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Sounds like your real argument is with the other bikers; I'm just reiterating their arguments. Joel Send a noteboard - 06/07/2011 03:38:39 AM
Albeit unintentionally; it was the most obvious practical objection that came to mind.
You can't tell me that a biker with his eyes behind a visor and his ears tucked in a helmet has as much road awareness as a bareheaded one, and the smaller and quicker the vehicle the easier it becomes to avoid accidents than survive them.

wrong and wrong. helmets are specifically designed *NOT* to restrict vision. even when i wear my full-face helmet with the visor down i still have my full peripheral as if i was wearing sunglasses. since it's perfectly acceptable that my vision is just fine when i'm wearing sunglasses behind the wheel of my car, why would my helmet cause me to be somehow incapable of seeing the road properly?

I believe how acceptable ones vision is in sunglasses in a car is debated, though I wouldn't debate it. Yet I would say that it's less than it would be without them (except under particular conditions, e.g. polarized sunglasses when there's a lot of unpolarized light). That is, it's ACCEPTABLE, but I do think it's DIMINISHED, however marginally. Helmet visors, however, face other challenges; sunglasses don't get rain, mud, oil and bugs on them, which is why, as I'm certain is also true of your helmet visor, they don't have wipers or washer bottles. Meanwhile, DESIGNING something to not restrict peripheral vision is not PREVENTING it from doing so, and even if you do design a helmet with zero peripheral vision resriction it's kind of a Catch 22: The less it restricts your vision, the less of your head it covers and therefore protects, and the less protection it provides the less basis there is for this whole discussion. ;)
also, the limited hearing is a specious argument because of the fact that helmet or not, your hearing is not going to be any better or worse once you get up to speed. it's either the wind in your ears at 60mph or it's the wind in your ears at 60mph with a helmet on. i'd argue that roughly 70% of bikers who wear helmets wear open ones which do not cover your ears at all.

You know better than I, naturally, but the helmets I've seen designed to facilitate hearing (and that such helmets exist indicates a strong belief that, at least in some circumstances, other helmets DO impair hearing) merely had holes on each side. Maybe an inch and a half across, does that "sound" right? Of course, sound reaches our ears from all directions, not just through narrow holes right next to them (after all, our ears themselves are structured to focus sound so that it enters the auditory canal even when not traveling directly toward it). If you do mean helmets fully open at the ears we're back to the above Catch 22: The helmets protection doesn't just stop where riders vision begins, it stops where their ears do.
the questions of vision and hearing are the types of things the protesters of the original article like to spread to justify their lack of helmet use. i have no problem if someone wants to not wear a helmet, but to pretend that wearing a helmet is somehow *less* safe than not is incredibly disingenuous.

I'm willing to take your word for it, though I still think it's debatable; you ride and I don't so I can only offer second hand anecdotes and sound speculations that nonetheless aren't necessarily valid. That said, I think I have at least demonstrated why a helmet visor is more than just a pair of sunglasses attached to your helmet.
one more thing: the smaller and quicker your vehicle, the more likely you're going to lose traction when trying to make evasive moves to avoid accidents. there is no way around this fact because only having two wheels on the road makes you have terrible stability when you are not moving forward or sitting still.

No argument there; it's one of many reasons I wouldn't touch a bike with a 10' pole. However, wearing a helmet doesn't solve that problem, and I feel fairly confident you'd still rather try to avoid than endure an accident even knowing you have less traction and more concern about center of gravity than you would in a small car. Small and quick carries different liabilities than big and thick, but it seems pretty obvious which is more easily augmented in a motorcyle.
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You can't make this stuff up: Helmet law protester dies in crash - 05/07/2011 08:47:14 PM 947 Views
Kinda undermines his protest *NM* - 05/07/2011 09:01:50 PM 278 Views
Just a tad bit *NM* - 05/07/2011 09:06:24 PM 259 Views
How so? He wasn't demanding the right to survive crashes when only a helmet makes that possible. - 05/07/2011 11:06:44 PM 605 Views
New York feels that people should have to wear helmets for their own safety - 05/07/2011 11:20:36 PM 579 Views
He felt his own safety was his own concern. - 06/07/2011 12:07:05 AM 509 Views
Who do you think would have ended up paying for his care for the rest of his life if the accident - 06/07/2011 01:08:49 AM 662 Views
The same people who pay for everyone else whose actions render them vegetables. - 06/07/2011 01:50:20 AM 783 Views
Maybe a more effective argument you could use against me would be pointing out - 06/07/2011 02:33:21 AM 573 Views
Yeah, that is a better example. - 06/07/2011 03:03:01 AM 544 Views
Oops, ignore! *NM* - 06/07/2011 11:44:10 PM 340 Views
Now, who said irony wasn't funny? *NM* - 05/07/2011 09:22:58 PM 396 Views
what a fricking idiot - 05/07/2011 10:02:17 PM 740 Views
That's your opinion to which you're entitled. - 05/07/2011 11:19:36 PM 994 Views
Anarchy, baby! *NM* - 06/07/2011 12:58:23 AM 495 Views
I understand the pov, I had a BF who felt that same way. It's still much like childish defiance. - 06/07/2011 01:26:15 AM 825 Views
In part it's a matter of principle, but if we really want to analyze it there's some deeper validity - 06/07/2011 02:13:05 AM 676 Views
you keep spreading falsehoods, stop it please - 06/07/2011 02:49:01 AM 849 Views
Sounds like your real argument is with the other bikers; I'm just reiterating their arguments. - 06/07/2011 03:38:39 AM 773 Views
It's not "much like" childish defiance. It IS. *NM* - 06/07/2011 11:45:05 PM 449 Views
Uh Joel... - 06/07/2011 03:38:24 AM 602 Views
Sorry, but that doesn't make sense - 06/07/2011 07:02:33 PM 807 Views
Yes it does - 06/07/2011 07:32:54 PM 557 Views
how many people are really seriously injured that way? - 06/07/2011 07:15:16 PM 773 Views
Did you actually read my post? - 06/07/2011 07:36:13 PM 675 Views
my ex had 3 cracked ribs from an accident like that - 07/07/2011 02:46:07 AM 712 Views
Re: That's your opinion to which you're entitled. - 06/07/2011 05:18:12 PM 764 Views
Re: That's your opinion to which you're entitled. - 06/07/2011 06:13:44 PM 838 Views
Hold the phone here... - 06/07/2011 07:49:10 PM 960 Views
+1 *NM* - 06/07/2011 08:42:14 PM 343 Views
You agree with him that the abortion debate is about a mothers convenience versus the babys life? - 06/07/2011 10:48:52 PM 680 Views
im not bringing abortion into this, its a separate issue *NM* - 06/07/2011 10:56:17 PM 334 Views
It's really not. - 07/07/2011 12:20:10 AM 709 Views
i'm really not - 07/07/2011 03:34:23 PM 787 Views
What else could the debate be about? - 06/07/2011 10:58:51 PM 641 Views
"The babys life", not just "life". - 07/07/2011 12:18:02 AM 967 Views
I think I could make that up. *NM* - 05/07/2011 11:41:00 PM 269 Views
Smartass *NM* - 06/07/2011 12:57:22 AM 285 Views
Helmets help save lives. 'Onest. - 07/07/2011 04:40:42 PM 708 Views

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