You dismiss the entire video game medium because many games lack value.
lord-of-shadow Send a noteboard - 13/12/2011 03:59:11 PM
Which is similar to dismissing the entire medium of books because you see no value in the majority of books.
And obviously that would be ludicrous. Even though you (rightfully) see little redeeming value in the vast majority of books published, you just as obviously see immense value in reading challenging pieces or pieces that otherwise broaden your understanding, or display mastery of the art of writing.
Video games are a medium capable of immense expression of ideas, learning, story, etc. And beyond authorial expression, there is room for interactivity and user-directed exploration of the content - something you simply don't see as an inherent part of any other medium. Sadly, the majority of games do not even attempt to push these boundaries, due to business concerns (societal preconceptions limit audiences, experimentation on multi-million dollar projects is a risk companies simply aren't willing to take, etc.) and ridiculous societal expectations (that games must be fun above all else). In many ways, this mirrors the development of the film medium; for years it failed to really reach beyond base entertainment, but today it has obviously matured into a medium that is used in a broad variety of ways, including many that explore the human condition in much the same way that good literature does.
Your out-right dismissal of the entire medium is simply incorrect. It's understandable, if you haven't been exposed to much beyond the blockbuster games and trash like Call of Duty or your typical first-person-shooter - but it's still erroneous.
On a related note, I also think you are too ready to dismiss immersive gameplay experiences as unhealthy - playing a game for three hours may not be as edifying as reading the sort of books you value, but it is not inherently "damaging" or unhealthy. In much the same way that reading a fantasy novel or watching a movie for the same length of time won't hurt you. Nor is it a "conscious decision to neglect real life" - downtime is part of life, not a neglection of it. And where is the "fake decisions in a game where virtual characters will suffer either way" comment coming from? You can't have been exposed to many games if you think that that is representative of the entire medium. And in the context of the game, decisions you make are real enough - they will have a real impact on the game, assuming you're playing one that is well designed.
Taken to excess, gaming is bad for you in a myriad of ways - but that can be said for anything. Including reading. Or attending college. Or exercising. It's not even a comment worth making.
And obviously that would be ludicrous. Even though you (rightfully) see little redeeming value in the vast majority of books published, you just as obviously see immense value in reading challenging pieces or pieces that otherwise broaden your understanding, or display mastery of the art of writing.
Video games are a medium capable of immense expression of ideas, learning, story, etc. And beyond authorial expression, there is room for interactivity and user-directed exploration of the content - something you simply don't see as an inherent part of any other medium. Sadly, the majority of games do not even attempt to push these boundaries, due to business concerns (societal preconceptions limit audiences, experimentation on multi-million dollar projects is a risk companies simply aren't willing to take, etc.) and ridiculous societal expectations (that games must be fun above all else). In many ways, this mirrors the development of the film medium; for years it failed to really reach beyond base entertainment, but today it has obviously matured into a medium that is used in a broad variety of ways, including many that explore the human condition in much the same way that good literature does.
Your out-right dismissal of the entire medium is simply incorrect. It's understandable, if you haven't been exposed to much beyond the blockbuster games and trash like Call of Duty or your typical first-person-shooter - but it's still erroneous.
On a related note, I also think you are too ready to dismiss immersive gameplay experiences as unhealthy - playing a game for three hours may not be as edifying as reading the sort of books you value, but it is not inherently "damaging" or unhealthy. In much the same way that reading a fantasy novel or watching a movie for the same length of time won't hurt you. Nor is it a "conscious decision to neglect real life" - downtime is part of life, not a neglection of it. And where is the "fake decisions in a game where virtual characters will suffer either way" comment coming from? You can't have been exposed to many games if you think that that is representative of the entire medium. And in the context of the game, decisions you make are real enough - they will have a real impact on the game, assuming you're playing one that is well designed.
Taken to excess, gaming is bad for you in a myriad of ways - but that can be said for anything. Including reading. Or attending college. Or exercising. It's not even a comment worth making.
This message last edited by lord-of-shadow on 13/12/2011 at 04:01:50 PM
Aren't the Tolkien comparisons getting a little...old?
09/12/2011 09:51:39 PM
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The comparison bothers me, but not because Tolkien isn't relevant.
09/12/2011 10:05:22 PM
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Only when shit works are being compared to him
09/12/2011 10:22:26 PM
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Larry,
10/12/2011 01:13:18 AM
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Snide dismissal that will be passed off as for his own entertainment.
10/12/2011 04:55:43 AM
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Well-deserved condescension.
11/12/2011 03:54:27 AM
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You're sure about that?
11/12/2011 04:20:26 AM
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Re: You're sure about that?
11/12/2011 05:25:08 AM
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Re: You're sure about that?
11/12/2011 06:03:02 AM
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i think you shouldn't judge a whole world's school programs on your school
11/12/2011 06:42:30 AM
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If you're arguing that children should be able to read genre fiction, fine.
11/12/2011 08:52:27 PM
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Well, I suppose it depends on the type of genre being read
11/12/2011 09:36:16 PM
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How often do you hear the challenging writers mentioned at this site?
12/12/2011 02:03:05 PM
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Only when you, me, and a couple others write reviews
12/12/2011 04:21:14 PM
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Oh, it was the same as it always is
12/12/2011 05:23:56 PM
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Much of the actual "Classics", that is, Greek and Latin originals, kids would eat up.
12/12/2011 03:13:03 AM
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You're upfront and honest about it; he isn't. The difference matters to me. *NM*
11/12/2011 05:18:42 AM
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this is a bit off topic, but out of curiousity...
11/12/2011 06:28:35 AM
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I've discussed this dozens of times at this site. Perhaps you've missed all of the posts.
11/12/2011 08:57:44 PM
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mk I'll go look. I probably did miss it (or at least don't remember it!)
11/12/2011 09:08:02 PM
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I have a successful career that was inspired by the video games I played as a child. *NM*
11/12/2011 05:52:21 PM
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Now let's get all the people who just pissed their lives away with video games and see the %.
11/12/2011 08:58:42 PM
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The majority of players neither waste their lives nor make a career out of it.
11/12/2011 11:29:29 PM
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Yeah, sorry, I don't think you could say that with a straight face in real life. *NM*
12/12/2011 04:13:52 AM
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Then you have a closed mind on the subject. Ironic, considering your stance on edification. *NM*
12/12/2011 05:47:50 AM
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No, just with respect to you. *NM*
12/12/2011 02:00:15 PM
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Tom, you pulled the "Say that to my face!" line. You lost the right to talk about respect. *NM*
12/12/2011 03:20:15 PM
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Once again, I really don't care what you think. *NM*
12/12/2011 03:37:40 PM
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Did I imply that you did? My apologies. I'd hate to insinuate that you'd stoop that low. *NM*
12/12/2011 04:13:25 PM
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As well read as you seem to be, you think you'd be smart enough...
11/12/2011 06:20:06 PM
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I thought I have made it clear that I don't care if people don't like me here.
11/12/2011 08:44:58 PM
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Re: I thought I have made it clear that I don't care if people don't like me here.
12/12/2011 04:04:37 PM
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That statement has just confused me.
12/12/2011 04:06:53 PM
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Re: That statement has just confused me.
12/12/2011 04:14:27 PM
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I never learned Hittite. I had a book on pre-order for a long time but never ended up getting it.
12/12/2011 05:41:03 PM
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What you have made clear, I think, is the fact that you deal in generalizations and stereotypes.
12/12/2011 10:12:12 PM
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There's an unintentional irony in what you say, alas
13/12/2011 12:44:26 AM
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Tom, Dick, or Larry...you may use your true first name, but you're still an anonymous entity to most
13/12/2011 04:49:35 AM
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With such comeback skills, you must have ruled the playgrounds as a kid, no?
13/12/2011 05:21:42 AM
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There are no special snowflakes, are there?
11/12/2011 09:39:21 PM
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There are many way of widening one's horizons and broadening one's mind.
11/12/2011 10:08:24 PM
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What I don't like-
12/12/2011 04:28:55 AM
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Why don't you name something, then?
12/12/2011 04:40:29 AM
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Sure.
13/12/2011 07:30:56 AM
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Mentioning Ender's Game pretty much shot your argument in the foot.
13/12/2011 02:02:59 PM
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You dismiss the entire video game medium because many games lack value.
13/12/2011 03:59:11 PM
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You're like the McDonald's paid advocate trying to say Big Macs are actually healthy.
13/12/2011 05:46:37 PM
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I'll leave it up to others to define as they wish against their self-conceptions of me
10/12/2011 10:52:54 AM
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that's alright. I really have no desire to stroke your twit-ego. *NM*
10/12/2011 04:36:56 PM
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Considering the firestorm I appear to have touched off, that may be best.
12/12/2011 12:57:49 PM
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I know, John
12/12/2011 04:27:04 PM
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Re: I know, John
12/12/2011 05:06:26 PM
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As I've said in the past, I'd be scared if anyone agreed with me anywhere approaching 100%
12/12/2011 06:33:52 PM
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Re: As I've said in the past, I'd be scared if anyone agreed with me anywhere approaching 100%
12/12/2011 07:13:37 PM
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Blurbs are not generally very original in their comparisons - would kind of defeat their purpose.
09/12/2011 10:42:17 PM
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Maybe if so much of the genre weren't crap derivative works it wouldn't be so common. *NM*
11/12/2011 03:44:24 AM
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To be fair, a lot of it isn't.
11/12/2011 04:06:07 AM
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I suspect that if it really isn't derivative it's not being compared to Tolkien in the first place.
11/12/2011 04:18:57 AM
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That's true.
11/12/2011 11:08:01 AM
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But see, that's where things start to get referred back to Tolkien.
12/12/2011 04:30:12 AM
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The Tolkien fanaticism gets old. And yes, for me it is unreadable.
11/12/2011 11:37:53 PM
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No, because the movies are very contemporary and relevant, thus he will remain so for quite a while.
12/12/2011 03:14:53 AM
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Disagree all you want, but LotR is still the touchstone when it comes to works of fantasy.
12/12/2011 03:48:20 AM
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