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Re: Heretics of Dune (2001 initial read; 2010 re-read) DomA Send a noteboard - 29/04/2010 03:26:28 PM
wonder if Heretics of Dune was indeed conceived as the opener of a trilogy, as it had the feel of setting up situations and the chief participants more than it did as something that could be read semi-independently of the other novels.


It was the opener to a trilogy from the get go.

The "original" Dune was a duology, before it was decided to make Dune Messiah a book in itself and not last part of Dune.

Herbert much later decided to return to the Dune world with God-Emperor, which was a stand-alone in his mind (it became a bridge book onkly after the fact).

He decided later to tell the story of the result to Leto's plans, and that he did conceive of as a trilogy from the start, with the two first volumes published and the third one (which remains open ended in the Dune style, but less so than previous ones) outlined.

If you don't have the patience to suffer through the awfully written two-volumes Dune 7 by KJA-BH to dig up in the dross the concepts and ideas Herbert intended to explore through the ending (they are quite apparent still, especially after having read the other books so recently, though they aren't developped with anything near the intelligence of Frank), just ask and I'll tell you about what I remember. You read so fast that I almost recommend you pick the books, though. I found the ideas interesting enough, even if as novels this is real garbage.

Whatever you do, don't read the prequels, and definitely don't read them first. KJA-BH liberally stole from the outline of Dune 7 to "set things up", and setting things up in their mind was spoiling everything by extending every good idea into elaborate and boring storylines set thousands of years before., as they believed Frank's outline for Dune 7 was "too complex" and required much backstory (which was plainly wrong: Frank would have managed to include everyhting and make everything clear within a 300 or 400 pages book, but he just didn't spoon feed his readers as if they were dumb the way KJA does) What they achieved is that every idea in Dune 7 feels quite stale and predictable once you get there (and I don't mean it spoil the plot, I mean the way they bring them up through the prequels in a very b;ah and pedestrian way sort of ruin the ideas themselves...)
This message last edited by DomA on 29/04/2010 at 03:32:20 PM
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Frank Herbert, Dune Chronicles (series reviews within) - 16/04/2010 04:11:40 AM 1931 Views
Re: Frank Herbert, Dune - 16/04/2010 06:09:49 PM 1046 Views
Re: Frank Herbert, Dune - 17/04/2010 12:08:06 AM 1237 Views
Re: Frank Herbert, Dune - 17/04/2010 02:33:38 PM 1164 Views
I was using a fairly precise term when I said "ecological" - 18/04/2010 12:13:14 AM 1166 Views
Re: I was using a fairly precise term when I said "ecological" - 18/04/2010 03:34:33 AM 1214 Views
Please read linked interview...as I call bullshit. Also, why are your walls white? - 18/04/2010 05:18:07 AM 1022 Views
Re: Please read linked interview...as I call bullshit. Also, why are your walls white? - 19/04/2010 06:15:26 PM 1054 Views
That was most of my issue. - 21/04/2010 12:12:56 AM 916 Views
Re: That was most of my issue. - 21/04/2010 06:33:14 PM 891 Views
Re: That was most of my issue. - 29/04/2010 11:38:26 PM 884 Views
Just because something plays a dominate role doesn't make it a theme - 21/04/2010 02:09:42 PM 1016 Views
A theme is merely a dominant strain in a story; there can be more than one theme present - 21/04/2010 11:21:38 PM 947 Views
Re: A theme is merely a dominant strain in a story; there can be more than one theme present - 22/04/2010 04:58:01 AM 928 Views
Good points - 22/04/2010 09:19:45 PM 964 Views
Re: Good points - 22/04/2010 10:55:21 PM 913 Views
when you call it human ecology I come much closer to agreeing - 22/04/2010 02:16:58 PM 944 Views
Not really sure how Larry's definition is archaic. - 19/04/2010 07:52:27 PM 1047 Views
Re: Not really sure how Larry's definition is archaic. - 20/04/2010 07:04:40 PM 899 Views
You're not using "archaic" correctly - 20/04/2010 10:07:31 PM 909 Views
Your patronizing manner aside, that's not "archaic" at all. - 21/04/2010 01:46:50 AM 795 Views
doesn't that regulate the point down to interesting trivia? - 21/04/2010 02:36:38 PM 950 Views
Re: Your patronizing manner aside, that's not "archaic" at all. - 21/04/2010 06:23:24 PM 1023 Views
Funny the things people focus on - 21/04/2010 11:24:59 PM 919 Views
Re: Funny the things people focus on - 23/04/2010 05:28:54 PM 923 Views
People who see this as an ecological book are missing the point of the book - 16/04/2010 06:28:40 PM 1399 Views
Books can have more than one theme. Great books almost always do. *NM* - 16/04/2010 07:15:11 PM 457 Views
I agree with that I just never really the ecological theme to Dune - 16/04/2010 10:12:26 PM 1109 Views
Ecology goes more than one way - 17/04/2010 12:12:45 AM 1062 Views
There are several points to the book/series - 17/04/2010 12:11:38 AM 1127 Views
Everyone get something different from a book - 19/04/2010 07:01:51 PM 1317 Views
I believe those themes become more pronounced later in the series - 20/04/2010 10:09:36 PM 1067 Views
I remember having hated every single character of this book. Some random thoughts - 17/04/2010 05:08:25 PM 1259 Views
I hope you got to Darwi Odrade - 21/04/2010 03:44:27 PM 943 Views
Re: Frank Herbert, Dune - 17/04/2010 08:05:16 PM 1510 Views
I guess we'll have a few disagreements here, Dom - 17/04/2010 10:22:27 PM 1312 Views
Re: I guess we'll have a few disagreements here, Dom - 18/04/2010 04:38:10 AM 1264 Views
Re: I guess we'll have a few disagreements here, Dom - 19/04/2010 04:04:43 AM 1195 Views
Re: I guess we'll have a few disagreements here, Dom - 22/04/2010 04:31:26 AM 945 Views
I thought all of Dune had begun as a serial in a SF magazine. *NM* - 22/04/2010 01:58:22 PM 400 Views
And Dune Messiah as well was serialized at first, in Galaxy *NM* - 22/04/2010 09:31:54 PM 405 Views
Dune Messiah (2001 initial read; 2010 re-read) - 19/04/2010 08:42:18 AM 1162 Views
Re: Dune Messiah (2001 initial read; 2010 re-read) - 21/04/2010 03:33:46 PM 896 Views
I didn't see that in Alia - 21/04/2010 11:27:22 PM 845 Views
One of my favorite series! - 21/04/2010 03:30:57 PM 847 Views
I didn't "miss it" as much as I chose to deemphasize it - 21/04/2010 11:29:50 PM 762 Views
Re: I didn't "miss it" as much as I chose to deemphasize it - 22/04/2010 04:02:26 PM 886 Views
His style doesn't appeal to me as much, unfortunately - 22/04/2010 09:17:21 PM 769 Views
You might want to track down his short stories one day... - 23/04/2010 02:06:09 PM 997 Views
Children of Dune (2001 initial read; 2010 re-read) - 22/04/2010 06:47:04 AM 965 Views
See...I think I made a mistake in my reading of Dune - 22/04/2010 07:26:28 AM 944 Views
Depends - 22/04/2010 08:01:39 AM 852 Views
Re: Depends - 22/04/2010 11:12:15 PM 1113 Views
read something else - 23/04/2010 07:49:34 PM 839 Views
LA Times article on Dune (4/18/2010) - 23/04/2010 10:59:00 AM 796 Views
God Emperor of Dune (2001 initial read; 2010 re-read) - 25/04/2010 02:03:37 AM 1064 Views
Heretics of Dune (2001 initial read; 2010 re-read) - 28/04/2010 06:02:54 AM 810 Views
Re: Heretics of Dune (2001 initial read; 2010 re-read) - 29/04/2010 03:26:28 PM 885 Views
I read the wiki synopses of those two books - 29/04/2010 09:44:07 PM 846 Views
Re: I read the wiki synopses of those two books - 10/05/2010 04:10:49 AM 1188 Views
Chapterhouse: Dune (2001 initial read; 2010 re-read) - 30/04/2010 02:31:10 PM 997 Views
Re: Chapterhouse: Dune (2001 initial read; 2010 re-read) - 10/05/2010 01:24:33 AM 1035 Views

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