Active Users:374 Time:19/04/2025 03:24:59 PM
Time does not exist separately from space, as Einstein demonstrated almost a century ago. Dreaded Anomaly Send a noteboard - 01/12/2010 03:36:56 AM
Logic, empirical evidence, and the scientific method are undoubtedly useful, and they can explain our immediate surroundings quite well, but they are inadequate when taken to the extremes.

For instance, you can follow a trail of evidence back through time to the Big Bang, and then it breaks down. What caused that explosion? Where did it come from? The cyclical universe theory can push back further, but there must at some point have been a beginning.

If there was a beginning, what caused it? If not, what was there before? There are really only three possibilities. The first is that the universe came into being out of nothing, in violation of the laws of physics. The second is that the universe itself is eternal and has always existed in one form or another. The third is that it was created by a higher power.

There is not, and I suspect that there never can be, any empirical evidence to prove or disprove any of those possibilities. No matter what sort of reality you choose to believe in, you believe in it by faith.

Since you're free to place your faith in anything you wish, you could of course choose to believe in the eternal house cat that is the universe, and that would indeed be just as valid a conception of true reality as any that you can reach through evidence alone.


The laws of physics only apply within the universe. Trying to apply them "outside" or "before" the universe is simply nonsensical, because those spatial and temporal concepts only exist as part of the universe.

It's irrational to believe in something without a reason, i.e. evidence (or a logical proof whose assumptions fit known evidence). No evidence or logic suggests the universe has any human characteristics (or cat characteristics, just to be thorough), so there is no reason to believe that.
Reply to message
Is NASA set to reveal on Thursday signs of possible extraterrestial life within the solar system? - 30/11/2010 03:49:40 AM 1069 Views
Interesting. - 30/11/2010 04:43:15 AM 539 Views
crap! I will be watching this! - 30/11/2010 05:04:58 AM 685 Views
Goddammit Wikileaks get on this *NM* - 30/11/2010 05:05:19 AM 283 Views
There's no one to smear, why would wikileaks be interested? *NM* - 30/11/2010 01:45:58 PM 242 Views
If there is life in the solar system then it is likely a natural development in the universe. - 30/11/2010 05:12:38 AM 595 Views
Seems to put atheists in a bit of a catch-22 there. - 30/11/2010 05:54:25 AM 656 Views
Bwa? - 30/11/2010 06:45:33 AM 645 Views
Sorry, yeah. That is not my position. - 30/11/2010 07:03:17 AM 634 Views
The best will be when we find other intelligent life - 30/11/2010 02:32:35 PM 549 Views
Well, I don't actually agree with the first part of your Catch-22. At least, not entirely. - 30/11/2010 02:43:13 PM 677 Views
Using anthropomorphic terms to describe the universe only reflects on you, not on the universe. *NM* - 30/11/2010 07:31:04 PM 287 Views
What an arbitrary and meaningless statement. *NM* - 30/11/2010 07:52:13 PM 215 Views
Anthropomorphizing concepts is a cognitive bias. - 30/11/2010 11:19:23 PM 546 Views
Only given a certain metaphysical framework. - 01/12/2010 12:18:09 AM 590 Views
Mind dumbing that down a bit? - 01/12/2010 12:43:47 AM 528 Views
I think he is saying - 01/12/2010 01:26:34 AM 729 Views
That ain't not a lot simpler - 01/12/2010 01:35:38 AM 641 Views
Yes. - 01/12/2010 01:44:41 AM 586 Views
Those worldviews are unsupported by empirical evidence. - 01/12/2010 01:41:27 AM 680 Views
No worldviews are supported by empirical evidence. *NM* - 01/12/2010 01:57:23 AM 261 Views
Empiricism is unsupported by empirical evidence. *NM* - 01/12/2010 02:21:52 AM 235 Views
Empirical evidence is the only objective standard. - 01/12/2010 02:59:18 AM 584 Views
Empirical evidence cannot fully explain reality. - 01/12/2010 03:28:41 AM 656 Views
Re: Question (use google now!): what's the net energy of the universe? - 01/12/2010 03:35:57 AM 612 Views
Re: - 01/12/2010 03:45:22 AM 810 Views
Re: Re: - 01/12/2010 04:04:38 AM 591 Views
Time does not exist separately from space, as Einstein demonstrated almost a century ago. - 01/12/2010 03:36:56 AM 667 Views
Yes. I know what empiricism is. - 01/12/2010 05:17:05 AM 891 Views
Re: You are a smart person. - 01/12/2010 03:09:13 AM 557 Views
Thanks. - 01/12/2010 03:30:46 AM 798 Views
Interesting. I agree with what you're saying, actually. - 30/11/2010 07:49:51 PM 526 Views
It won't change the argument in the least. - 01/12/2010 05:26:16 AM 717 Views
I have the feeling it's probably not going to be that. - 30/11/2010 06:02:48 AM 595 Views
Ohh, exciting! - 30/11/2010 08:37:32 AM 560 Views
noooo! - 30/11/2010 10:19:27 AM 517 Views
Boring primitive things would be cool. - 30/11/2010 02:54:10 PM 529 Views
Hey, there's a name I recognize, "Iron Lisa" - 30/11/2010 09:25:01 AM 673 Views
WE'RE ALL GONNA DIEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE - 30/11/2010 02:33:30 PM 621 Views
I, for one, welcome our new alien overlords. *NM* - 30/11/2010 02:35:04 PM 237 Views
"I, for one, welcome our new INSECT overlords"! - 01/12/2010 12:40:27 AM 598 Views
but we don't know if they're insects yet! - 01/12/2010 12:55:52 AM 542 Views
I'll not bow to any mere Bacterial Overlords, Eukaryote Overlords only!!! *NM* - 01/12/2010 01:02:20 AM 243 Views
So you're prejudiced against the nuclearly challenged? - 01/12/2010 01:09:57 AM 552 Views
Down right genocidal toward them - 01/12/2010 01:31:47 AM 521 Views
Genocide is a bit extreme - 01/12/2010 02:13:18 AM 559 Views
They had better have a green man *NM* - 30/11/2010 10:45:56 AM 208 Views
Because you need somebody to attack Aginor and Balthamel? *NM* - 01/12/2010 01:04:23 AM 210 Views
Oh no you didn't *NM* - 01/12/2010 01:14:55 AM 206 Views
Seriously. - 01/12/2010 01:26:54 AM 530 Views
Re: But then you got turned on just thinking about the phrase? - 01/12/2010 02:23:02 AM 617 Views
I'm actually a tiny bit giddy about this. *NM* - 01/12/2010 01:04:49 AM 222 Views
Re: Arsenic. *NM* - 01/12/2010 02:09:51 AM 235 Views
Re: Perhaps just as awesomely: - 01/12/2010 02:21:35 AM 648 Views

Reply to Message