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Re: Frank Herbert, Dune HyogaRott Send a noteboard - 16/04/2010 06:09:49 PM
Interesting but flawed reasoning. I have read all of the Dune books, including the ones that were written/completed by his son. Apparently I ahve also read the ones you have much more ofter. Arakis is one of the major characters of the first book (in later books you discover that the planet was not the character instead it is the worms), but ecology and enrinmental activism is not one of the major themes. It is at best a side effect. The major themes of Dune are all religious, moral, and mercantile.

Additionally, there is no commentary about homosexuallity in the novel. BH is simply, intentionally, displayed as possessing the most offensive and disgusting traits imaginable. You would be just as accurate to attempt to fabricate some sort of parrallel between obese people and sexual deviancy in the novel.

You are making the error that entirely too many reviewers have and will do. Attempting to find themes in prose that do not exist because the author did not write them. Too many reviewer tripple-think into wonderful themes and messages by grabbing various images and actions and weaving them into a coherant "message" that simply does not exist, because the author was not writing them.

There is no emviromental activism as we know it today in the novels, there is only an effort to convert a natural desert into airiable land. There is no statement on homosexuallity, there is simply an incredibly evil sadistic individual who partakes in every manner of diviant behavior imaginable, becasue he can.

If you want to investigate the thems, investigate the ones the authro wrote about: Slavery, Religion, Orthodoxy (morallity, i.e "The Greater Good";), Polotics (money=power, rule by fear vs loyalty). There is plenty to discuss, without creating new themes form whole cloth to further ones oown adgendas and biases. Alas, entirely too many reviewers and critics desire this, instead of investigating and discussing wghat teh auther actually intends.

Though intelectually flawed, your piece is well written and supported by the passages you selected, kudos.
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Frank Herbert, Dune Chronicles (series reviews within) - 16/04/2010 04:11:40 AM 1931 Views
Re: Frank Herbert, Dune - 16/04/2010 06:09:49 PM 1047 Views
Re: Frank Herbert, Dune - 17/04/2010 12:08:06 AM 1237 Views
Re: Frank Herbert, Dune - 17/04/2010 02:33:38 PM 1164 Views
I was using a fairly precise term when I said "ecological" - 18/04/2010 12:13:14 AM 1166 Views
Re: I was using a fairly precise term when I said "ecological" - 18/04/2010 03:34:33 AM 1214 Views
Please read linked interview...as I call bullshit. Also, why are your walls white? - 18/04/2010 05:18:07 AM 1022 Views
Re: Please read linked interview...as I call bullshit. Also, why are your walls white? - 19/04/2010 06:15:26 PM 1054 Views
That was most of my issue. - 21/04/2010 12:12:56 AM 916 Views
Re: That was most of my issue. - 21/04/2010 06:33:14 PM 892 Views
Re: That was most of my issue. - 29/04/2010 11:38:26 PM 884 Views
Just because something plays a dominate role doesn't make it a theme - 21/04/2010 02:09:42 PM 1016 Views
A theme is merely a dominant strain in a story; there can be more than one theme present - 21/04/2010 11:21:38 PM 947 Views
Re: A theme is merely a dominant strain in a story; there can be more than one theme present - 22/04/2010 04:58:01 AM 928 Views
Good points - 22/04/2010 09:19:45 PM 964 Views
Re: Good points - 22/04/2010 10:55:21 PM 913 Views
when you call it human ecology I come much closer to agreeing - 22/04/2010 02:16:58 PM 945 Views
Not really sure how Larry's definition is archaic. - 19/04/2010 07:52:27 PM 1047 Views
Re: Not really sure how Larry's definition is archaic. - 20/04/2010 07:04:40 PM 900 Views
You're not using "archaic" correctly - 20/04/2010 10:07:31 PM 909 Views
Your patronizing manner aside, that's not "archaic" at all. - 21/04/2010 01:46:50 AM 795 Views
doesn't that regulate the point down to interesting trivia? - 21/04/2010 02:36:38 PM 950 Views
Re: Your patronizing manner aside, that's not "archaic" at all. - 21/04/2010 06:23:24 PM 1023 Views
Funny the things people focus on - 21/04/2010 11:24:59 PM 919 Views
Re: Funny the things people focus on - 23/04/2010 05:28:54 PM 923 Views
People who see this as an ecological book are missing the point of the book - 16/04/2010 06:28:40 PM 1399 Views
Books can have more than one theme. Great books almost always do. *NM* - 16/04/2010 07:15:11 PM 457 Views
I agree with that I just never really the ecological theme to Dune - 16/04/2010 10:12:26 PM 1109 Views
Ecology goes more than one way - 17/04/2010 12:12:45 AM 1062 Views
There are several points to the book/series - 17/04/2010 12:11:38 AM 1127 Views
Everyone get something different from a book - 19/04/2010 07:01:51 PM 1317 Views
I believe those themes become more pronounced later in the series - 20/04/2010 10:09:36 PM 1067 Views
I remember having hated every single character of this book. Some random thoughts - 17/04/2010 05:08:25 PM 1259 Views
I hope you got to Darwi Odrade - 21/04/2010 03:44:27 PM 944 Views
Re: Frank Herbert, Dune - 17/04/2010 08:05:16 PM 1510 Views
I guess we'll have a few disagreements here, Dom - 17/04/2010 10:22:27 PM 1312 Views
Re: I guess we'll have a few disagreements here, Dom - 18/04/2010 04:38:10 AM 1264 Views
Re: I guess we'll have a few disagreements here, Dom - 19/04/2010 04:04:43 AM 1195 Views
Re: I guess we'll have a few disagreements here, Dom - 22/04/2010 04:31:26 AM 945 Views
I thought all of Dune had begun as a serial in a SF magazine. *NM* - 22/04/2010 01:58:22 PM 400 Views
And Dune Messiah as well was serialized at first, in Galaxy *NM* - 22/04/2010 09:31:54 PM 405 Views
Dune Messiah (2001 initial read; 2010 re-read) - 19/04/2010 08:42:18 AM 1162 Views
Re: Dune Messiah (2001 initial read; 2010 re-read) - 21/04/2010 03:33:46 PM 896 Views
I didn't see that in Alia - 21/04/2010 11:27:22 PM 845 Views
One of my favorite series! - 21/04/2010 03:30:57 PM 847 Views
I didn't "miss it" as much as I chose to deemphasize it - 21/04/2010 11:29:50 PM 763 Views
Re: I didn't "miss it" as much as I chose to deemphasize it - 22/04/2010 04:02:26 PM 886 Views
His style doesn't appeal to me as much, unfortunately - 22/04/2010 09:17:21 PM 769 Views
You might want to track down his short stories one day... - 23/04/2010 02:06:09 PM 997 Views
Children of Dune (2001 initial read; 2010 re-read) - 22/04/2010 06:47:04 AM 965 Views
See...I think I made a mistake in my reading of Dune - 22/04/2010 07:26:28 AM 944 Views
Depends - 22/04/2010 08:01:39 AM 852 Views
Re: Depends - 22/04/2010 11:12:15 PM 1114 Views
read something else - 23/04/2010 07:49:34 PM 839 Views
LA Times article on Dune (4/18/2010) - 23/04/2010 10:59:00 AM 796 Views
God Emperor of Dune (2001 initial read; 2010 re-read) - 25/04/2010 02:03:37 AM 1065 Views
Heretics of Dune (2001 initial read; 2010 re-read) - 28/04/2010 06:02:54 AM 811 Views
Re: Heretics of Dune (2001 initial read; 2010 re-read) - 29/04/2010 03:26:28 PM 885 Views
I read the wiki synopses of those two books - 29/04/2010 09:44:07 PM 846 Views
Re: I read the wiki synopses of those two books - 10/05/2010 04:10:49 AM 1188 Views
Chapterhouse: Dune (2001 initial read; 2010 re-read) - 30/04/2010 02:31:10 PM 997 Views
Re: Chapterhouse: Dune (2001 initial read; 2010 re-read) - 10/05/2010 01:24:33 AM 1035 Views

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