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At least I am not as quick to repeat the same excuses Larry Send a noteboard - 26/04/2010 05:13:08 PM
It is always appreciated when you criticize my approach and intention based on the vast insight into my life and plans that you obviously have. I appreciate that you hold that only your model is the successful one when it comes to topical or book club type discussion. I understand that you hold it that only you, or any other organizer, can possibly ask poignant questions or open sub-threads about plot points or thematic developments. Thank you for disabusing me of the opinion that if someone reads something they might have an opinion or questions of their own.


Considering that your response was, shall we say, a bit "out of character" for you, in as much as you usually don't open talk about the need to stop "holding hands," perhaps my response was actually a bit understated compared to what I felt when I originally read it?

Here are some takeaway points for you, Larry. If you don't want to be accusatory, don't write a post the is simply a lecture about how poorly I am doing my 'job'. If you don't want to be insulting, you can try NBing personal suggestions directly to me. If you don't want to be condescending, you can stop holding up every MB interaction and event to the perfect model of how you would do it, regardless of how far from fact that ever was in the past.


To be honest, I am now more concerned about you making yet another round of excuses. After all, there are several things that you have pretty much promised me that you would have done...over a year ago. I just had to place an order for a replacement for one book in particular, since I had given up hope that you would ever review it or that I would ever get it back. Sure, you have had things come up. So have I, things I still won't share with any. But I also learned that sometimes it's best to just admit to myself when I cannot do something and to not make promises that I cannot keep.

As for this being "public," like I said above, sometimes when someone wants to talk about "hand-holding" in such a tone, perhaps that person can deal with a public rebuke. But since the point behind the barb appears to be lost in the anger, I'll give free rein to it now and ask, publicly, when are you going to fulfill certain promises made?

A better idea might have been to ask if or what my exact plans for the discussion, or a book club event in general might be. It is possible, though you obviously disagree, to take different approaches for how a book club event can progress.


I'm well aware of that. I'm also aware that you procrastinate more around here with each passing year and that my patience, little as it is, has become exhausted recently. As for the book club idea, I would imagine that moderators tend to do well when they actually moderate. If they can't do that, perhaps they should just step aside until they can do so?

Take my plan here for instance. Pick a sci-fi book that has some deeper elements than simple sci-fi entertainment. Advertise the book to get people to read it, and set a date for a discussion. Open the discussion with some general questions to kick start responses and participant initiated conversations. During the second week, post my review/response of the work; follow up with participant posts/conversations, respond to/or initiate deeper element conversations.


And did you really do this?

I thought that I would try this approach to see if/how it might affect participation and the general willingness to continue in conversation. It would allow people the ability to initiate conversation if they wanted. It would allow more surface level conversation, and better participation up front, and then attempt to delve deeper with greater participation. As a side bonus, it would also fit into my schedule.

Obviously, thanks to your ever so humble and knowledgeable rebuke of my abilities and my approach, I know that such things just won't work.


Nice to see what comes out in anger. And by the way, a month's delay is quite ridiculous.
Illusions fall like the husk of a fruit, one after another, and the fruit is experience. - Narrator, Sylvie

Je suis méchant.
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Sci-Fi Book Club: SOLARIS by Stanislaw Lem - 19/04/2010 05:50:45 PM 1891 Views
Roll-Call: Have you read it? Are you reading it? Like it: Yes/NO? *NM* - 19/04/2010 05:52:00 PM 660 Views
I read it back in January. - 19/04/2010 06:23:29 PM 1191 Views
I read it years ago, and liked it. *NM* - 19/04/2010 06:41:36 PM 628 Views
I just finished it. - 19/04/2010 06:54:49 PM 1141 Views
Well, to be fair, - 20/04/2010 08:12:17 PM 1086 Views
Heh. - 21/04/2010 08:31:51 AM 1309 Views
Re: Well, to be fair, - 12/05/2010 09:06:06 PM 1052 Views
That was how I felt too. - 20/04/2010 11:39:15 PM 908 Views
I read it 3 years ago, and liked it. - 19/04/2010 06:58:37 PM 1392 Views
I read it, and liked it. - 19/04/2010 07:33:16 PM 1174 Views
I plan to - 19/04/2010 07:41:21 PM 1283 Views
I might re-read it in a few days - 19/04/2010 09:11:35 PM 1097 Views
I'm currently reading it - 20/04/2010 10:00:05 AM 1353 Views
That has always bothered me too. - 20/04/2010 08:20:56 PM 979 Views
Indeed - 11/05/2010 03:02:26 PM 1022 Views
It was a while since I've read it - 22/04/2010 05:33:44 AM 991 Views
I have started reading it - 11/05/2010 11:10:53 AM 943 Views
Translation: - 19/04/2010 05:54:57 PM 1239 Views
I read it in Russian, which was very close to the original. - 19/04/2010 06:25:00 PM 1219 Views
I'm not sure now, I think I read it in Dutch. - 19/04/2010 06:43:30 PM 1142 Views
English translation by Joanna Kilmartin and Steve Cox (1970). - 19/04/2010 06:56:54 PM 1107 Views
Translation of a translation, actually. *NM* - 19/04/2010 07:22:18 PM 598 Views
Yes, I did read Jake's intro piece there. *NM* - 19/04/2010 07:23:44 PM 602 Views
I figured you were not accurate enough. - 19/04/2010 07:26:54 PM 1091 Views
Pffft. Accuracy is for nerds. - 19/04/2010 07:31:52 PM 1177 Views
That was the one I read. - 20/04/2010 01:43:01 AM 1306 Views
I read it in Czech - 19/04/2010 07:40:05 PM 1355 Views
I also read a Swedish translation. - 19/04/2010 07:41:31 PM 1463 Views
1970 translation from French to English by Joanna Kilmartin and Steve Cox - 20/04/2010 02:20:42 AM 1207 Views
I have a different opinion on this. - 20/04/2010 08:17:06 PM 1109 Views
I've read it in Polish - 22/04/2010 05:32:33 AM 939 Views
Re: So it's flat and boring? - 23/04/2010 09:50:38 PM 1068 Views
Re: Does anyone know why the Polish publishers haven't commissioned another translation? - 24/04/2010 10:04:38 AM 1065 Views
Rights issues, I beieve - 24/04/2010 10:48:53 AM 1109 Views
So 'we' have read the novel in 6 different languages. - 27/04/2010 09:20:02 PM 952 Views
I read the English from French translation - 12/05/2010 09:10:42 PM 923 Views
This was my general experience as well. - 17/05/2010 06:53:58 PM 975 Views
I probably got more out of it than I first thought. - 20/04/2010 11:37:52 PM 913 Views
Re: I do that too! - 23/04/2010 09:51:39 PM 943 Views
It is certainly a book that makes you think... - 26/04/2010 09:46:31 PM 967 Views
Literature vs. Genre Fiction - 21/04/2010 02:33:21 PM 1142 Views
Re: Literature vs. Genre Fiction - 21/04/2010 08:44:24 PM 1101 Views
Re: Literature vs. Genre Fiction - 12/05/2010 09:19:31 PM 973 Views
Re: - 21/04/2010 09:09:02 PM 1037 Views
How do you know Solaris was an advanced intelligence? - 22/04/2010 01:20:35 AM 969 Views
Fair enough. - 22/04/2010 09:04:58 PM 1030 Views
But I think that is Lem's point. - 23/04/2010 03:20:18 AM 1050 Views
Good point Tom. - 23/04/2010 03:14:23 AM 942 Views
It's definitely literature - 22/04/2010 01:19:34 AM 903 Views
You might be winning me over to your thoughts here. - 26/04/2010 09:42:33 PM 894 Views
As long as you realize... - 26/04/2010 10:26:00 PM 933 Views
This is why I sort of float around on this issue. - 27/04/2010 05:49:39 PM 980 Views
Re: This is why I sort of float around on this issue. - 13/05/2010 10:15:38 AM 1008 Views
Very well put. - 17/05/2010 06:51:27 PM 922 Views
Re: Very well put. - 17/05/2010 06:53:13 PM 1020 Views
This book is definitely literature. - 23/04/2010 02:59:48 AM 1046 Views
Re: This discussion gives me hives. *NM* - 23/04/2010 09:52:09 PM 553 Views
Understandable. - 26/04/2010 07:31:08 PM 910 Views
Hmmm - 12/05/2010 09:18:42 PM 1010 Views
What didn't you enjoy? - 21/04/2010 09:47:06 PM 909 Views
I didn't like the excessive description of the types of clouds on Solaris. - 22/04/2010 01:17:22 AM 881 Views
This was what I disliked too - 22/04/2010 05:46:05 AM 1098 Views
Re: I didn't like the excessive description of the types of clouds on Solaris. - 23/04/2010 03:33:14 AM 961 Views
Re: I found it made this stark contrast with his descriptions of his own, more human environment. - 24/04/2010 09:56:40 AM 1162 Views
That is an interesting take. - 27/04/2010 05:53:23 PM 1011 Views
I didn't really find anything difficult about it. - 23/04/2010 03:38:48 AM 987 Views
The only thing that bothered me... - 03/05/2010 07:06:42 PM 1132 Views
So, is there really anything to discuss about the story itself? - 22/04/2010 08:55:03 AM 1086 Views
Apparently not. - 22/04/2010 01:38:24 PM 1136 Views
True - 22/04/2010 09:29:53 PM 960 Views
Point of fact, - 23/04/2010 02:53:47 PM 1008 Views
Perhaps it's time for a self-reevaluation then - 24/04/2010 10:45:44 AM 1335 Views
Thank you for telling me how I should prioritize my life, Larry. - 26/04/2010 04:54:01 PM 1140 Views
At least I am not as quick to repeat the same excuses - 26/04/2010 05:13:08 PM 1288 Views
I was originally gonna reply to your previous post, then decided not to. Guess I will now. - 26/04/2010 05:42:15 PM 1131 Views
Thank you. - 26/04/2010 07:41:17 PM 1089 Views
One point... - 26/04/2010 07:34:02 PM 980 Views
Posting while irritated and about to crash does little good, it seems - 27/04/2010 06:20:19 PM 1056 Views
The delay to the review is my fault. I've got a mostly finished one. I'm just not happy with it. - 27/04/2010 07:19:35 PM 1028 Views
It wasn't the review I was irritated about, but thanks for doing it - 27/04/2010 07:39:08 PM 927 Views
Ah. OK. - 27/04/2010 07:47:09 PM 1084 Views
Thanks - 27/04/2010 07:58:54 PM 979 Views
I'm a bit ambivalent on the merits of this approach of yours. - 26/04/2010 05:32:19 PM 921 Views
You highlight my only frustration with the thread. - 26/04/2010 05:48:01 PM 1255 Views
Re: So what do you think about any of those things? - 23/04/2010 08:30:55 PM 949 Views
A question about Lem. - 23/04/2010 03:49:57 AM 1007 Views
I've only read one other book by him, The Cyberiad - 23/04/2010 04:03:19 AM 1083 Views
Re: A question about Lem. - 23/04/2010 07:26:18 PM 1064 Views
Thanks. - 24/04/2010 06:42:05 AM 1095 Views
Yes - 24/04/2010 02:43:17 PM 1047 Views
My main thoughts on Solaris by Stanislaw Lem - 23/04/2010 02:50:10 AM 1317 Views
Re: About that "worst" thoughts issue. - 23/04/2010 09:49:04 PM 1210 Views
Re: About that "worst" thoughts issue. - 12/05/2010 09:35:48 PM 1102 Views
I came away with the same message you did on the first point. - 25/04/2010 04:46:09 PM 947 Views
Re: My main thoughts on Solaris by Stanislaw Lem - 12/05/2010 09:31:32 PM 1104 Views
Re: So I have no team spirit and should be lynched. - 23/04/2010 09:41:48 PM 939 Views
I finally watched Avatar for the first time tonight. - 25/04/2010 04:27:34 AM 937 Views
Solaris was, I hope, better than Avatar. - 25/04/2010 04:54:12 AM 901 Views
Misplaced answer . *NM* - 25/04/2010 04:40:27 PM 473 Views
On identity and communication: do we love only ourselves? - 25/04/2010 03:35:34 PM 986 Views
The argument: (From the text and some thoughts) - 27/04/2010 06:22:34 PM 920 Views
Yes - 12/05/2010 10:10:30 PM 1077 Views
That is a great idea... - 17/05/2010 06:58:48 PM 1023 Views
Re: That is a great idea... - 17/05/2010 07:02:44 PM 1023 Views
That settles it. I am going to have to reread it. - 13/05/2010 12:23:14 AM 963 Views
It is interesting you should say that. - 12/05/2010 09:56:26 PM 1208 Views
That is the second time this week that I have heard something about Derrida. Now I am going to have - 13/05/2010 12:02:56 AM 1065 Views
Derrida is great. - 13/05/2010 10:06:49 AM 1077 Views
Is Solaris alive? Is Solaris sentient? - 25/04/2010 03:40:57 PM 958 Views
I can't decide. - 25/04/2010 03:54:39 PM 1106 Views
An interesting point to consider... - 25/04/2010 10:41:17 PM 1107 Views
Re: I can't decide. - 12/05/2010 10:05:21 PM 912 Views
Re: Is Solaris alive? Is Solaris sentient? - 25/04/2010 10:31:58 PM 1081 Views
Ooohhhh. I like that theory. - 25/04/2010 11:32:15 PM 1076 Views
Does it make a difference? - 26/04/2010 07:29:44 PM 924 Views
Re: Is Solaris alive? Is Solaris sentient? - 12/05/2010 09:57:05 PM 1054 Views
What do you think the biggest message of the book is? - 25/04/2010 03:47:03 PM 1021 Views
Re: Does he let go of her? How independant is she of him? - 25/04/2010 04:07:33 PM 1062 Views
That's an interesting observation. - 26/04/2010 10:23:28 PM 951 Views
Re: I was telling Tashmere... - 11/05/2010 11:05:09 AM 1084 Views
Re: What do you think the biggest message of the book is? - 25/04/2010 10:16:16 PM 1002 Views
Communication with the entirely other - 12/05/2010 10:01:37 PM 1035 Views
Did anyone else do any wondering what their own visitors would take the form of if they were there? - 26/04/2010 11:31:27 PM 944 Views
Actually, no. It was obvious to me. *NM* - 26/04/2010 11:41:22 PM 455 Views
In a way yes. - 27/04/2010 06:33:43 PM 1027 Views
My father, perhaps. - 27/04/2010 08:55:18 PM 936 Views
Ha. - 27/04/2010 09:16:56 PM 957 Views

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