Active Users:895 Time:23/02/2025 03:14:06 PM
Re: Having finished the book, my thoughts. (Spoilers) Zaphod Send a noteboard - 17/07/2011 01:02:10 AM


In my opinion, it becomes rather painfully obvious that the characters Martin was trying to serve by filling that gap (Brienne, Cersei, Jaime, Dorne, the Iron Islands, etc) simply weren't worthy of it and the price he paid by slowing Jon, Dany, Tyrion, Bran, and Arya down was too high.


Definitely agree with this sentiment. I read AFFC when it came out, 5 years after I read the rest of the series, and this year I reread all of them to get caught up for this one. Reading book 4 right after the first 3 really drove home to me how much worse it was. And book 5 had its problems as well, with some of the clunky writing and fillerish material, but it made me forget about that on the strength of its characters, namely Jon, Tyrion, Dany, Davos, Bran, Theon... all of those chapters were strong, and that's the bulk of the book. Compare that to AFFC and you've got Arya, Sansa of the original characters... Jaime's pretty good, but I liked him much better in book 3, in book 4 he just felt like he was spinning wheels... then you've got cartoon villain Cersei, pointless sidequest Brienne with sooo many chapters, the Dorne chapters that weren't worthwhile except the last page of the last one, the Iron Islands stuff that wasn't interesting except for a bit of Victarion... yeah. I can only hope that things come back together in the rest of the books because they're feeling pretty unravelled.
Reply to message
A Dance with Dragons discussion thread - 11/07/2011 10:48:23 PM 6325 Views
Okay, first impressions. Basically spoiler-free, I suppose. - 11/07/2011 11:40:31 PM 1870 Views
I have it! *NM* - 12/07/2011 05:42:27 AM 1001 Views
A general question to get the discussion started: will two more books be enough? - 12/07/2011 02:22:52 PM 2081 Views
A very good question *major spoilers, then* - 12/07/2011 02:55:05 PM 2057 Views
Oh, come on. If anyone can do it, Martin can. - 15/07/2011 03:48:27 AM 1750 Views
It'll be tight. - 12/07/2011 04:32:39 PM 2051 Views
No but I think 3 will be possible - 26/07/2011 03:15:02 AM 1873 Views
what is Purple Wedding? *NM* - 27/07/2011 08:37:04 AM 884 Views
Joffrey and Margaery wedding - 27/07/2011 04:26:04 PM 1899 Views
Hero of the book? - 12/07/2011 10:12:02 PM 2198 Views
Lord Manderly gets my vote. - 12/07/2011 10:41:19 PM 2003 Views
Re: Hero of the book? - 12/07/2011 10:43:20 PM 1863 Views
Re: Hero of the book? - 12/07/2011 11:50:29 PM 1860 Views
Ohh, so that was what that was about. - 17/07/2011 07:08:19 PM 1893 Views
That's what I thought too. - 25/07/2011 01:48:50 AM 1900 Views
Victorian Greyjoy = Hero of the book *NM* - 21/07/2011 06:20:25 AM 1054 Views
Asshole of the book? - 12/07/2011 10:46:10 PM 2067 Views
Agreed. - 12/07/2011 11:18:07 PM 2003 Views
Yeah, little doubt there. - 17/07/2011 07:09:53 PM 1847 Views
Seriously... - 18/07/2011 03:07:47 AM 1824 Views
Daenerys Targaryen & lifetime achievement award to Lord Rickard Stark - 17/08/2011 12:38:40 AM 1768 Views
Idiot of the book. - 12/07/2011 11:21:51 PM 2100 Views
lol yep, definitely *NM* - 13/07/2011 08:12:42 AM 987 Views
Re: Idiot of the book. - 17/07/2011 12:42:20 AM 1941 Views
Wait... no she doesn't! - 17/07/2011 01:29:52 AM 1872 Views
She thinks both - 18/07/2011 12:22:59 AM 1801 Views
So... - 17/07/2011 07:18:24 PM 1819 Views
No, it's him. - 18/07/2011 12:25:33 AM 1808 Views
Is there any hot sex scenes? I won't be able to read it for a while *NM* - 13/07/2011 02:35:49 PM 1079 Views
One or two, but not all that long ones *NM* - 13/07/2011 02:57:12 PM 1026 Views
Great Ending - 14/07/2011 01:21:53 AM 2106 Views
Really? - 14/07/2011 09:36:01 AM 2025 Views
Re: Really? - 14/07/2011 09:38:34 AM 1683 Views
Re: Great Ending - 18/07/2011 02:05:00 AM 1832 Views
YES! - 14/07/2011 02:38:48 AM 1667 Views
Sorry for the n00b reply, sentiments still apply - 16/07/2011 07:27:43 PM 1827 Views
Re: Sorry for the n00b reply, sentiments still apply - 17/07/2011 12:45:52 AM 1787 Views
I don't know what to think... (spoiler) - 14/07/2011 08:59:39 AM 2022 Views
Probably not. - 14/07/2011 09:19:03 AM 2010 Views
Re: Probably not. - 14/07/2011 03:57:55 PM 1847 Views
I think the two are mixed up. - 14/07/2011 11:23:06 PM 1927 Views
Re: I think the two are mixed up. - 18/07/2011 02:10:29 AM 1765 Views
What made least sense for me as far as that is concerned... - 14/07/2011 11:51:20 AM 1893 Views
They didn't. - 14/07/2011 11:24:53 PM 1942 Views
I see - 15/07/2011 08:28:09 AM 1853 Views
Didn't Jon just announced - 26/07/2011 02:51:07 AM 1816 Views
Something I totally missed first time through - 14/07/2011 09:40:33 AM 2219 Views
Re: Something I totally missed first time through - 16/07/2011 01:24:23 AM 2136 Views
Yep, that's what he said/thought - 17/07/2011 05:02:32 AM 1950 Views
Re: Something I totally missed first time through - 23/07/2011 04:14:38 PM 1801 Views
Well that brings new meaning - 26/07/2011 02:53:18 AM 1716 Views
I'm still not fully done, but about the Reek chapters... - 14/07/2011 04:05:29 PM 1940 Views
Agreed - 14/07/2011 06:18:15 PM 1958 Views
There's another... - 14/07/2011 07:16:11 PM 1756 Views
There's that... - 17/07/2011 01:12:33 AM 1817 Views
It's worse than that... - 17/07/2011 01:26:50 AM 1842 Views
Torture is wrong, and those chapters kinda proved it. *NM* - 26/07/2011 02:53:55 AM 981 Views
Having finished the book, my thoughts. (Spoilers) - 16/07/2011 08:11:30 AM 1950 Views
Re: Having finished the book, my thoughts. (Spoilers) - 17/07/2011 01:02:10 AM 1876 Views
You put words to my thoughts exactly. - 18/08/2011 09:17:09 PM 1798 Views
It should be re-titled A Jump with Sharks - 17/07/2011 06:00:37 PM 2000 Views
Publishers are more interested in the bottom line. - 18/07/2011 12:31:56 AM 1780 Views
Sadly, I am likely overestimating the intelligence of the readers. - 18/07/2011 03:05:12 AM 1997 Views
I felt bummed by Sanderson's new series. - 18/07/2011 05:25:09 AM 1847 Views
I bought that book but have yet to read it. - 18/07/2011 01:09:15 PM 1790 Views
Re: I bought that book but have yet to read it. - 20/07/2011 06:45:46 AM 1803 Views
You might like this quote from House of Leaves by Mark Z Danielewski. - 11/08/2011 03:42:05 PM 1885 Views
I'm afraid I have to agree with what seems to be the majority opinion... - 17/07/2011 07:35:47 PM 1938 Views
And on a different note entirely: is it me, or did the book need more proofreading? - 17/07/2011 07:39:15 PM 1831 Views
Yeah, I agree. - 18/07/2011 05:59:58 PM 1880 Views
The book really shows it is AFFC part 2 - 26/07/2011 03:00:07 AM 1851 Views
Am I The Only One In Love With Arya's Chapters? *spoilers maybe* - 18/07/2011 02:22:00 AM 1865 Views
I enjoyed them, very solid chapters. - 18/07/2011 12:50:43 PM 1895 Views
Unlike others, I won't start a separate thread to express my thoughts - 19/07/2011 11:21:17 AM 2012 Views
Yeah, I wished there was a way to move them in here! - 19/07/2011 01:42:51 PM 1752 Views
Me too... but going and complaining about them seems so lame, too. - 19/07/2011 07:34:47 PM 1764 Views
I agree with Jens, good balanced review. *NM* - 19/07/2011 07:50:13 PM 966 Views
I think you let him off too easily. - 20/07/2011 04:19:07 AM 1897 Views
Your review is a little too generous (in my opinion) - 20/07/2011 06:57:45 AM 2063 Views
I find myself both depressed and let down... - 20/07/2011 06:37:16 AM 2185 Views
Am I the only one who really likes... - 20/07/2011 06:04:00 PM 1959 Views
yeh, he is nice... *NM* - 20/07/2011 06:20:13 PM 954 Views
Davos is probably my favourite - 20/07/2011 09:51:03 PM 1671 Views
The six bodies fired by the trebuchet - 20/07/2011 10:36:16 PM 1858 Views
Yes, I was confused by that too. - 20/07/2011 10:53:35 PM 1781 Views
Probably pale mare victims. Seige warfare via plague - 20/07/2011 11:23:10 PM 1829 Views
Yes, I considered that as well... - 20/07/2011 11:48:32 PM 1797 Views
Have Quentyn's two mates already been sent off a this point? - 21/07/2011 02:03:15 PM 1850 Views
That could be it. *NM* - 21/07/2011 01:43:16 PM 876 Views
Stannis - 21/07/2011 08:43:40 AM 1805 Views
It's entirely possible Stannis was killed - 21/07/2011 02:09:10 PM 1895 Views
I highly doubt he's dead - 21/07/2011 07:29:59 PM 1842 Views
The bluff makes the most sense: if the Boltons beat Stannis, why does he ask for Theon & Jeyne? - 22/07/2011 12:01:30 AM 1907 Views
Yeah... - 22/07/2011 12:27:53 AM 1798 Views
The Aegon Twist. Something about this doesn't add up. - 21/07/2011 10:43:43 PM 1883 Views
Re: The Aegon Twist. Something about this doesn't add up. - 22/07/2011 05:42:13 PM 1978 Views
Alternatively.. - 22/07/2011 09:13:46 PM 1808 Views
Which gods do you think are "real" in Martin's world? - 22/07/2011 04:32:39 PM 1841 Views
None of them. - 22/07/2011 06:25:19 PM 1768 Views
Is that personal opinion or based on something Martin said? *NM* - 22/07/2011 06:37:57 PM 967 Views
Opinion - 22/07/2011 07:43:16 PM 1805 Views
I think there are some god's, just given different names. Same with the magic. - 22/07/2011 09:24:51 PM 1792 Views
Lose the apostrophe in the subject line. Then: on what basis do you assume this? - 23/07/2011 02:28:49 AM 1827 Views
You might want to stop wasting time correcting others typos. As for the gods... - 23/07/2011 04:53:59 AM 1708 Views
You might want to stop making them. Particularly glaring ones like that. - 23/07/2011 05:01:03 AM 1883 Views
A typo can't be "glaring"... - 23/07/2011 08:08:51 AM 1766 Views
Sure it can. Glaring: conspicuous or obvious. - 23/07/2011 03:52:57 PM 1778 Views
Morality stems from god? - 22/07/2011 10:47:59 PM 1778 Views
Of course it does - 23/07/2011 02:26:50 AM 1756 Views
On second thought, let's address the issue directly. - 23/07/2011 05:14:59 AM 1849 Views
Perhaps... - 24/07/2011 07:03:24 PM 1792 Views
Its simple... - 24/07/2011 07:37:11 PM 1778 Views
I disagree... - 25/07/2011 04:10:04 AM 1860 Views
Bullshit. - 25/07/2011 05:44:41 AM 1736 Views
Re: Bullshit. - 25/07/2011 06:27:09 AM 1643 Views
Some thoughts... - 25/07/2011 04:54:05 AM 1762 Views
It's not an objective morality. - 25/07/2011 05:41:33 AM 1750 Views
Its not that simple... - 25/07/2011 06:21:39 AM 1803 Views
I don't disagree with most of what you said. I just reach a different conclusion. - 25/07/2011 01:57:31 PM 1739 Views
Well... - 25/07/2011 05:02:45 PM 1749 Views
How then do you deal with the Euthyphro dilemma? - 16/08/2011 01:43:18 PM 1625 Views
Re: Which gods do you think are "real" in Martin's world? - 25/07/2011 02:24:07 PM 1687 Views
Whats the best new POV - 26/07/2011 03:14:05 AM 1804 Views
Barristan - 26/07/2011 12:23:20 PM 1764 Views
Didn't Aeron "Damphair" Greyjoy also only have 2 POVs - 26/07/2011 03:56:57 PM 1847 Views
Agreed. *NM* - 26/07/2011 11:33:11 PM 999 Views
thirded. - 27/07/2011 04:16:26 PM 1637 Views
Absolutely *NM* - 29/07/2011 02:31:54 AM 1044 Views
Things you missed till they were pointed out via others or via a reread - 26/07/2011 03:23:53 AM 1948 Views
A bit. - 26/07/2011 12:32:32 PM 1914 Views
- 26/07/2011 03:46:54 PM 1862 Views
Re: - 27/07/2011 12:43:43 AM 1791 Views
Martin doesn't have to do anything - 27/07/2011 01:33:36 AM 1881 Views
Re: Martin doesn't have to do anything - 27/07/2011 04:38:19 AM 1754 Views
Re: Martin doesn't have to do anything - 27/07/2011 08:58:55 AM 1684 Views
Re: - 27/07/2011 04:27:18 AM 1863 Views
I like your theory. - 27/07/2011 04:35:22 PM 1880 Views
Interesting... hadn't noticed some of those either. - 26/07/2011 11:32:18 PM 1876 Views
Re: Interesting... hadn't noticed some of those either. - 27/07/2011 02:00:42 AM 1770 Views
Eh? - 29/07/2011 04:44:17 PM 1879 Views
This is complicated. - 31/07/2011 10:43:15 PM 2087 Views
Wait...a woman crowned for beauty was the victorious mystery knight? - 01/08/2011 03:00:49 AM 1788 Views
It is believed the Knight of the Laughing Tree is one of two people - 01/08/2011 04:47:21 AM 1828 Views
Yup. - 02/08/2011 12:03:26 AM 1722 Views
Also... - 02/08/2011 07:17:43 AM 1817 Views
And yet, my huge brain figures it out - 04/08/2011 04:20:06 PM 1793 Views
I've read this scene yesterday and I missed this... - 02/08/2011 07:55:35 AM 1810 Views
Allow me - 05/08/2011 02:14:15 PM 1668 Views
thanks *NM* - 07/08/2011 07:28:21 AM 948 Views
I thought this was pretty clear - 07/08/2011 05:18:54 PM 1692 Views
Hizdahr a Harpy? Innocent or Not? - 26/07/2011 03:36:56 AM 2093 Views
Interesting idea. - 26/07/2011 12:25:11 PM 1893 Views
Re: Interesting idea. - 27/07/2011 04:25:02 PM 1813 Views
What is happening with the Maesters subplot? Any new leads? - 26/07/2011 04:13:27 PM 1807 Views
Re: What is happening with the Maesters subplot? Any new leads? - 27/07/2011 12:49:52 AM 2015 Views
Re: What is happening with the Maesters subplot? Any new leads? - 27/07/2011 03:49:18 AM 1917 Views
Re: A Dance with Dragons discussion thread - 29/07/2011 01:42:57 AM 1936 Views
Okay. I suck. - 29/07/2011 01:50:56 AM 1737 Views
Let me rephrase that... - 29/07/2011 01:54:07 AM 1715 Views
Jon Snow is definitely Azor Ahai. - 29/07/2011 07:31:17 PM 2321 Views
Hmm - 31/07/2011 01:52:03 PM 2090 Views
you are correct - 31/07/2011 11:08:39 PM 1818 Views
Yup. - 31/07/2011 10:49:34 PM 1636 Views
But Shireen is a dragon... - 01/08/2011 12:22:16 AM 1827 Views
I'm uncertain about that - 01/08/2011 05:35:18 AM 1806 Views
True, but I wouldn't read too much into that. - 01/08/2011 11:42:29 PM 2065 Views
Where did he say that? - 02/08/2011 07:18:39 AM 1932 Views
In interviews - 02/08/2011 02:21:28 PM 1899 Views
A little thought about Jon... - 02/08/2011 08:02:34 AM 1960 Views
Excellent point. - 02/08/2011 02:22:22 PM 1881 Views
Am I the only one who thinks... - 09/08/2011 05:16:46 PM 1902 Views
I think Martin's gonna stick to Bran being the only one who does that - 10/08/2011 09:25:12 AM 1823 Views
Anyone have any thoughts as to the purpose of Arya's storyline? - 14/08/2011 06:28:09 PM 1815 Views
She's being trained as an assassin, so the question is who is she going to kill? - 16/08/2011 01:43:12 AM 1746 Views
Jon? - 18/08/2011 09:59:03 PM 1786 Views

Reply to Message