unskilled workers have been for decades. To a great and shameful extent I think that is why America has begun caring about a far from novel large scale labor transfer. It is similar to what happened a generation ago when middle class union manufacturing jobs began leaving the US. Younger workers then were were able to transition to the up and coming tech industry, letting their old careers be relegated to the lower class.
Now those tech jobs are leaving, too, and no fallback position exists. "Ebusiness" is cited periodically, but since that is ideally suited to outsourcing (since supply chain issues are largely irrelevant to data transmission) it is hardly a long term solution; the Third World can create the infrastructure for that in months or years rather than the decades it took to develop the infrastructure the tech industry requires.
Honorbound and honored to be Bonded to Mahtaliel Sedai
Last First in wotmania Chat
Slightly better than chocolate.
Love still can't be coerced.
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Last First in wotmania Chat
Slightly better than chocolate.
Love still can't be coerced.
Please Don't Eat the Newbies!
LoL. Be well, RAFOlk.
How U.S. Lost Out on iPhone Work
21/01/2012 10:10:30 PM
- 1096 Views
The sad fact is...
22/01/2012 02:56:46 AM
- 606 Views
I am SO sick of hearing this false rhetoric.
22/01/2012 06:39:07 PM
- 676 Views
Well, you're both presenting the far sides of the situation, surprisingly enough.
23/01/2012 10:22:23 AM
- 558 Views
Well, yes, I do realize there are people out there too good for decent jobs.
23/01/2012 10:44:57 AM
- 532 Views
Re: Well, yes, I do realize there are people out there too good for decent jobs.
23/01/2012 11:29:53 AM
- 534 Views
I don't believe its false. I believe its true. As seen, daily, by myself.
25/01/2012 07:11:00 PM
- 556 Views
You probably aren't aware that even though it is a crime in China...
23/01/2012 04:59:27 AM
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I guess threatening mass suicide isn't a big fuss?
23/01/2012 10:25:48 PM
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According to the NYT article "nothing like Foxconn City exists in the United States."
24/01/2012 10:58:56 AM
- 604 Views
It will be acceptable as long as the US remains a market for products made that way.
22/01/2012 06:10:20 PM
- 638 Views
It always kind of cracks me up when people bitch about China when...
23/01/2012 05:04:36 AM
- 655 Views
People really should read the rest of the article and not just the first page.
23/01/2012 11:21:39 PM
- 520 Views
Are you saying the US should heavily subsidize its supplies like the Chinese government does?
24/01/2012 11:15:37 AM
- 519 Views
Re: Are you saying the US should heavily subsidize its supplies like the Chinese government does?
24/01/2012 01:06:51 PM
- 551 Views
The difference is there would be tremendous hue and cry over such subsidies in the US.
25/01/2012 11:39:04 AM
- 449 Views
Of course not. Where did I even say anything about that?
24/01/2012 08:10:29 PM
- 615 Views
You did not say it, but citing the importance of cheaper supplies suggests it.
25/01/2012 11:10:04 AM
- 478 Views
What a bunch of shit.
24/01/2012 01:33:19 AM
- 718 Views
Maybe you could share something less shitty? *NM*
24/01/2012 10:12:38 AM
- 218 Views
Perhaps, but he's spot-on regarding on China's industrial and currency policies. *NM*
24/01/2012 01:12:44 PM
- 212 Views
Then he could surely find something to share.
24/01/2012 03:01:00 PM
- 623 Views
What is was all about amounts to America playing by softball rules in a hardball game.
24/01/2012 11:27:30 PM
- 706 Views