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None of them. Werthead Send a noteboard - 22/07/2011 06:25:19 PM
The 'old gods' are clearly not real in the sense that they were considered to be a collection of nature deities, as ADWD indicates all they are is the collective memories of greenseers 'plugged into' weirwoods (like an arboreal version of THE MATRIX) over the millennia which endure after the greenseers' deaths. So the old gods have a real and comprehensible underpinning to them, but not a divine one.

R'hllor and the Great Other appear to be divine personalities assigned to sources of power that are real and can be tapped by humans under certain circumstances. I don't think either exists as a literal sentient and divine being. The Drowned God and the Seven don't appear to even have that kind of power going for them, and are purely mythical (and that's reinforced when we're told the Rhoynar taught the Andals how to smelt iron, not the Smith as the septons claim).
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A Dance with Dragons discussion thread - 11/07/2011 10:48:23 PM 6342 Views
Okay, first impressions. Basically spoiler-free, I suppose. - 11/07/2011 11:40:31 PM 1882 Views
I have it! *NM* - 12/07/2011 05:42:27 AM 1007 Views
A general question to get the discussion started: will two more books be enough? - 12/07/2011 02:22:52 PM 2096 Views
A very good question *major spoilers, then* - 12/07/2011 02:55:05 PM 2070 Views
Oh, come on. If anyone can do it, Martin can. - 15/07/2011 03:48:27 AM 1765 Views
It'll be tight. - 12/07/2011 04:32:39 PM 2063 Views
No but I think 3 will be possible - 26/07/2011 03:15:02 AM 1890 Views
what is Purple Wedding? *NM* - 27/07/2011 08:37:04 AM 891 Views
Joffrey and Margaery wedding - 27/07/2011 04:26:04 PM 1913 Views
Hero of the book? - 12/07/2011 10:12:02 PM 2211 Views
Lord Manderly gets my vote. - 12/07/2011 10:41:19 PM 2021 Views
Re: Hero of the book? - 12/07/2011 10:43:20 PM 1875 Views
Re: Hero of the book? - 12/07/2011 11:50:29 PM 1876 Views
Ohh, so that was what that was about. - 17/07/2011 07:08:19 PM 1906 Views
That's what I thought too. - 25/07/2011 01:48:50 AM 1914 Views
Victorian Greyjoy = Hero of the book *NM* - 21/07/2011 06:20:25 AM 1062 Views
Asshole of the book? - 12/07/2011 10:46:10 PM 2080 Views
Agreed. - 12/07/2011 11:18:07 PM 2021 Views
Yeah, little doubt there. - 17/07/2011 07:09:53 PM 1861 Views
Seriously... - 18/07/2011 03:07:47 AM 1840 Views
Daenerys Targaryen & lifetime achievement award to Lord Rickard Stark - 17/08/2011 12:38:40 AM 1778 Views
Idiot of the book. - 12/07/2011 11:21:51 PM 2116 Views
lol yep, definitely *NM* - 13/07/2011 08:12:42 AM 999 Views
Re: Idiot of the book. - 17/07/2011 12:42:20 AM 1959 Views
Wait... no she doesn't! - 17/07/2011 01:29:52 AM 1887 Views
She thinks both - 18/07/2011 12:22:59 AM 1818 Views
So... - 17/07/2011 07:18:24 PM 1836 Views
No, it's him. - 18/07/2011 12:25:33 AM 1825 Views
Is there any hot sex scenes? I won't be able to read it for a while *NM* - 13/07/2011 02:35:49 PM 1085 Views
One or two, but not all that long ones *NM* - 13/07/2011 02:57:12 PM 1032 Views
Great Ending - 14/07/2011 01:21:53 AM 2121 Views
Really? - 14/07/2011 09:36:01 AM 2041 Views
Re: Really? - 14/07/2011 09:38:34 AM 1695 Views
Re: Great Ending - 18/07/2011 02:05:00 AM 1846 Views
YES! - 14/07/2011 02:38:48 AM 1682 Views
Sorry for the n00b reply, sentiments still apply - 16/07/2011 07:27:43 PM 1844 Views
Re: Sorry for the n00b reply, sentiments still apply - 17/07/2011 12:45:52 AM 1801 Views
I don't know what to think... (spoiler) - 14/07/2011 08:59:39 AM 2039 Views
Probably not. - 14/07/2011 09:19:03 AM 2025 Views
Re: Probably not. - 14/07/2011 03:57:55 PM 1862 Views
I think the two are mixed up. - 14/07/2011 11:23:06 PM 1945 Views
Re: I think the two are mixed up. - 18/07/2011 02:10:29 AM 1779 Views
What made least sense for me as far as that is concerned... - 14/07/2011 11:51:20 AM 1907 Views
They didn't. - 14/07/2011 11:24:53 PM 1957 Views
I see - 15/07/2011 08:28:09 AM 1870 Views
Didn't Jon just announced - 26/07/2011 02:51:07 AM 1830 Views
Something I totally missed first time through - 14/07/2011 09:40:33 AM 2233 Views
Re: Something I totally missed first time through - 16/07/2011 01:24:23 AM 2150 Views
Yep, that's what he said/thought - 17/07/2011 05:02:32 AM 1967 Views
Re: Something I totally missed first time through - 23/07/2011 04:14:38 PM 1817 Views
Well that brings new meaning - 26/07/2011 02:53:18 AM 1736 Views
I'm still not fully done, but about the Reek chapters... - 14/07/2011 04:05:29 PM 1953 Views
Agreed - 14/07/2011 06:18:15 PM 1972 Views
There's another... - 14/07/2011 07:16:11 PM 1773 Views
There's that... - 17/07/2011 01:12:33 AM 1834 Views
It's worse than that... - 17/07/2011 01:26:50 AM 1856 Views
Torture is wrong, and those chapters kinda proved it. *NM* - 26/07/2011 02:53:55 AM 991 Views
Having finished the book, my thoughts. (Spoilers) - 16/07/2011 08:11:30 AM 1963 Views
Re: Having finished the book, my thoughts. (Spoilers) - 17/07/2011 01:02:10 AM 1890 Views
You put words to my thoughts exactly. - 18/08/2011 09:17:09 PM 1810 Views
It should be re-titled A Jump with Sharks - 17/07/2011 06:00:37 PM 2022 Views
Publishers are more interested in the bottom line. - 18/07/2011 12:31:56 AM 1798 Views
Sadly, I am likely overestimating the intelligence of the readers. - 18/07/2011 03:05:12 AM 2012 Views
I felt bummed by Sanderson's new series. - 18/07/2011 05:25:09 AM 1862 Views
I bought that book but have yet to read it. - 18/07/2011 01:09:15 PM 1817 Views
Re: I bought that book but have yet to read it. - 20/07/2011 06:45:46 AM 1821 Views
You might like this quote from House of Leaves by Mark Z Danielewski. - 11/08/2011 03:42:05 PM 1908 Views
I'm afraid I have to agree with what seems to be the majority opinion... - 17/07/2011 07:35:47 PM 1953 Views
And on a different note entirely: is it me, or did the book need more proofreading? - 17/07/2011 07:39:15 PM 1844 Views
Yeah, I agree. - 18/07/2011 05:59:58 PM 1892 Views
The book really shows it is AFFC part 2 - 26/07/2011 03:00:07 AM 1868 Views
Am I The Only One In Love With Arya's Chapters? *spoilers maybe* - 18/07/2011 02:22:00 AM 1878 Views
I enjoyed them, very solid chapters. - 18/07/2011 12:50:43 PM 1910 Views
Unlike others, I won't start a separate thread to express my thoughts - 19/07/2011 11:21:17 AM 2024 Views
Yeah, I wished there was a way to move them in here! - 19/07/2011 01:42:51 PM 1765 Views
Me too... but going and complaining about them seems so lame, too. - 19/07/2011 07:34:47 PM 1781 Views
I agree with Jens, good balanced review. *NM* - 19/07/2011 07:50:13 PM 974 Views
I think you let him off too easily. - 20/07/2011 04:19:07 AM 1913 Views
Your review is a little too generous (in my opinion) - 20/07/2011 06:57:45 AM 2078 Views
I find myself both depressed and let down... - 20/07/2011 06:37:16 AM 2199 Views
Am I the only one who really likes... - 20/07/2011 06:04:00 PM 1975 Views
yeh, he is nice... *NM* - 20/07/2011 06:20:13 PM 967 Views
Davos is probably my favourite - 20/07/2011 09:51:03 PM 1686 Views
The six bodies fired by the trebuchet - 20/07/2011 10:36:16 PM 1875 Views
Yes, I was confused by that too. - 20/07/2011 10:53:35 PM 1796 Views
Probably pale mare victims. Seige warfare via plague - 20/07/2011 11:23:10 PM 1846 Views
Yes, I considered that as well... - 20/07/2011 11:48:32 PM 1818 Views
Have Quentyn's two mates already been sent off a this point? - 21/07/2011 02:03:15 PM 1868 Views
That could be it. *NM* - 21/07/2011 01:43:16 PM 882 Views
Stannis - 21/07/2011 08:43:40 AM 1821 Views
It's entirely possible Stannis was killed - 21/07/2011 02:09:10 PM 1908 Views
I highly doubt he's dead - 21/07/2011 07:29:59 PM 1858 Views
The bluff makes the most sense: if the Boltons beat Stannis, why does he ask for Theon & Jeyne? - 22/07/2011 12:01:30 AM 1919 Views
Yeah... - 22/07/2011 12:27:53 AM 1815 Views
The Aegon Twist. Something about this doesn't add up. - 21/07/2011 10:43:43 PM 1897 Views
Re: The Aegon Twist. Something about this doesn't add up. - 22/07/2011 05:42:13 PM 1998 Views
Alternatively.. - 22/07/2011 09:13:46 PM 1824 Views
Which gods do you think are "real" in Martin's world? - 22/07/2011 04:32:39 PM 1866 Views
None of them. - 22/07/2011 06:25:19 PM 1781 Views
Is that personal opinion or based on something Martin said? *NM* - 22/07/2011 06:37:57 PM 977 Views
Opinion - 22/07/2011 07:43:16 PM 1823 Views
I think there are some god's, just given different names. Same with the magic. - 22/07/2011 09:24:51 PM 1813 Views
Lose the apostrophe in the subject line. Then: on what basis do you assume this? - 23/07/2011 02:28:49 AM 1841 Views
You might want to stop wasting time correcting others typos. As for the gods... - 23/07/2011 04:53:59 AM 1725 Views
You might want to stop making them. Particularly glaring ones like that. - 23/07/2011 05:01:03 AM 1897 Views
A typo can't be "glaring"... - 23/07/2011 08:08:51 AM 1778 Views
Sure it can. Glaring: conspicuous or obvious. - 23/07/2011 03:52:57 PM 1795 Views
Morality stems from god? - 22/07/2011 10:47:59 PM 1792 Views
Of course it does - 23/07/2011 02:26:50 AM 1771 Views
On second thought, let's address the issue directly. - 23/07/2011 05:14:59 AM 1864 Views
Perhaps... - 24/07/2011 07:03:24 PM 1807 Views
Its simple... - 24/07/2011 07:37:11 PM 1794 Views
I disagree... - 25/07/2011 04:10:04 AM 1879 Views
Bullshit. - 25/07/2011 05:44:41 AM 1749 Views
Re: Bullshit. - 25/07/2011 06:27:09 AM 1658 Views
Some thoughts... - 25/07/2011 04:54:05 AM 1777 Views
It's not an objective morality. - 25/07/2011 05:41:33 AM 1768 Views
Its not that simple... - 25/07/2011 06:21:39 AM 1818 Views
I don't disagree with most of what you said. I just reach a different conclusion. - 25/07/2011 01:57:31 PM 1752 Views
Well... - 25/07/2011 05:02:45 PM 1770 Views
How then do you deal with the Euthyphro dilemma? - 16/08/2011 01:43:18 PM 1636 Views
Re: Which gods do you think are "real" in Martin's world? - 25/07/2011 02:24:07 PM 1699 Views
Whats the best new POV - 26/07/2011 03:14:05 AM 1822 Views
Barristan - 26/07/2011 12:23:20 PM 1778 Views
Didn't Aeron "Damphair" Greyjoy also only have 2 POVs - 26/07/2011 03:56:57 PM 1861 Views
Agreed. *NM* - 26/07/2011 11:33:11 PM 1011 Views
thirded. - 27/07/2011 04:16:26 PM 1656 Views
Absolutely *NM* - 29/07/2011 02:31:54 AM 1055 Views
Things you missed till they were pointed out via others or via a reread - 26/07/2011 03:23:53 AM 1964 Views
A bit. - 26/07/2011 12:32:32 PM 1928 Views
- 26/07/2011 03:46:54 PM 1874 Views
Re: - 27/07/2011 12:43:43 AM 1807 Views
Martin doesn't have to do anything - 27/07/2011 01:33:36 AM 1896 Views
Re: Martin doesn't have to do anything - 27/07/2011 04:38:19 AM 1767 Views
Re: Martin doesn't have to do anything - 27/07/2011 08:58:55 AM 1696 Views
Re: - 27/07/2011 04:27:18 AM 1881 Views
I like your theory. - 27/07/2011 04:35:22 PM 1895 Views
Interesting... hadn't noticed some of those either. - 26/07/2011 11:32:18 PM 1893 Views
Re: Interesting... hadn't noticed some of those either. - 27/07/2011 02:00:42 AM 1784 Views
Eh? - 29/07/2011 04:44:17 PM 1892 Views
This is complicated. - 31/07/2011 10:43:15 PM 2098 Views
Wait...a woman crowned for beauty was the victorious mystery knight? - 01/08/2011 03:00:49 AM 1802 Views
It is believed the Knight of the Laughing Tree is one of two people - 01/08/2011 04:47:21 AM 1842 Views
Yup. - 02/08/2011 12:03:26 AM 1733 Views
Also... - 02/08/2011 07:17:43 AM 1832 Views
And yet, my huge brain figures it out - 04/08/2011 04:20:06 PM 1809 Views
I've read this scene yesterday and I missed this... - 02/08/2011 07:55:35 AM 1828 Views
Allow me - 05/08/2011 02:14:15 PM 1679 Views
thanks *NM* - 07/08/2011 07:28:21 AM 958 Views
I thought this was pretty clear - 07/08/2011 05:18:54 PM 1708 Views
Hizdahr a Harpy? Innocent or Not? - 26/07/2011 03:36:56 AM 2108 Views
Interesting idea. - 26/07/2011 12:25:11 PM 1905 Views
Re: Interesting idea. - 27/07/2011 04:25:02 PM 1832 Views
What is happening with the Maesters subplot? Any new leads? - 26/07/2011 04:13:27 PM 1818 Views
Re: What is happening with the Maesters subplot? Any new leads? - 27/07/2011 12:49:52 AM 2034 Views
Re: What is happening with the Maesters subplot? Any new leads? - 27/07/2011 03:49:18 AM 1934 Views
Re: A Dance with Dragons discussion thread - 29/07/2011 01:42:57 AM 1954 Views
Okay. I suck. - 29/07/2011 01:50:56 AM 1749 Views
Let me rephrase that... - 29/07/2011 01:54:07 AM 1726 Views
Jon Snow is definitely Azor Ahai. - 29/07/2011 07:31:17 PM 2336 Views
Hmm - 31/07/2011 01:52:03 PM 2106 Views
you are correct - 31/07/2011 11:08:39 PM 1829 Views
Yup. - 31/07/2011 10:49:34 PM 1649 Views
But Shireen is a dragon... - 01/08/2011 12:22:16 AM 1838 Views
I'm uncertain about that - 01/08/2011 05:35:18 AM 1820 Views
True, but I wouldn't read too much into that. - 01/08/2011 11:42:29 PM 2079 Views
Where did he say that? - 02/08/2011 07:18:39 AM 1944 Views
In interviews - 02/08/2011 02:21:28 PM 1911 Views
A little thought about Jon... - 02/08/2011 08:02:34 AM 1978 Views
Excellent point. - 02/08/2011 02:22:22 PM 1892 Views
Am I the only one who thinks... - 09/08/2011 05:16:46 PM 1919 Views
I think Martin's gonna stick to Bran being the only one who does that - 10/08/2011 09:25:12 AM 1838 Views
Anyone have any thoughts as to the purpose of Arya's storyline? - 14/08/2011 06:28:09 PM 1829 Views
She's being trained as an assassin, so the question is who is she going to kill? - 16/08/2011 01:43:12 AM 1760 Views
Jon? - 18/08/2011 09:59:03 PM 1801 Views

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