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Terms from fighting probably can't be ignored; terms from war can be. Joel Send a noteboard - 13/09/2011 02:07:17 AM
Here is a clip of what was edited out.

The manipulation here is blatant. I am disgusted when either side uses these tactics.

I don't think that he was advocating taking them out with mobs weilding ballot boxes. Pretty sure he was talking about taking them out by using the right to vote. Duh.

Excessively so; his repeated reference to the political conflict as a "war", telling the crowd it was an "army" and twice saying they should "take out" the Tea Party are inflammatory incitement and therefore dangerous. If some liberal nutjob and/or zealot takes those statements as encouragement to physically attack a Tea Party leader I would hold Hoffa partly responsible for that, just as I would perry if a conservative nutjob/zealot physically attacked Bernanke. These are tense times, and that means we can't afford to toss rhetorical bombs into groups of desperate angry partisans.


analogies regarding war or fighting. I loathe boxing but I often use boxing analogies such as "Get back in the ring and fight" or "throw in the towel". I also don't like war but the terms uses for warfare are very good for analogies. This is the type of crap that started the backlash against political correctness. This is a never ending cycle here. None of those instances were that bad. It just makes me want to bang my head against a wall. Or a head. ;)

I lost track of how many times Hoffa said, "war" in just a one minute clip. Calling people traitors and suggesting things be "done" to them seems about the same to me (seriously or not, Perry was chiding an IA crowd for responding too MILDLY to Bernanke, despite their strong and obvious displeasure with the Fed Chair; since they were already yelling at him, what more did the governor expect/recommend...?) I'm not saying people can't or shouldn't be passionate, heated, or that they can or should completely avoid any language that MIGHT be connected with physical violence. I am saying they shouldn't consciously and concertedly integrate intensely and explicitly violent language as much as possible to make themselves sound "tough", whip supporters into a rabid frenzy or whatever. At BEST that kind of demagoguery is just substituting empty emotion for policy, but when lethal imagery is routinely applied with a perfunctory disclaimer identifying it as a metaphor, it's dangerous. As far as comparing this to the PC backlash I humbly submit that the difference between then and now is that people weren't getting shot over PC.
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I did, but it's not really pertinent to most of our comments - 08/09/2011 04:02:42 AM 404 Views
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For me that video changes nothing; his rhetorical imagery was unacceptably violent. - 12/09/2011 10:28:00 PM 490 Views
I don't think that we can afford to watch every single little thing we say and obliterate any - 13/09/2011 12:56:34 AM 452 Views
Terms from fighting probably can't be ignored; terms from war can be. - 13/09/2011 02:07:17 AM 563 Views
get your facts straight - 13/09/2011 03:39:29 AM 431 Views
I did: "Addressing a political rally in Iowa on Monday... - 13/09/2011 04:26:57 AM 651 Views

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