Much of the actual "Classics", that is, Greek and Latin originals, kids would eat up.
Dan Send a noteboard - 12/12/2011 03:13:03 AM
I'm thinking mostly of the Illiad, the Odyssey, and most of the Greek tragedies. But even Plato, Lysias, and Suetonius are interesting, and for all the right reasons. They're exciting, brutal, and scandalous.
Part of the problem I've found first hand is the translation. It's too florid, too posh and British, to really hit people. I think Attic Greek could lend itself very well to an Americanized translation with American colloquialism, while losing very little. Also, verse can be difficult, and that is one major hurdle which they really could teach. I'd be ok with a prose rendition of the Illiad, but fuck it, who knows.
The other problem, which I think is the more significant one, is that schools and parents alike would refuse to actually teach material this interesting. That's the crux of the problem. There's no shortage of literature that is exciting and well-written, but the way it is taught, due to layers and layers of puritanism and PC Bullshit, strip it of being interesting. The result is Huckleberry Finn without "nigger". There's no fucking way anyone could seriously teach The Bacchae, for instance.
Considering how little kids read at all, expecting them to read classics is like expecting them to walk on water or turn water into wine. For most of them, just reading the Harry Potter series should be cause for celebration by their parents and teachers, because even in that bit of light reading they will come across words and ideas they otherwise wouldn't. Most works in the Fantasy genre aren't classics and won't become them, but that doesn't mean they have nothing to teach children. From vocabulary, to grammar, to reading comprehension, all of these things can be improved by reading any sort of book, and the point of genre fiction is to make reading books as easy and enjoyable as possible. It's a way to start reading, to gain a taste for it, and then to move on to other works and genres. Your condescension is the reason why kids beyond elementary school age aren't encouraged to read such books, and it does a lot more harm than good.
As for Xbox, you're right, it certainly doesn't help anyone mature. But there have been numerous times when names and ideas used in video games prompted me to research them online, and find things ranging from mythology, to psychology, to physics. Perhaps these are things I would have discovered anyway at some point in life, or perhaps not. All I know is that video games are responsible for some of the knowledge I possess, and that means they have some value beyond "mere" entertainment.
Part of the problem I've found first hand is the translation. It's too florid, too posh and British, to really hit people. I think Attic Greek could lend itself very well to an Americanized translation with American colloquialism, while losing very little. Also, verse can be difficult, and that is one major hurdle which they really could teach. I'd be ok with a prose rendition of the Illiad, but fuck it, who knows.
The other problem, which I think is the more significant one, is that schools and parents alike would refuse to actually teach material this interesting. That's the crux of the problem. There's no shortage of literature that is exciting and well-written, but the way it is taught, due to layers and layers of puritanism and PC Bullshit, strip it of being interesting. The result is Huckleberry Finn without "nigger". There's no fucking way anyone could seriously teach The Bacchae, for instance.
There's nothing wrong with reading genre books, or eating McDonald's, or wasting your life away playing Xbox. The point is that all the reasons that kids are encouraged to read - learning, expanding their horizons, improving their vocabulary - are missing in this literature, just like McDonald's has virtually none of the nutrients that people need to be healthy and Xbox has no redeeming value in peoples' maturing and development.
Considering how little kids read at all, expecting them to read classics is like expecting them to walk on water or turn water into wine. For most of them, just reading the Harry Potter series should be cause for celebration by their parents and teachers, because even in that bit of light reading they will come across words and ideas they otherwise wouldn't. Most works in the Fantasy genre aren't classics and won't become them, but that doesn't mean they have nothing to teach children. From vocabulary, to grammar, to reading comprehension, all of these things can be improved by reading any sort of book, and the point of genre fiction is to make reading books as easy and enjoyable as possible. It's a way to start reading, to gain a taste for it, and then to move on to other works and genres. Your condescension is the reason why kids beyond elementary school age aren't encouraged to read such books, and it does a lot more harm than good.
As for Xbox, you're right, it certainly doesn't help anyone mature. But there have been numerous times when names and ideas used in video games prompted me to research them online, and find things ranging from mythology, to psychology, to physics. Perhaps these are things I would have discovered anyway at some point in life, or perhaps not. All I know is that video games are responsible for some of the knowledge I possess, and that means they have some value beyond "mere" entertainment.
Aren't the Tolkien comparisons getting a little...old?
09/12/2011 09:51:39 PM
- 2919 Views
The comparison bothers me, but not because Tolkien isn't relevant.
09/12/2011 10:05:22 PM
- 1773 Views
Only when shit works are being compared to him
09/12/2011 10:22:26 PM
- 1668 Views
Larry,
10/12/2011 01:13:18 AM
- 1684 Views
Snide dismissal that will be passed off as for his own entertainment.
10/12/2011 04:55:43 AM
- 1600 Views
Well-deserved condescension.
11/12/2011 03:54:27 AM
- 1729 Views
You're sure about that?
11/12/2011 04:20:26 AM
- 1950 Views
Re: You're sure about that?
11/12/2011 05:25:08 AM
- 1671 Views
Re: You're sure about that?
11/12/2011 06:03:02 AM
- 1544 Views
i think you shouldn't judge a whole world's school programs on your school
11/12/2011 06:42:30 AM
- 1577 Views

If you're arguing that children should be able to read genre fiction, fine.
11/12/2011 08:52:27 PM
- 1472 Views
Well, I suppose it depends on the type of genre being read
11/12/2011 09:36:16 PM
- 1707 Views
How often do you hear the challenging writers mentioned at this site?
12/12/2011 02:03:05 PM
- 1436 Views
Only when you, me, and a couple others write reviews
12/12/2011 04:21:14 PM
- 1850 Views
Oh, it was the same as it always is
12/12/2011 05:23:56 PM
- 1531 Views
Much of the actual "Classics", that is, Greek and Latin originals, kids would eat up.
12/12/2011 03:13:03 AM
- 1446 Views
You're upfront and honest about it; he isn't. The difference matters to me. *NM*
11/12/2011 05:18:42 AM
- 834 Views
this is a bit off topic, but out of curiousity...
11/12/2011 06:28:35 AM
- 1659 Views
I've discussed this dozens of times at this site. Perhaps you've missed all of the posts.
11/12/2011 08:57:44 PM
- 1605 Views
mk I'll go look. I probably did miss it (or at least don't remember it!)
11/12/2011 09:08:02 PM
- 1564 Views
I have a successful career that was inspired by the video games I played as a child. *NM*
11/12/2011 05:52:21 PM
- 863 Views
Now let's get all the people who just pissed their lives away with video games and see the %.
11/12/2011 08:58:42 PM
- 1715 Views
The majority of players neither waste their lives nor make a career out of it.
11/12/2011 11:29:29 PM
- 1601 Views
Yeah, sorry, I don't think you could say that with a straight face in real life. *NM*
12/12/2011 04:13:52 AM
- 801 Views
Then you have a closed mind on the subject. Ironic, considering your stance on edification. *NM*
12/12/2011 05:47:50 AM
- 744 Views
No, just with respect to you. *NM*
12/12/2011 02:00:15 PM
- 791 Views
Tom, you pulled the "Say that to my face!" line. You lost the right to talk about respect. *NM*
12/12/2011 03:20:15 PM
- 837 Views
Once again, I really don't care what you think. *NM*
12/12/2011 03:37:40 PM
- 790 Views
Did I imply that you did? My apologies. I'd hate to insinuate that you'd stoop that low. *NM*
12/12/2011 04:13:25 PM
- 756 Views
As well read as you seem to be, you think you'd be smart enough...
11/12/2011 06:20:06 PM
- 1544 Views
I thought I have made it clear that I don't care if people don't like me here.
11/12/2011 08:44:58 PM
- 1471 Views
Re: I thought I have made it clear that I don't care if people don't like me here.
12/12/2011 04:04:37 PM
- 1529 Views
That statement has just confused me.
12/12/2011 04:06:53 PM
- 1477 Views
Re: That statement has just confused me.
12/12/2011 04:14:27 PM
- 1487 Views
I never learned Hittite. I had a book on pre-order for a long time but never ended up getting it.
12/12/2011 05:41:03 PM
- 1438 Views
What you have made clear, I think, is the fact that you deal in generalizations and stereotypes.
12/12/2011 10:12:12 PM
- 1590 Views
There's an unintentional irony in what you say, alas
13/12/2011 12:44:26 AM
- 1519 Views
Tom, Dick, or Larry...you may use your true first name, but you're still an anonymous entity to most
13/12/2011 04:49:35 AM
- 1714 Views
With such comeback skills, you must have ruled the playgrounds as a kid, no?
13/12/2011 05:21:42 AM
- 1725 Views
There are no special snowflakes, are there?
11/12/2011 09:39:21 PM
- 1470 Views

There are many way of widening one's horizons and broadening one's mind.
11/12/2011 10:08:24 PM
- 1227 Views
What I don't like-
12/12/2011 04:28:55 AM
- 1578 Views
Why don't you name something, then?
12/12/2011 04:40:29 AM
- 1537 Views
Sure.
13/12/2011 07:30:56 AM
- 1366 Views
Mentioning Ender's Game pretty much shot your argument in the foot.
13/12/2011 02:02:59 PM
- 1473 Views
You dismiss the entire video game medium because many games lack value.
13/12/2011 03:59:11 PM
- 1618 Views
You're like the McDonald's paid advocate trying to say Big Macs are actually healthy.
13/12/2011 05:46:37 PM
- 1426 Views
I'll leave it up to others to define as they wish against their self-conceptions of me
10/12/2011 10:52:54 AM
- 1584 Views

that's alright. I really have no desire to stroke your twit-ego. *NM*
10/12/2011 04:36:56 PM
- 634 Views
Considering the firestorm I appear to have touched off, that may be best.
12/12/2011 12:57:49 PM
- 1563 Views
I know, John
12/12/2011 04:27:04 PM
- 1463 Views
Re: I know, John
12/12/2011 05:06:26 PM
- 1525 Views
As I've said in the past, I'd be scared if anyone agreed with me anywhere approaching 100%
12/12/2011 06:33:52 PM
- 1452 Views

Re: As I've said in the past, I'd be scared if anyone agreed with me anywhere approaching 100%
12/12/2011 07:13:37 PM
- 1526 Views

Blurbs are not generally very original in their comparisons - would kind of defeat their purpose.
09/12/2011 10:42:17 PM
- 1554 Views
Maybe if so much of the genre weren't crap derivative works it wouldn't be so common. *NM*
11/12/2011 03:44:24 AM
- 768 Views
To be fair, a lot of it isn't.
11/12/2011 04:06:07 AM
- 1502 Views
I suspect that if it really isn't derivative it's not being compared to Tolkien in the first place.
11/12/2011 04:18:57 AM
- 1447 Views
That's true.
11/12/2011 11:08:01 AM
- 1435 Views
But see, that's where things start to get referred back to Tolkien.
12/12/2011 04:30:12 AM
- 1578 Views
The Tolkien fanaticism gets old. And yes, for me it is unreadable.
11/12/2011 11:37:53 PM
- 1497 Views
No, because the movies are very contemporary and relevant, thus he will remain so for quite a while.
12/12/2011 03:14:53 AM
- 1555 Views
Disagree all you want, but LotR is still the touchstone when it comes to works of fantasy.
12/12/2011 03:48:20 AM
- 1473 Views