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Re: Again... Camilla Send a noteboard - 18/07/2010 08:00:55 PM

That would hold true either way. No matter what the Secret was, it would have to be revealed to Bathilda. Whether they were invisible or their house. That was my point.

My main issue with that is that if Pettigrew had revealed their location to people, people must have known he was the Secret Keeper. THAT is odd. Because the whole "Serius was believed to be evil" bit hinges upon everyone thinking he was the Secret Keeper.

Pretty much. It can be so either way, but this is yet another plothole. Why didn't Bathilda come out and reveal who was the Secret Keeper who told her the location?


Yes. Unless they were not yet hidden by the Fidelius Charm at that point. As I said, I don't have my books at hand. Does it state unequivocally that they were hidden by the charm when the letter was written?

But the critical point, anyway, is that James is unable to go out of the house without his cloak. If he was the secret, he could have.

I see you've ignored this very important point. Again...


Because you have still not shown that they were hidden by the Charm at that point. I don't have the books here, and nothing of what you have quoted states that unequivocally.

Perhaps it might be better to hold off this discussion until we reach the relevant book.

And Petunia?

Knew their address. What's to say it wasn't held at the Godric's Hollow post office for the Potter's to collect?


They could drop down to the post office? I thought they couldn't leave the house in your scenario.

It doesn't matter whether Sirius or Petunia knew where to send the gift. The Postman/owl wouldn't be able to find the place to deliver them.

Like I said, it can easily be held at the post office for them.


See above. Also, that would be equally unproblematic if they were hidden, rather than their house. It contributes nothing to your argument if that were the case.

They can be active members of the Order and still be in hiding. There is no contradiction there. It is just about levels of hiding.

If James can't step out of the house without his cloak, and is chafing at being stuck at home, then he is quite clearly not active in the Order at the time.


That depends entirely on what they do for the Order. We are getting into the realm of unfounded speculation.

See, it is perfectly possible to use "destination" and "sight" figuratively. It proves nothing either way.

Since you clearly didn't read the whole paragraph...


How could I read the whole paragraph when you didn't quote it until now? As I said initially, I do not have my books where I am.

And along a new and darker street he moved, and now his destination was in sight at last, the Fidelius Charm broken, though they did not know it yet. . . . And he made less noise than the dead leaves slithering along the pavement as he drew level with the dark hedge, and stared over it. . . .

They had not drawn the curtains; he saw them quite clearly in their

little sitting room, the tall black-haired man in his glasses, making puffs of colored smoke erupt from his wand for the amusement of the small black-haired boy in his blue pajamas.

His sighting of the Potters comes after his sighting of the house, yet he makes the comment of the charm being broken when he sees the house.


Yes. It still proves nothing, but it fits better with your version of events.

And no one uses "destination" to mean people inside a house, instead of the house itself. Especially not when they can see the house and not the people and are referring to the destination when the house comes into view, but not the people.


"Destination" could have been used on anything from the death of the child to whoknowswhat. It functions as a very wide metaphor when used figuratively.

Nowhere does it say "house". Language is fiddly. It is all about interpretation.

It doesn't say house, but it quite clearly isn't the people, since they don't come into sight until after he slithers across the pavement and draws level with the hedge. If its not the house, and not the people, what is it? Yet another thing that was kept hidden from Voldemort? 8}

There is nothing conclusive above.

There was. The fact that James couldn't leave the house without an invisibility cloak. You conveniently ignored it.


Because it is not conclusive. It is suggestive, but can be explained away.

And of course it would matter. The Death Eaters would have no way of knowing whether they had chosen to stay in that house or move to another. They would have no way of verifying it either way, and Voldemort would need to KNOW that the one child that could threaten him was gone. For all they would have known, the Potters could have stayed in Hogwarts, with Sirius or under a bridge. They would also have had no way of knowing that they were in the house when it was blasted. The only way of making sure to kill the Potters would be to extinguish all life on Earth.

None of which means they wouldn't blast the house. Keeping the Potters on the run, causing random death and destruction at places they could be, all those would have been legitimate ways to bring them out in the open if they were the secret. Their location was, so blasting it wasn't an option. Anyway, Voldy proves conclusively that their house was the subject of the charm.


By that argument, they could have gone to Hogwarts and started killing children to force the Potters out. It is not an argument.
*MySmiley*
structured procrastinator
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Harry Potter Re-read: The Philosopher's Stone - Final section underway! (& next book plans) Rebekah - 12/07/2010 08:27:51 AM 3021 Views
Chapters 1-3: Introducing Harry Rebekah - 12/07/2010 08:28:49 AM 1599 Views
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Writing style *NM* Rebekah - 12/07/2010 08:29:18 AM 882 Views
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True. Rebekah - 12/07/2010 07:36:49 PM 1590 Views
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Yes and, I think, this may be another candidate for early themes (from above) StormCrow - 14/07/2010 07:43:14 PM 1616 Views
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On Ginny: Kronin al'Sulc - 12/07/2010 10:36:47 PM 1571 Views
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Re: Hm. Cockatiel of Doom - 13/07/2010 04:41:12 AM 1431 Views
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I re-read a couple weeks ago, and I was highly amused by all the little things she worked in nossy - 14/07/2010 04:09:19 AM 1572 Views
Some stuff (chapters 4-11) Camilla - 14/07/2010 09:18:35 PM 1702 Views
Re: Some stuff (chapters 4-11) Deadsy - 14/07/2010 10:30:23 PM 1519 Views
Re: Some stuff (chapters 4-11) Camilla - 14/07/2010 10:55:01 PM 1465 Views
Re: Some stuff (chapters 4-11) Deadsy - 14/07/2010 11:05:59 PM 1493 Views
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Ooh, yes. Cockatiel of Doom - 16/07/2010 12:19:13 AM 1325 Views
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Re: More stuff (chapters 12-17) Dark Knight - 15/07/2010 09:19:13 PM 1453 Views
Tiny tiny inconsistency (?) in Ch. 12 Cockatiel of Doom - 17/07/2010 04:23:15 PM 1614 Views
Re: Tiny tiny inconsistency (?) in Ch. 12 Camilla - 17/07/2010 04:28:04 PM 1492 Views
Re: Tiny tiny inconsistency (?) in Ch. 12 aria - 17/07/2010 07:12:39 PM 1741 Views
I like it. Thank you. Cockatiel of Doom - 20/07/2010 12:53:37 AM 1659 Views
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I have no idea *spoilers* Camilla - 12/07/2010 07:47:58 PM 1654 Views
I agree... StormCrow - 12/07/2010 09:19:59 PM 1683 Views
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Kid? Camilla - 14/07/2010 02:01:30 PM 1619 Views
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you don't read instructions, do you? Camilla - 12/07/2010 07:49:24 PM 1637 Views
Heh. Rebekah - 12/07/2010 07:50:23 PM 1581 Views
Re: Heh. Camilla - 12/07/2010 07:51:40 PM 1589 Views
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Wha? Nate - 12/07/2010 07:50:44 PM 1628 Views
Re: Wha? Camilla - 12/07/2010 07:52:21 PM 1615 Views
Pff. Nate - 12/07/2010 07:54:54 PM 1609 Views
*NM* Camilla - 12/07/2010 07:56:03 PM 1016 Views
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I was 10. Darth_Katie - 13/07/2010 04:13:44 AM 1681 Views
Ah book orders...man you just brought back nostalgic memories. I miss being a kid Dark Knight - 13/07/2010 04:42:12 AM 1729 Views
I was 16. Rebekah - 13/07/2010 08:24:02 AM 1606 Views
1999 Camilla - 13/07/2010 09:03:03 AM 1597 Views
What do you mean by adult version? aria - 13/07/2010 02:15:40 PM 1708 Views
Re: What do you mean by adult version? Camilla - 13/07/2010 02:17:40 PM 1585 Views
They started publishing copies with 'adult' covers so people wouldn't be caught out reading Chas - 13/07/2010 11:53:46 PM 1656 Views
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When Prisoner of Azkaban was a hardback. Elaine - 13/07/2010 02:23:57 PM 1597 Views
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Just before Goblet of Fire came out. nossy - 14/07/2010 04:04:21 AM 1633 Views
The first five were out, waited for HBP. Seriana Sedai - 14/07/2010 06:20:39 AM 1731 Views
You're making me want to talk about toadface Deadsy - 14/07/2010 02:06:25 PM 1647 Views
Sorry! Seriana Sedai - 15/07/2010 06:36:11 AM 1683 Views
Very early. Beginning of 1999, so it had just come out in the States. *NM* Ghavrel - 14/07/2010 08:54:06 AM 1003 Views
I held out quite awhile because I don't like "fads" Deadsy - 14/07/2010 02:04:37 PM 1562 Views
Lol! aria - 14/07/2010 08:54:47 PM 1682 Views
I did the same thing. Seriana Sedai - 15/07/2010 06:39:16 AM 1668 Views
Re: I did the same thing. Deadsy - 15/07/2010 10:01:04 AM 1855 Views
Re: I did the same thing. Seriana Sedai - 15/07/2010 05:44:28 PM 1725 Views
I would have, if I had known there was hype. I know I would have. nossy - 15/07/2010 03:28:50 PM 1690 Views
Seriana Sedai - 15/07/2010 05:47:01 PM 1747 Views
I think I was first! Monkey - 23/07/2010 07:05:08 PM 1693 Views
Aged 13 or 14 - a while before the first movie (which was Christmas 2001). *NM* Legolas - 26/07/2010 04:13:55 PM 982 Views
Jesus Christ. Tor - 26/07/2010 05:04:46 PM 1701 Views
^That was me. *NM* Camilla - 26/07/2010 09:55:49 PM 980 Views
I was going to ask if it was. *NM* Rebekah - 26/07/2010 10:04:59 PM 963 Views
Aw. I was just feeling flattered as I didn't think Tor had read that many of my posts. *NM* Legolas - 27/07/2010 12:15:52 AM 999 Views
Besides, you've met me, you should know how old I am. *NM* Legolas - 27/07/2010 12:16:23 AM 1040 Views
I am very bad at guessing age when I meet people in person Camilla - 27/07/2010 09:05:35 AM 2197 Views
Suggestions for the Re-read Rebekah - 12/07/2010 08:33:25 AM 1620 Views
I like it so far Camilla - 13/07/2010 10:16:49 AM 1638 Views
I can try that for the next book. Rebekah - 13/07/2010 11:21:01 PM 1615 Views
This is my first official time participating and its been fun so far! StormCrow - 14/07/2010 05:16:48 PM 1564 Views
Unfortunately, no. (Silly me, pretending someone's still going to read all my posts... ) *NM* Legolas - 26/07/2010 04:20:35 PM 999 Views
Can we get chapter discussions everyday? *NM* Dark Knight - 15/07/2010 06:40:30 PM 950 Views
Inconsistencies Re: the Potter's death... fionwe1987 - 15/07/2010 05:16:45 AM 1957 Views
Because they were tricked? They considered Peter and Sirius to be brothers. Ghavrel - 15/07/2010 07:05:27 AM 1612 Views
That's nonsense.. fionwe1987 - 16/07/2010 01:08:40 AM 1526 Views
Take it up with Rowling, since you don't believe me. *NM* Ghavrel - 16/07/2010 08:19:58 AM 897 Views
What's there to believe? fionwe1987 - 18/07/2010 06:03:13 AM 1616 Views
Peter + Sirius = family. I don't know how to explain it more simply. *NM* Ghavrel - 18/07/2010 08:58:20 AM 1022 Views
Re: That's nonsense.. eucatastrophe - 16/07/2010 09:37:59 AM 1734 Views
Also Camilla - 16/07/2010 11:17:51 AM 1963 Views
You are correct! There is no inconsistency eucatastrophe - 17/07/2010 04:17:35 AM 1656 Views
Huh? fionwe1987 - 18/07/2010 05:57:58 AM 1537 Views
But Camilla explained it! eucatastrophe - 18/07/2010 09:27:55 AM 1856 Views
Correction Camilla - 18/07/2010 10:58:59 AM 1642 Views
I'm fairly certain you guys have that totally wrong... fionwe1987 - 18/07/2010 05:42:18 PM 1552 Views
Re: I'm fairly certain you guys have that totally wrong... Camilla - 18/07/2010 05:51:36 PM 1565 Views
Re: I'm fairly certain you guys have that totally wrong... fionwe1987 - 18/07/2010 06:17:04 PM 1872 Views
Re: I'm fairly certain you guys have that totally wrong... Camilla - 18/07/2010 06:28:27 PM 1569 Views
That bothers me too. aria - 18/07/2010 07:17:14 PM 1631 Views
Re: That bothers me too. Camilla - 18/07/2010 07:20:44 PM 1481 Views
Yet... fionwe1987 - 18/07/2010 07:47:56 PM 1571 Views
Re: Yet... Camilla - 18/07/2010 08:02:31 PM 1613 Views
To quote Dumbledore... fionwe1987 - 19/07/2010 05:57:23 AM 1516 Views
Again... fionwe1987 - 18/07/2010 07:35:10 PM 1803 Views
Re: Again... Camilla - 18/07/2010 08:00:55 PM 1588 Views
Re: Again... fionwe1987 - 19/07/2010 06:33:13 AM 1785 Views
Re: Again... Camilla - 20/07/2010 04:45:16 PM 1604 Views
Yet another load of bosh. fionwe1987 - 21/07/2010 01:00:14 AM 1591 Views
Then let's leave it. Camilla - 21/07/2010 06:48:45 AM 1690 Views
Re: Then let's leave it. fionwe1987 - 21/07/2010 04:19:35 PM 1615 Views
My two cents Seriana Sedai - 19/07/2010 06:11:30 AM 1663 Views
It was just the sort of things these two daredevils would do... DomA - 14/09/2010 12:11:20 AM 2037 Views
Re: It was just the sort of things these two daredevils would do... Camilla - 14/09/2010 09:20:46 AM 1501 Views
You have to wonder if that's actually true. Legolas - 26/07/2010 04:23:31 PM 1570 Views
Re: You have to wonder if that's actually true. Tor - 26/07/2010 05:06:43 PM 1685 Views
I don't know that I'd call it "see through Pettigrew"... Legolas - 26/07/2010 06:22:19 PM 1593 Views
^That was me, too. Oh, dear. Camilla - 26/07/2010 09:56:43 PM 1764 Views
Since Lily and James were unable to leave the house aria - 18/07/2010 07:14:21 PM 1550 Views
Re: Since Lily and James were unable to leave the house Tor - 26/07/2010 05:07:48 PM 1885 Views
^ And this, too, was me. Camilla - 26/07/2010 09:58:07 PM 1600 Views
Re: ^ And this, too, was me. Rebekah - 26/07/2010 10:05:41 PM 1536 Views
Camilla - 26/07/2010 10:07:36 PM 1416 Views
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