Re: There has to be something more, though. - Edit 1
Before modification by Werthead at 19/12/2011 09:06:58 PM
In general, though, the level of misogyny in Martin, (particularly) Bakker, etc is plain ridiculous. To claim that's a legitimate reflection of the real world is absurd. Yes, there is prostitution, rape, gender/sex discrimination, etc to be encountered in everyday life even in the most wealthy of communities - but even the worst specific examples to be found in history don't come close the everday life portrayals those authors describe in their stories.
I'd agree with Bakker. The rape/misogyny in his work is ridiculous, and that's part of the intended effect (though that doesn't excuse it).
I think the complaints about the misogyny in Martin's books are somewhat shakier, however. First off, he has a significant number of major female characters with agency, several of whom do not use their sexuality to get what they want (Arya, most notably) whilst others do (Cersei, Daenerys) and others reject that notion (Brienne). Secondly, ASoIaF is much more closely based on - or at least inspired by - real historical events (the Red Wedding is a re-enactment of the Black Dinner, when King James II of Scotland personally killed Earl Douglas at a dinner held under a flag of safe conduct, and Douglas was stabbed through the throat and thrown out of a window like Robb, though his head was not removed that we know of) and the level of 'misogyny' reflects that. On a related note, Mary Gentle, in her research for ASH: A SECRET HISTORY, discovered evidence that child prostitution amongst camp followers during medieval warfare was commonplace, and depicts her heroine starting life in such a role, something that goes way beyond anything seen in Martin (or Bakker, for that matter).
In fact, ASoIaF rather lowballs the levels of violence and rape that take place during major conflicts. The accounts of the devastation of Silesia and much of Eastern Germany during the Red Army's march on Berlin in 1945 are truly disturbing, and the notion that medieval warfare did not feature such things when there was far less reporting going on seems unrealistic.