Yes. Unless they were not yet hidden by the Fidelius Charm at that point. As I said, I don't have my books at hand. Does it state unequivocally that they were hidden by the charm when the letter was written?
Well, I checked, and its pretty much proved that they were indeed under the charm.
Dumbledore in the last part of DH:
You have guessed, I know, why the Cloak was in my possession
on the night your parents died. James had showed it to me just
a few days previously.
There. We know the Potters died about a week after the charm. The cloak left them a "few days" before their death. Now, it isn't certain that few days>around a week here, but it seems to be so.
Further, Lily says that Wormtail dropped by last weekend and looked down, which Harry immediately says must have been the last time he saw them, after which he betrayed them.
Plus (wow, never knew this tiny detail from book 1 could be so critical), we know that Harry was delivered to Petunia's house on a Tuesday night (When Mr. and Mrs. Durs ley woke up on the dull, grey Tuesday our story starts...). In the morning, word of the Potter's death was spreading, so the death must have been on Monday. The letter then had to have been written between the previous Sunday and the Sunday before their death. Since Lily says last weekend, rather than x number of days ago, this leads me to believe it was written between Thurday and Sunday. Either way, this is way less than one week before their death, meaning several things:
1) Since Lily says Bathilda visits often (with no indication of discontinuance), this means Bathilda must have been quite addled not to reveal that Sirius wasn't Secret Keeper.
2) Since well after the charm kicked into effect, James couldn't leave the house without the Invisibility Cloak, the theory that his family, and not his house, was the subject of the charm is completely disproved.
Because you have still not shown that they were hidden by the Charm at that point. I don't have the books here, and nothing of what you have quoted states that unequivocally.
Perhaps it might be better to hold off this discussion until we reach the relevant book.
See above. This book has suddenly become very relevant.
They could drop down to the post office? I thought they couldn't leave the house in your scenario.
If they left, they wouldn't be hidden. Just like outside of Grimmauld Plce, the Order isn't invisible.
See above. Also, that would be equally unproblematic if they were hidden, rather than their house. It contributes nothing to your argument if that were the case.
If they were hidden, how did they convince the people at the post office to give them anything? Or are you saying they sneaked in and took stuff?
Either way, turns out Petunia's vase was sent for Christmas, so that isn't a problem. Sirius's gift to Harry is, though. But since he was likely told by Pettigrew, maybe he could have an owl deliver?
That depends entirely on what they do for the Order. We are getting into the realm of unfounded speculation.
Oh come on! They fought Voldy four times and survived. Which means they were threatened. Which means they were seen, and which also means they moved their arses from Godric's Hollow (unless you want to claim they fought Voldemort at home 4 times). That's quite enough detail into what they did, and staying at home didn't come into it.
See, it is perfectly possible to use "destination" and "sight" figuratively. It proves nothing either way.
How was it used figuratively? He saw a building and said he had reached his destination. The meaning is quite clear and direct.
How could I read the whole paragraph when you didn't quote it until now? As I said initially, I do not have my books where I am.
Sorry, I didn't know that.
Yes. It still proves nothing, but it fits better with your version of events.
What will constitute proof for you? A statement from Voldemort that he meant the house, and four witnesses to attest to his honesty and sanity? We're discussing stuff from a novel here. All we can take is the meaning of the words in it. And it clearly states that Voldemort thought the house was his destination, and he says that since he can see it, the charm must be broken.
"Destination" could have been used on anything from the death of the child to whoknowswhat. It functions as a very wide metaphor when used figuratively.
But how is it figurative in this instance? I'm quite at a loss over your confusion here.
Because it is not conclusive. It is suggestive, but can be explained away.
Nope. See above on that. There's a plot hole here, pure and simple.
By that argument, they could have gone to Hogwarts and started killing children to force the Potters out. It is not an argument.
But Dumbledore was at Hogwarts. He wasn't at Godric's Hollow. Something being impossible at Hogwarts doesn't in any way mean it is impossible elsewhere.
Harry Potter Re-read: The Philosopher's Stone - Final section underway! (& next book plans)
12/07/2010 08:27:51 AM
- 3021 Views
Chapters 1-3: Introducing Harry
12/07/2010 08:28:49 AM
- 1598 Views
Characterisation *NM*
12/07/2010 08:29:02 AM
- 896 Views
My thoughts, such as they are.
12/07/2010 04:09:55 PM
- 1649 Views
Re: My thoughts, such as they are. *spoilers*
12/07/2010 07:43:49 PM
- 1605 Views
Writing style *NM*
12/07/2010 08:29:18 AM
- 882 Views
It is very clear it is a children's book at this time
12/07/2010 07:18:14 PM
- 1663 Views
Vernon's slow descent into madness is great.
13/07/2010 04:03:26 AM
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Re: Vernon's slow descent into madness is great.
13/07/2010 08:54:40 AM
- 1589 Views
Early themes *NM*
12/07/2010 08:29:37 AM
- 902 Views
Chapters 4-10: Making Friends at Hogwarts *NM*
12/07/2010 08:29:58 AM
- 829 Views
Impressions: thoughts about the school, the teachers, the enemies and the friends. *NM*
14/07/2010 08:29:38 AM
- 871 Views
I'd forgotten how annoying Hermione was
14/07/2010 01:48:13 PM
- 1509 Views
Yep. I like seeing her transformation in this story though.
14/07/2010 04:58:04 PM
- 1512 Views
Re: Yep. I like seeing her transformation in this story though.
14/07/2010 06:13:13 PM
- 1507 Views
Yes and, I think, this may be another candidate for early themes (from above)
14/07/2010 07:43:14 PM
- 1615 Views
Re: Impressions: thoughts about the school, the teachers, the enemies and the friends.
14/07/2010 04:22:54 PM
- 1649 Views
Agree. I loved the instant tension between Harry and Malfoy and with Harry and Snape too.
14/07/2010 05:03:20 PM
- 1776 Views
Some thoughts before I run off to the library again
14/07/2010 06:11:45 PM
- 1641 Views
It's interesting to look at the beginning of the story from Draco's point of view.
26/07/2010 03:08:38 PM
- 1724 Views
Re: It's interesting to look at the beginning of the story from Draco's point of view.
26/07/2010 03:18:02 PM
- 1386 Views
What about the magic?
14/07/2010 08:58:51 AM
- 1512 Views
The magic wasnt really developed at this point
14/07/2010 02:13:41 PM
- 1435 Views
Re: The magic wasnt really developed at this point
14/07/2010 08:53:08 PM
- 1679 Views
I think
14/07/2010 04:34:30 PM
- 1440 Views
Diagon Alley - Olivander's Foreshadowing
14/07/2010 05:11:40 PM
- 1725 Views
I really need a remembrall.
14/07/2010 08:57:10 PM
- 1583 Views
But it doesn't tell you what you've forgotten!
15/07/2010 02:51:47 AM
- 1723 Views
Chapters 11-17: Harry the Hero *NM*
12/07/2010 08:30:29 AM
- 843 Views
What'd you think of the ending? *NM*
15/07/2010 05:21:38 PM
- 808 Views
Two separate things:
15/07/2010 07:14:08 PM
- 1480 Views
Lovely
15/07/2010 09:00:11 PM
- 1565 Views
Haha
15/07/2010 09:16:16 PM
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Re: Haha
15/07/2010 09:24:06 PM
- 1534 Views
But I thought all girls were made of sugar and spice and everything nice?
15/07/2010 09:26:53 PM
- 1440 Views
Oh, we are.
15/07/2010 09:35:17 PM
- 1343 Views
Honestly, dumbledore is a bit of an ass...
15/07/2010 10:48:32 PM
- 1342 Views
The decades of manipulation of a child doesn't bother you, but the House Cup does? *NM*
15/07/2010 11:37:54 PM
- 783 Views
Overall thoughts for the book
12/07/2010 08:31:37 AM
- 1525 Views
Foreshadowing and setting up the future
12/07/2010 08:32:10 AM
- 1432 Views
Harry's anger management issues?
12/07/2010 07:14:58 PM
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Heh.
12/07/2010 07:40:40 PM
- 1542 Views
Nah, not deliberate.
12/07/2010 09:14:20 PM
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Re: Nah, not deliberate.
12/07/2010 09:55:32 PM
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I noticed a lot of this.
12/07/2010 07:22:54 PM
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Re: I noticed a lot of this.
12/07/2010 07:39:25 PM
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Re: I noticed a lot of this.
12/07/2010 07:45:32 PM
- 1543 Views
On Ginny:
12/07/2010 10:36:47 PM
- 1570 Views
This was my interpretation too and why I didn't pay much attention to it at the time. *NM*
13/07/2010 02:53:08 PM
- 742 Views
I've noticed a lot of the same things, probably because I've reread this book so many times...
13/07/2010 04:45:28 AM
- 1769 Views
Re: I've noticed a lot of the same things, probably because I've reread this book so many times...
13/07/2010 08:58:10 AM
- 1509 Views
So much (chapters 1-3) *spoilers*
12/07/2010 07:35:57 PM
- 1724 Views
I missed the school roof thing this time around too! Good catch there. *NM*
12/07/2010 09:22:21 PM
- 820 Views
The thing that tipped me off
12/07/2010 09:53:01 PM
- 1497 Views
Imagine how easy his test would have been if he remembered he'd done it as a child! *NM*
13/07/2010 03:20:27 PM
- 812 Views
You have to wonder why Hagrid and Dumbledore didn't suspect the truth about Sirius.
26/07/2010 04:04:05 PM
- 1429 Views
I re-read a couple weeks ago, and I was highly amused by all the little things she worked in
14/07/2010 04:09:19 AM
- 1571 Views
Some stuff (chapters 4-11)
14/07/2010 09:18:35 PM
- 1701 Views
Re: Some stuff (chapters 4-11)
14/07/2010 10:30:23 PM
- 1518 Views
I can answer your consistency question!
15/07/2010 02:35:42 AM
- 1626 Views
More stuff (chapters 12-17)
15/07/2010 08:55:34 PM
- 1380 Views
Tiny tiny inconsistency (?) in Ch. 12
17/07/2010 04:23:15 PM
- 1614 Views
What made this book (and the rest of the series) such a success?
12/07/2010 08:33:00 AM
- 1593 Views
I think it was mostly because it was a simple narrative with an identifiable protagnonist.
13/07/2010 11:59:06 PM
- 1603 Views
It has tons of things in it that every kid dreams of doing
14/07/2010 01:56:05 PM
- 1599 Views
It's a simple, well-done little book.
12/07/2010 07:46:48 PM
- 1589 Views
you don't read instructions, do you?
12/07/2010 07:49:24 PM
- 1637 Views
When did you pick up this book?
12/07/2010 11:30:46 PM
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I was 10.
13/07/2010 04:13:44 AM
- 1680 Views
Ah book orders...man you just brought back nostalgic memories. I miss being a kid
13/07/2010 04:42:12 AM
- 1729 Views
1999
13/07/2010 09:03:03 AM
- 1596 Views
What do you mean by adult version?
13/07/2010 02:15:40 PM
- 1707 Views
They started publishing copies with 'adult' covers so people wouldn't be caught out reading
13/07/2010 11:53:46 PM
- 1655 Views
Got a boxed set for Christmas when Order of the Phoenix came out in hardback.
13/07/2010 03:06:42 PM
- 1648 Views
The first five were out, waited for HBP.
14/07/2010 06:20:39 AM
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Very early. Beginning of 1999, so it had just come out in the States. *NM*
14/07/2010 08:54:06 AM
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I held out quite awhile because I don't like "fads"
14/07/2010 02:04:37 PM
- 1561 Views
I did the same thing.
15/07/2010 06:39:16 AM
- 1667 Views
I would have, if I had known there was hype. I know I would have.
15/07/2010 03:28:50 PM
- 1689 Views
Aged 13 or 14 - a while before the first movie (which was Christmas 2001). *NM*
26/07/2010 04:13:55 PM
- 981 Views
Jesus Christ.
26/07/2010 05:04:46 PM
- 1700 Views
^That was me. *NM*
26/07/2010 09:55:49 PM
- 979 Views
Aw. I was just feeling flattered as I didn't think Tor had read that many of my posts. *NM*
27/07/2010 12:15:52 AM
- 998 Views
Suggestions for the Re-read
12/07/2010 08:33:25 AM
- 1620 Views
This is my first official time participating and its been fun so far!
14/07/2010 05:16:48 PM
- 1563 Views
Unfortunately, no. (Silly me, pretending someone's still going to read all my posts... ) *NM*
26/07/2010 04:20:35 PM
- 998 Views
Inconsistencies Re: the Potter's death...
15/07/2010 05:16:45 AM
- 1957 Views
Because they were tricked? They considered Peter and Sirius to be brothers.
15/07/2010 07:05:27 AM
- 1611 Views
That's nonsense..
16/07/2010 01:08:40 AM
- 1525 Views
Take it up with Rowling, since you don't believe me. *NM*
16/07/2010 08:19:58 AM
- 897 Views
What's there to believe?
18/07/2010 06:03:13 AM
- 1616 Views
Peter + Sirius = family. I don't know how to explain it more simply. *NM*
18/07/2010 08:58:20 AM
- 1021 Views
Re: That's nonsense..
16/07/2010 09:37:59 AM
- 1733 Views
Also
16/07/2010 11:17:51 AM
- 1962 Views
Huh?
18/07/2010 05:57:58 AM
- 1536 Views
But Camilla explained it!
18/07/2010 09:27:55 AM
- 1856 Views
I'm fairly certain you guys have that totally wrong...
18/07/2010 05:42:18 PM
- 1552 Views
Re: I'm fairly certain you guys have that totally wrong...
18/07/2010 05:51:36 PM
- 1564 Views
Re: I'm fairly certain you guys have that totally wrong...
18/07/2010 06:17:04 PM
- 1871 Views
Re: I'm fairly certain you guys have that totally wrong...
18/07/2010 06:28:27 PM
- 1568 Views
That bothers me too.
18/07/2010 07:17:14 PM
- 1630 Views
Re: That bothers me too.
18/07/2010 07:20:44 PM
- 1481 Views
Again...
18/07/2010 07:35:10 PM
- 1803 Views
Re: Again...
18/07/2010 08:00:55 PM
- 1587 Views
Re: Again...
19/07/2010 06:33:13 AM
- 1785 Views
Re: Again...
20/07/2010 04:45:16 PM
- 1603 Views
Yet another load of bosh.
21/07/2010 01:00:14 AM
- 1591 Views
It was just the sort of things these two daredevils would do...
14/09/2010 12:11:20 AM
- 2036 Views
Re: It was just the sort of things these two daredevils would do...
14/09/2010 09:20:46 AM
- 1500 Views
You have to wonder if that's actually true.
26/07/2010 04:23:31 PM
- 1569 Views
Since Lily and James were unable to leave the house
18/07/2010 07:14:21 PM
- 1549 Views
Re: Since Lily and James were unable to leave the house
26/07/2010 05:07:48 PM
- 1884 Views
^ And this, too, was me.
26/07/2010 09:58:07 PM
- 1599 Views